Who is the best example of "If he won a Cup he's in the HHOF" type of guy?

[Michael Farkas]

Yeah, there's some names in this thread...Danault, Maruk, Linden...Grubauer, who I wouldn't trust to get me a glass of water...quite a list...

 

[hockey webcomics]

Useful player, but my Kesler suggestion has been universally panned, and Kesler is/was a better player.

regarding kesler, is/was breaks my heart.
he surely deserves better than this bitter end :/

 

[MadArcand]

Had Bondra somehow dragged the Caps past Detroit, I'm sure he'd be in already long ago.

 

[CapsCrazyX17]

Hehh... I think he still misses, but on that type of candidacy, I prefer Kiprusoff.

Assuming Kolzig were to have won in 98 then he 100% also wins the Conn Smythe, which definitely helps his case.

If the Caps did win that year then Bondra is another player who has a stronger case. Poor guy, I don't know how many other 500 goal scorers aren't in the HoF.

 

[MadLuke]

If the Caps did win that year then Bondra is another player who has a stronger case. Poor guy, I don't know how many other 500 goal scorers aren't in the HoF.

not including the lock to get in, only

522 -- Verbeek
538 -- Tkachuk
566 -- Marleau

Together they lead the league in goals less often than Bondra too (1 vs 2)

 

[blundluntman]

Cujo is the best example. He should already be in the HoF with 5 top 5 vezina finishes (in an era of freaks) and 454 wins.

I really like the Vanbeisbrouck mention as well. It's kinda strange that both of his Cinderella playoff runs (86 with the Rangers and 96 with Florida) came to an end when he faced off against Roy ( w/ MTL in the 86 ECF and Colorado in the 96 SCF).

 

[yada]

Linden was shipped out of town because of Mike Keenan, not because of Messier. There was never any problem between Linden and Messier.
(On another topic, does anyone agree with me that Messier did not score the goal you refer to...? It seems to me someone else did.)

The OP already acknowleged this in his first post and explained his reasons for mentioning them.

Goal might have been brian noonan, messier swept his stick at the puck. Messier was given credit but you cant legitimately tell me if messier got a piece of the puck or not.

 

[Crosby2010]

Goal might have been brian noonan, messier swept his stick at the puck. Messier was given credit but you cant legitimately tell me if messier got a piece of the puck or not.

By Messier's immediate reaction he thinks he did. Normally what happens is that the player will look right to the guy who shot the puck if he thinks he didn't tip it in. Since Messier didn't do this means he either is the most selfish player in the history of the NHL if he knowingly took credit for an eventual Cup winning goal.......................or that he actually got a piece of it, knows he got a piece of it, or thought he got a piece of it. I tend to think the latter here. I've always thought it looked like something extra jammed that puck in, and that something would be Messier's stick.

Other than that good names on this thread. Kolzig is an interesting case. 1998 would be his Smythe and I think getting past the mighty Red Wings helps, but we are still talking about a 1st, 5th and 10th finish for the Vezina. That's a pretty weak cupboard. Kolzig is Ryan Miller, as is Kipper. Where I think a Cup helps them a bit but doesn't put them over the top. Kesler and Linden aren't regardless, but surprisingly there are weaker names mentioned here.

 

[Matsun]

Kovalchuk

 

[Crosby2010]

Kovalchuk

So he wins the Cup in 2012 with the Devils. Does he get in? If he wins he is in the running for the Smythe, with Brodeur. Depending on what he does in the Cup final though. Because he was awful in the Cup final, 1 point in 6 games. It is part of why they lost. Or does he belong regardless? 443 career goals? The guy scored a ton of goals in a short time.

 

[DitchMarner]

So he wins the Cup in 2012 with the Devils. Does he get in? If he wins he is in the running for the Smythe, with Brodeur. Depending on what he does in the Cup final though. Because he was awful in the Cup final, 1 point in 6 games. It is part of why they lost. Or does he belong regardless? 443 career goals? The guy scored a ton of goals in a short time.

His scoring race finishes (for goals and points) are very impressive, but it seems many on this board discredit him because he was a "bad team scorer" who received a ton of PP and overall ice time and didn't have defensive responsibilities. You do have to wonder how much a strong showing in the 2012 SCF and a Cup win would have enhanced his reputation and odds of making it into the HHOF.

 

[sensfan4lifee]

Fleury with another cup would make his resume very stacked. I could see him being a HOF even with the career he ha

Fleury and Mogilny not in the hall shows what a joke it is

 

[dalewood12]

Among modern players, I think Jamie Benn and Brent Burns could have their HOF chances increase exponentially if they win a cup.

