Which top 4 players are better? Penguins vs. Red Wings

[PM88RU]

IMHO there’s a thing to clarify: are we talking about one unit or we can spread players across different lines?

If you can spread, it’s Pitt, no brainer.
If it’s one line, I wouldn’t be so sure.
DET was always strong as a system, they could have had a better chemistry with all these guys.

Surely Sid knows how to play with Geno, but would they have a chemistry with Lemieux and Jagr, I’m not convinced.

Before anyone says “sure there’s nothing to think about” remember how in 87 Canada Cup the dream team line with Gretzky and Lemieux was not better than Soviet KLM line (arguably “on par” with them).

Cause chemistry matters.

 

[Darren McCord]

I like gonchar over letang. Hell, letang wasn’t even on the roster for one of those cups. Gonchar was a 65 pt d man in pitt consistsntly

Yes he was. Letting win three cups. He scored a huge OT goal in 09 against the caps.

 

[RedHawkDown]

Wings fan saying it’s pretty easily the penguins.

 

[Pablo El Perro]

Malkin was an incredible player, but he ain't better than Datsyuk, Federov, Yzerman and certainly not Howe

I'd rank Malkin above Datsyuk, if we're considering them the number 4 for each team.

 

[Grifter3511]

Malkin was an incredible player, but he ain't better than Datsyuk, Federov, Yzerman and certainly not Howe

Why are we just assuming datsyuk is better than Malkin? His hardware cabinet doesnt say so.

 

[Johnny Tomala]

Malkin was an incredible player, but he ain't better than Datsyuk, Federov, Yzerman and certainly not Howe

Malkin is better than Datsyuk and Fedorov. I'm a Red Wings fan.

 

[NyQuil]

Malkin was an incredible player, but he ain't better than Datsyuk, Federov, Yzerman and certainly not Howe

I think he’s probably better than Datsyuk and while Fedorov peaked highly, Malkin is a good comparable and probably better over the long run.

My question is:

“Are the Pens closer to the Oilers or closer to the Red Wings?” if we assume a 1, 2, 3 order.

 

[Video Nasty]

The Penguins.

They could very well have four of the best five players on this list.

The only franchise that can beat or equal them in that regard is the Oilers.

Both teams are approaching nearly half a century of hoarding most of the greatest players to ever lace them up.

 

[banks]

If you put Lidstrom in the Detroit group, then it's closer. It's still the Pens. Not by a mile, just enough to be clear.

 

[acor]

Don't remember Howe at all, as he played before I was born, but I think Lemieux is consensually considered better than him, and the worst from Penguins 4 was better than 2nd best Penguins option IMO.

 

[Crow]

If you put Lidstrom in the Detroit group, then it's closer. It's still the Pens. Not by a mile, just enough to be clear.

Yeah that would be much closer.

Out of curiosity - Who is pittsburghs best dman? Coffey? Murphy? Neither won a Norris there. Carlyle? Good player but the franchise best peak? Yikes. Letang? At least he was a pen through and through.

 

[ZachaFlockaFlame]

If you put Lidstrom in the Detroit group, then it's closer. It's still the Pens. Not by a mile, just enough to be clear.

Came here to say the exact same thing after seeing the poll and idk I think a lot of people would be tempted to take 1C/D for 15-20 years

 

[Luigi Lemieux]

Yeah that would be much closer.

Out of curiosity - Who is pittsburghs best dman? Coffey? Murphy? Neither won a Norris there. Carlyle? Good player but the franchise best peak? Yikes. Letang? At least he was a pen through and through.

Coffey, Letang, Murphy, Gonchar, Stackhouse, Carlyle. Pens weren't particularly good defensively in either the Lemieux/Jagr or Crosby/Malkin era.

Strongest forwards of anyone imo, but historically d is quite weak. Heck Justin Schultz is 14th all time in scoring for Pittsburgh defensemen.

 

[Crow]

Coffey, Letang, Murphy, Gonchar, Stackhouse, Carlyle. Pens weren't particularly good defensively in either the Lemieux/Jagr or Crosby/Malkin era.

Strongest forwards of anyone imo, but historically d is quite weak. Heck Justin Schultz is 14th all time in scoring for Pittsburgh defensemen.

Ok cool so I wasn’t having some glaring omission.

I am not sure they are the strongest. I wonder how a forwards matchup vs the oilers would go. Gretzky, Messier, McDavid, Draisitl might be as good or better.

 

[DeletedUser539]

In a vacuum pens head to head I might lean Detroit because they all have a better defensive game along with Datsyuk and feds also being absolute wonder magicians with the puck as well

 

[bambamcam4ever]

I'd rank Malkin above Datsyuk, if we're considering them the number 4 for each team.

They had their primes at the same time and Malkin was considered a level above. Malkin was also better than Fedorov.

 

[hamzarocks]

Malkin was an incredible player, but he ain't better than Datsyuk, Federov, Yzerman and certainly not Howe

Datsyuk and Federov are jokes lol

Malkin clears them easily.


Yzerman better than Malkin due to malkins inconsistencies and injuries

Howe is a different class than Malkin and the other 3 names there

 

[Bouboumaster]

Datsyuk and Federov are jokes lol

Malkin clears them easily.


Yzerman better than Malkin due to malkins inconsistencies and injuries

Howe is a different class than Malkin and the other 3 names there

Who cares

Lemieux, Crosby and Jagr are too much for Detroit anyway

 

[authentic]

It’s clearly the Pens but have the 4 face off against each other and I don’t think the gap would be so large, especially if you throw in the best Detroit defensemen and goalies vs. Pittsburgh. Infact do all-time teams and see what we come up with, I think I may have done this before on this board actually.

 

[norrisnick]

The Pens will win a fantasy league, head to head is a different story entirely.

 

[Sasha Orlov]

Pens have 2 of the top 5 players of all time so idk how it can’t be them

 

[Toby91ca]

I'm a big fan of 3 of the 4 Wings' players, but not sure how anyone can honestly vote for that 4 over the PIT 4.

 

[TheGoldenJet]

Malkin is ahead of both Fedorov and Datsyuk. Peak, prime and career.

True, and some time after he retires, most pundits will realize he’s also ahead of Yzerman.

 

[JackSpider]

Gretzky once said that Fedorov was the hardest center to go against. Crosby vs Datsyuk is a fair matchup. I think I see the idea behind the poll. Voted for pens.

 

[Luigi Lemieux]

It’s clearly the Pens but have the 4 face off against each other and I don’t think the gap would be so large, especially if you throw in the best Detroit defensemen and goalies vs. Pittsburgh. Infact do all-time teams and see what we come up with, I think I may have done this before on this board actually.

All time team with full lines Detroit takes. The difference in defense is vast.