Who is more dominant in their sport: Ohtani, McDavid or Mahomes?

[Cas]

I do get the distinction between unique and dominant tbf. Ohtani has a good argument for the most talented/gifted out of the 3, but dominance is more about blowing the competition out of the water than it is about being right at the top in multiple fields (especially when you're the only one doing it). As a hitter, he isn't dominating to the same degree as McDavid usually does scoring wide, I'd assume the same for pitching. Is there a metric where he's actually dominant to the same degree? Maybe something measuring a player's net value?

He's been the most valuable player in the league over the past four seasons overall, over Judge, but it's not a huge margin (about 5.5 WAR over four years). Judge has been better this year.

That's quite dominant, but not overwhelmingly dominant. It's also a four year span (though to be fair, very few players dominate the league for longer than that, because it's hard).

Most people are just bowled over because Ohtani does a lot of different things. That's not the same thing as value, as you note.

 

[Cup or Bust]

I would probably go with Mahomes because not only is he amazing individually but he is winning championships also.

 

[blundluntman]

He's been the most valuable player in the league over the past four seasons overall, over Judge, but it's not a huge margin (about 5.5 WAR over four years). Judge has been better this year.

That's quite dominant, but not overwhelmingly dominant. It's also a four year span (though to be fair, very few players dominate the league for longer than that, because it's hard).

Most people are just bowled over because Ohtani does a lot of different things. That's not the same thing as value, as you note.

Yeah I think dominant the wrong word to use when describing Ohtani's greatness. It's kinda like how Prince was a master in so many aspects of music that one wouldn't expect. He may not be the greatest vocalist/guitarist of all time, but combining all those things together put him in a different stratosphere. Same thing with a guy like Orr who isn't the greatest offensive or defensive player of all time (albeit, he's right there at the top in both)

 

[Cas]

Yeah I think dominant the wrong word to use when describing Ohtani's greatness. It's kinda like how Prince was a master in so many aspects of music that one wouldn't expect. He may not be the greatest vocalist/guitarist of all time, but combining all those things together put him in a different stratosphere. Same thing with a guy like Orr who isn't the greatest offensive or defensive player of all time (albeit, he's right there at the top in both)

I would argue that Ohtani is not in a different stratosphere. Doing more different things well is not inherently better than doing one or two things really well. Ohtani doesn't get any more credit for pitching and hitting than the mere sum of his value as a hitter and as a pitcher (which is very high, but not unheard-of - there are numerous players who peaked as high or higher than Ohtani has).

 

[blundluntman]

I would argue that Ohtani is not in a different stratosphere. Doing more different things well is not inherently better than doing one or two things really well. Ohtani doesn't get any more credit for pitching and hitting than the mere sum of his value as a hitter and as a pitcher (which is very high, but not unheard-of - there are numerous players who peaked as high or higher than Ohtani has).

I don't watch baseball so I can't say for sure but that sounds fair enough. I'd imagine talent/versatility-wise he may be in a tier of his own but I'm not sure. Either way, he's one hell of a spectacle/player

 

[Cas]

I don't watch baseball so I can't say for sure but that sounds fair enough. I'd imagine talent/versatility-wise he may be in a tier of his own but I'm not sure. Either way, he's one hell of a spectacle/player

The talent and versatility are ludicrous, but the hockey equivalent would be something like a forward playing 30 games in goal. His value would be his value as a forward in 50 games, and his value as a goalie in 30 games, and not some additional value thereof (it's not like the versatility brings much in the way of roster benefits, either, because the team still needs two other goalies).

 

[Machinehead]

I think the gap between Mahomes and the 2nd best QB is way smaller than the gap between McDavid and the 2nd best hockey player. And I say that as a lifelong Chiefs fan since 2018.

I don't know how you compare Ohtani to those two. Boiling his talent down to WAR just takes away the raw fact that nobody in 100 years can do what he does.

You were born in 2018?

 

[Machinehead]

I have to say, I do think people overrate Ohtani as a pitcher. I feel like people throw out that he's the best at both. He's not.

As a hitter, yes. At worst he's #2, and if you put him at #2, he's a lot closer to Judge than he is to #3.

As a pitcher, he was 11th in WAR and 14th in FIP over 2021, 2022, and 2023. Don't get me wrong, he's an excellent pitcher and it's impressive that he can do any kind of high-level pitching while being an elite MLB bat, but I don't think there has ever not been five pitchers better than him at any given time.

Caitlin Clark is the WNBA’s Gretzky and she’s only a rookie.

If there were a WNBA player in this poll, it's A'ja Wilson.

Clark is a rookie, yes, but right now she's not in A'ja's solar system.

 

[blundluntman]

The talent and versatility are ludicrous, but the hockey equivalent would be something like a forward playing 30 games in goal. His value would be his value as a forward in 50 games, and his value as a goalie in 30 games, and not some additional value thereof (it's not like the versatility brings much in the way of roster benefits, either, because the team still needs two other goalies).

Ah that makes perfect sense when you put it that way