 

[Crosby2010]

His scoring races finishes (for goals and points) are very impressive, but it seems many on this board discredit him because he was a "bad team scorer" who received a ton of PP and overall ice time and didn't have defensive responsibilities. You do have to wonder how much a strong showing in the 2012 SCF and a Cup win would have enhanced his reputation and odds of making it into the HHOF.

Leaving and going to the KHL screwed his chances. He would have kept his scoring stats and probably gotten 600 NHL goals the right way had he stayed. Doing this in the best league in the world would have helped.

I will add that before Roenick was announced as an inductee he was a poster boy for a guy that needed a Cup for the HHOF. 1992 comes to mind. Chelios wins the Smythe if the Hawks win, I think, but Roenick would have been right there.

 

[vadim sharifijanov]

Leaving and going to the KHL screwed his chances. He would have kept his scoring stats and probably gotten 600 NHL goals the right way had he stayed. Doing this in the best league in the world would have helped.

I will add that before Roenick was announced as an inductee he was a poster boy for a guy that needed a Cup for the HHOF. 1992 comes to mind. Chelios wins the Smythe if the Hawks win, I think, but Roenick would have been right there.

if chicago wins in 92, there is zero argument for anybody other than chelios. even in a finals sweep that was one of the greatest dmen playoff runs of all time.

 

[Crosby2010]

if chicago wins in 92, there is zero argument for anybody other than chelios. even in a finals sweep that was one of the greatest dmen playoff runs of all time.

It is, yes. That's Chelios' Conn Smythe. Just that Roenick is the top forward on that team and the #1C and we can assume with a win he gets more than the already decently impressive 22 points that spring, as the Hawks would need him to score more in order to win. But yeah that is Chelios' Smythe. Roenick is just 2nd on the pecking order, which I think would have gotten him in before 2024.

 

[The Panther]

Fleury and Mogilny not in the hall shows what a joke it is

Not really. I personally wouldn't put either of those guys in, but then again I would also take out about 50% of the guys who are already in...

Anyway, I can dream of a Hockey Hall of Greatness (not "fame" -- who cares about fame?) that's strictly for the crème de la crème of players. It would exclude faceless stay-at-home defencemen (Kevin Lowe), one-dimensional players that their own coaches didn't trust in key situations (Phil Housley), scorers who didn't score overly impressively (Dave Andreychuk), etc...

But, while I'm dreaming of this, I may as well dream that Bobby Brown didn't leave New Edition.

 

[bobholly39]

I don't really agree with some of the Vanbiesbrouck mentions. The way I figure is - 1996 Florida is as "cinderalla run" as it gets. Does winning the finals vs losing really impact his legacy that much? I personally don't think so - if he's not in today, I don't think that extra win makes a difference.

Rick Middleton is at least intriguing to me, if we're talking about 1983

1. He gets one whole extra round of playoffs that year. Likely ends up one of only 3 players in NHL history (till McDavid) to have 40+ points in a playoffs

2. His insane playoff run would have been the dynasty killer, stopping NYI at 3, instead of 4

3. His insane playoff run would have been the dynaste preventer - stopping Oilers from winning cup in 83, having to wait a year till 84

He'd get a lot of extra mileage from adding a cup/smythe in 83 to his legacy. it might be enough

Joseph is probably the most intriguing name here. Depends what year though. Does he win as a complte underdog in the late 90s? in 2002 Toronto, ending the leafs cup drought? Any of those scenarios, along with a smythe, could probably push him over. If anything, he should already be in the HOF for me.

 

[carjackmalone]

Dave Taylor
Rick martin

 

[BadgerBruce]

Bill White only played around 600 regular season games, but NHL coaches and GMs viewed him as one of the absolute best defensive defencemen in the world for most of his career. There’s a damn good reason why Harry Sinden made sure White was on the ice for the last 34 seconds of the ‘72 summit series. Made the SC finals twice with Chicago, in ‘71 and ‘73. Retired in 1976 after a career-ending neck injury.

He didn’t make the NHL until age 28, but not because he wasn’t good enough to play in the league. Eddie Shore just wouldn’t let him leave AHL Springfield. The pro hockey world was different in those days. It wasn’t until the Indians players went on strike that Shore caved and peddled his players to the Kings in the late-60s.

I’m one of those guys who thinks he should be in the Hall anyway. Bill White was really, really good. Finished 3rd in the Norris vote three straight years in a league with Bobby Orr and Brad Park. Give him a SC ring and I believe he’d be in the Hall.