Player Discussion Who stays? Who goes? (Keep 2 Only)

[Canucks LB]

Out of these players, who do you keep, who do you let go!

(assuming Myers stays, And Blueger is cheap)

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[Baby Pettersson]

Hronek and Zadorov.

Hopefully no more than 12M for them both.

 

[Bertuzzzi44]

1. Zadorov
2. Lindholm
3. Joshua

4. Hronek

Move Hronek, use his cap space to solidify the top 9.

 

[Reverend Mayhem]

I like him 2nd best but Zadorov is primed to make an insane contract. Joshua will command less and he is the most realistic option listed that could build off of the previous year.

 

[Tact]

Keep Lindholm, Zadorov and Hronek

Let Joshua walk

 

[Canucks LB]

Hronek and Zadorov.

Hopefully no more than 12M for them both.

So you wanna run it back basically, because I don’t know how we’re gonna afford, myers hronek zadorov and somehow find a legit top six winger?

I’m curious your thoughts?

 

[racerjoe]

Whats the contracts? That matters as much as anything...

 

[Frankie Blueberries]

Whats the contracts? That matters as much as anything...

Just spitballing but I would think:

Hronek - $7.25 - $7.5 x 7 years
Lindholm - $7-7.5 x 7 years
Zadorov - $5-5.5 x 6 years
Joshua - $3.75-$4.25 x 4 years

 

[Baby Pettersson]

So you wanna run it back basically, because I don’t know how we’re gonna afford, myers hronek zadorov and somehow find a legit top six winger?

I’m curious your thoughts?

My thoughts are if you sign any two you're basically running it back. Out of those 4 if I had to pick 2 i chose my 2 favorite players on that list.

 

[sting101]

This is a chart for player pay and production scales 2023/24 for forwards

1 = 8.5m+ (76pts+)
2 = 8.5m - 7.1m (75 - 67)
3 = 7.1m - 5.8m (67 - 57)
4 = 5.8m - 5.13m (57 - 47)
5 = 5.13m - 4.5m (47 - 41)
6 = 4.5m - 3.4m (41 - 36)
7 = 3.4m - 2.75m (36 - 32)
8 = 2.75m - 2m (32 - 28)
9 = 2m - 1.5m (28 - 23)
10 = 1.5m - 1.1m (23 - 19)

Current roster and approx efficiency........24/25

1 - Miller 103 (+ 3m)
1 - Pettersson 89 (+ 2.4m) .......neutral 24/25
2 - Boeser 73 (+ 1.3m)
4/5 - Garland 47 (+ 200k)
5 - Lindholm 44 (+ 400k)........negative 1.5 -3million 24/25+
6/7 - Hoglander 36 (+ 2.3m)
7 - Joshua 32 (+ 3m)...............neutral to positive
8 - Mikhayev 31 (- 2.1m)
8 - Suter 29 (+ 1.2m)
8/9 - Blueger 28 (+ 400k)........neutral to positive
10 - Lafferty 24 (+ 400k).........neutral to negative

Needs:
* Efficiency in the market as Pettersson and his positive value is gone and so will
Boeser Hoglander and Suter's by the end of 24/25 and 2 million for OEL plus likely drop in play from Miller.
* Top6 to play PP1 and with Pettersson. (best case he is fast enough to help PP1 set up)
* Speed and PF capabilities within 5-10F

Conclusion:
* Lindholm - is cost inefficiency immediately. He was a #5 with 44 pts this year and will want 7.8-8 million. Likely is 1.5-2m in negative value starting next season for us and will get worse slower and eventually be an anchor. No Thanks unless they think he is the final piece and they can win in the next 2-3yrs or trade him
* Joshua - at approx 3 million fills a need and should be neutral to positive value. You sign him and that is a win.
* Blueger at 1.5-1.8 is also a no brainer

Defense:

* Zadorov - If you can get Dillon at 3 million vs 5.5 that's 2.5 we can use to get a forward without much to any set back. Love big Z but have to be convinced he's worth the investment.
* Hronek - 4yrs at 6.5 - 7 million and it's a no brainer. Not a great 2nd half and playoffs but Hughes being a Norris winner and the way that pairing caved teams you have to bring that back unless you use him to get a impact forward and can get a topUFA RD. Seems dubious with how many holes we need to fill to gamble like that.

 

[racerjoe]

Just spitballing but I would think:

Hronek - $7.25 - $7.5 x 7 years
Lindholm - $7-7.5 x 7 years
Zadorov - $5-5.5 x 6 years
Joshua - $3.75-$4.25 x 4 years

If those are the deals Hronek and Zaddy. I think it is currently most likely Hronek and Joshua at less than what you have.

This is a chart for player pay and production scales 2023/24 for forwards

1 = 8.5+ (76pts+)
2 = 8.5m - 7.1m (75 - 67)
3 = 7.1m - 5.8m (67 - 57)
4 = 5.8m - 5.13m (57 - 47)
5 = 5.13m - 4.5m (47 - 41)
6 = 4.5m - 3.4m (41 - 36)
7 = 3.4m - 2.75m (36 - 32)
8 = 2.75m - 2m (32 - 28)
9 = 2m - 1.5m (28 - 23)
10 = 1.5m - 1.1m (23 - 19)

Current roster and approx efficiency.

1 - Miller 103 (+ 3m)
1 - Pettersson 89 (+ 2.4m) .......neutral 24/25
2 - Boeser 73 (+ 1.3m)
4/5 - Garland 47 (+ 200k)
5 - Lindholm 44 (+ 400k)........negative 1.5 -3million
6/7 - Hoglander 36 (+ 2.3m)
7 - Joshua 32 (+ 2m)...............neutral
8 - Mikhayev 31 (- 2.1m)
8 - Suter 29 (+ 1.2m)
8/9 - Blueger 28 (+ 400k)
10 - Lafferty 24 (+ 400k)

Needs:
* Efficiency in the market as Pettersson and his positive value is gone and so will
Boeser Hoglander and Suter's by the end of 24/25 and 2 million for OEL plus likely drop in play from Miller.
* Top6 to play PP1 and with Pettersson. (best case he is fast enough to help PP1 set up)
* Speed and PF capabilities within 5-10F

Conclusion:
* Lindholm - is cost inefficiency immediately. He was a #5 with 44 pts this year and will want 7.8-8 million. Likely is 1.5-2m in negative value starting next season for us and will get worse slower and eventually be an anchor. No Thanks unless they think he is the final piece and they can win in the next 2-3yrs or trade him
* Joshua - at approx 3 million fills a need and should be neutral to positive value. You sign him and that is a win.
* Blueger at 1.5-1.8 is also a no brainer

Defense:

* Zadorov - If you can get Dillon at 3 million vs 5.5 that's 2.5 we can use to get a forward without much to any set back. Love big Z but No Thanks
* Hronek - 4yrs at 6.5 - 7 million and it's a no brainer. Not a great 2nd half and playoffs but Hughes being a Norris winner and the way that pairing caved teams you have to bring that back unless you use him to get a impact forward and can get a topUFA RD. Seems dubious with how many holes we need to fill to gamble like that.

I think while this is absolutely important values, what it misses on are certain "intangibles" that end up being so important. With Big Z I and Joshua I do think this team plays bigger, and has a certain attitude. I don't want to lose that, and I think it helped in our playoffs. It is one thing to say Dillion can replace size, and be a better analytical value, but another to say he will bring what we had with big Z.

And after saying that I don't think we can afford or will sign Zadorov.

 

[sting101]

I think while this is absolutely important values, what it misses on are certain "intangibles" that end up being so important. With Big Z I and Joshua I do think this team plays bigger, and has a certain attitude. I don't want to lose that, and I think it helped in our playoffs. It is one thing to say Dillion can replace size, and be a better analytical value, but another to say he will bring what we had with big Z.

And after saying that I don't think we can afford or will sign Zadorov.

Yes sucks to lose players we like but as i said we're losing a bunch of cap efficiency in the next year and just simply cannot afford to spend above efficiency on secondary pieces while we try to find 2 top6 players especially if Dillon who is a really close player to Zadorov minus the interviews saves us 2 million or more.

Agree on the pts per pay model. We know Garland is worth more than he is due to his 3rd line status and how he elevates that line without much PP and offensive usage and that roles into a more clear picture with Joshua.
Certainly Joshua's production gets a boost by Garland but as you said his physicality is easily worth another million for us in our top9 and if he stayed healthy he possibly moved into a 4.5 million on production alone category. Bottom line at 27/28 and 3ish million just get it done

 

[Mr. Canucklehead]

I think it’s likely going to be Hronek and Joshua out of those 4.

 

[VanillaCoke]

Lindholm & Zads no brainer.

Hroneks $ better spent on higher impact Lindholm, and Joshua least valuable position for the money.

I think it's quite likely we keep neither unfortunately, and possibly only hronek from those four choices.

 

[wonton15]

My prediction: It’ll likely be Hronek + Joshua. 7.25m x 7 and 3m x 4. Can see both parties taking both those deals.

Dillon gets signed on day 1 of FA for 2.5mx2. Mikheyev is traded with assets. Tanev maybe comes back. If not, we end up targetting a mid tier winger like Duclair, Toffoli, or Zucker…

 

[TruGr1t]

Hronek and Zadorov.

Hopefully no more than 12M for them both.

Contracts aside, I’d prioritize these two guys, add a second-pair right-side puck-mover like Walker or DeMelo to play with Zadorov and run the Soucy-Myers pair.

But considering your cap constraints, it’s probably more realistic they bring back Hronek and Joshua, replace Zadorov with Dillon on the left-side and go from there.

Lindholm isn’t even an option, in my opinion. He’s off to make $8M or so in AAV somewhere.

 

[wetcoast]

Out of these players, who do you keep, who do you let go!

(assuming Myers stays, And Blueger is cheap)

Man these are tough choices and a lot depends on what other moves the canucks might make and how prospects like Willander and EP2.0 turn out but I think Joshua and Zadorov are the 2 best value options but the Canucks window is now and Hronek and Lindholm help us in our window more.

Management is really going to earn their money by making the right choices here or eventually lose their jobs by making the wrong ones.

 

[Nucker101]

My guess based on reading the tea leaves:

Hronek stays, the other 3 turn down offers here and move on

What I’d do:

- put the Hronek negotiations on hold until you can talk to some pending UFA RHD or talk to teams about top 4 RHD that they’re willing to move. If none of those make sense you bite the bullet on a Hronek contract because this team can’t really afford to lose him without replacing him with an effective top 4 RHD.

- I’d up the offer to Joshua, low 2’s was understandably turned down, up it to high 2’s or 3M. Anything over that and let him walk, it’s is crucial to bring in a forward with some size to replace him though if we still want the Garland line to be effective.

- I’d let Lindholm walk, just can’t see him signing a contract here that makes sense for this team and himself

- I’d offer Zadorov some term with 5 years at around $4M, if he takes it that’s cool otherwise I’d sadly let him walk

 

[VanJack]

One thing you can always expect from Allvin, is the 'unexpected'. Looking at the cap situation right now, it's pretty straightforward as to who the Canucks bring back and what they can afford to pay.

But what if a major trade opens up tons of space, and all the calculations get thrown into a blender? I think that might be emerging as not only a 'possible option' but maybe even the 'likely' option.

One thing is for certain......despite the breakthrough season, Allvin and Rutherford won't be satisfied. They'll continue to conduct surgery on this roster to get the collection of players they want--particularly players who are built for post-season hockey.

 

[thekernel]

Hronek and Lindholm are the best players on this list

 

[LandfiII]

Marry Zadorov, f*** Lindholm, kill Hronek. Guess that means Dak is sidepiece.

 

[JimmyJiveJones]

Lindholm has priced himself out of here so hes not coming back and also i think theres cheaper options out there that can replace him that can "almost" do what he did. Only problem i see is that theres no righty Centers on the FA market other than Roslovic (but i dont know much about him).

Hronek, unless his salary demands are lowered i wont be mad if hes moved and we signed Tanev(he will come wayyyyy cheaper and will be a stop gap for Willander) also theres actually quite a few right handed defenders to be had on the market this year.

I love what Big Z brings to the table. I love everything about this guy but if his salary demands are tooo crazy then maybe not...... How much do u pay a #3/#4 guy nowadays? id go as high as 5.25AAV for him. Brendan Dhillon would be a huge downgrade from him but upgrade over Cole imo.

Joshua is a difficult one for me, from a statistical standpoint, he isnt worth anything more than 2.5Mil imo. But he brings size and grit...... Id pay him 3Mil AAV but im sure theres some team out there that will offer him 4MilAAV. I dont see anyone on the market that brings what he brings to the table at his price point anyways.

Id Sign Z and Joshua. We can replace Lindholm and Hronek with cheaper albiet not as good replacements, but he will have way more money to find a top 6 winger for Petey like Toffoli(love his goal scoring, hate how slow he is)