Where is Rantanen? Who is Rantanen? Why is Rantanen? What is Rantanen?

[Vapaatunnus]

To be fair, if Rantanen was playing like that or slightly below that level consistently in the last two years, the Avs don't trade him. But he didn't too much he was just lazy and nobody knows how he just got a 4 point night while looking terrible.

Good for him to go on a run like that and as a hockey fan, this is a great story line.

Lazy ass who puts 100 points per year

 

[Vapaatunnus]

He's not just carrying his own line, he's carrying the whole team. And that isn't to say Dallas is playing poorly. They aren't. Rantanen is just playing that damn good right now. Crazy how this thread started a week or so ago because he hadn't scored at all. Now he's leading the whole playoffs.

 

[Soedy]

View attachment 1031942

Lazy ass who puts 100 points per year

Yes. What I wrote. He looked / played lazy and yet put up points.

 

[Mr Nogatco]

I think if a reporter told you there was treasure in Antarctica you’d be chipping ice tomorrow

Not sure I can help you if you don’t understand why an agent might turn down an offer as “not even close” before caving and accepting at the last minute. That’s a nice folksy saying though.

 

[pelderhostiga]

Yes. What I wrote. He looked / played lazy and yet put up points.

And still I must ask, was it more of a talent issue or a coaching issue? Even when playing lazy Rantanen was more efficient during elimination games than MacK or Mak. It just seems crazy to let go of that kind of rare talent.

It's funny how people still argue about the Avs contract proposals, when Sakic straight up admitted in post-season presser that they wanted to trade him for depth. There was always a feeling that Rantanen would have signed for the Avs in the $12-12.5 range, but it should be clear by now the Avs didn't want to keep him, as they said so much themself.

 

[LOFIN]

Lazy ass who puts 100 points per year

Fact: when looking at advanced stats and whatnot, it's clearly visible that in 2022-2025 Rantanen got basically all of his production playing with MacKinnon. It's absolutely not a wrong take by the Avs fans (and management) to think that based on his play in 2022-2025, he is not worth the MacKinnon (let alone Draisaitl) money. He has not been able to carry his own line anymore. The production has been there because he's an elite talent, but he hasn't been an elite play driving forward.

Now, we will see in the upcoming years if the Avs made the right bet that Rantanen has regressed and needs to be moved when the opportunity is there. Because if this continues on, major questions are going to be asked about Jared Bednar's coaching, if under him Rantanen regressed from a playdriving force to the version he was before the trade. If Dallas and DeBoer can unlock that pre-2022 version of Rantanen for good (we are still talking about a very small sample size here), then that's a major indictment and one of the worst failures by management in recent NHL history. The Avs basically trusted their coach more than a superstar player. And we all know which ones are easier to get, good coaches, or superstar players.

But, we'll see. I don't think we can make the determination about that based on these playoffs alone. Unless Rantanen wins the Conn Smythe I guess. But this trade will need to be looked back on for years to come. We haven't even finished the opening chapter of this saga, many more chapters will be written.

 

[Ratbath]

Not sure I can help you if you don’t understand why an agent might turn down an offer as “not even close” before caving and accepting at the last minute. That’s a nice folksy saying though.

So in a moment of panic they capitulated millions of dollars they were 100% dead set on up until a half hour before? Felt fully obligated to lock in an eight year deal way way below their value when they could have just gone to free agency?

Or did Colorado jump the gun and they could have had him at 12.5?

 

[behemolari]

Delete this thread he's getting too strong

no, return it to its original form: "Where is Rantanen?" to remove curse

 

[Pestilence]

Rantanen wouldn't have made the back-to-back hat tricks if not for the rigid nutrition and training program put in place by MacKinnon, so it is still quite safe to say he is a byproduct of MacKinnon.

 

[LOFIN]

So in a moment of panic they capitulated millions of dollars they were 100% dead set on up until a half hour before? Felt fully obligated to lock in an eight year deal way way below their value when they could have just gone to free agency?

Or did Colorado jump the gun and they could have had him at 12.5?

Colorado could've signed him for their last offer, 11.6, had Rantanen really known that they were serious about trading him. This has been reported by the likes of LeBrun.

 

[behemolari]

To be fair, if Rantanen was playing like that or slightly below that level consistently in the last two years, the Avs don't trade him. But he didn't too much he was just lazy and nobody knows how he just got a 4 point night while looking terrible.

Good for him to go on a run like that and as a hockey fan, this is a great story line.

everybody knows, his scoring stats did not correlate his underlying deep stats and now it bounced back, it was very expected

 

[Soedy]

And still I must ask, was it more of a talent issue or a coaching issue? Even when playing lazy Rantanen was more efficient during elimination games than MacK or Mak. It just seems crazy to let go of that kind of rare talent.

It's funny how people still argue about the Avs contract proposals, when Sakic straight up admitted in post-season presser that they wanted to trade him for depth. There was always a feeling that Rantanen would have signed for the Avs in the $12-12.5 range, but it should be clear by now the Avs didn't want to keep him, as they said so much themself.

Good question, I don't know. Maybe he got too comfortable and didn't have the "fire" anymore, maybe he did it because he knew he did not have to drive his line, that was MacK's part. Avs also not really won anything with the core beside 2022. I mean the rest of the regular season and first few playoff games, the consensus was, that the Avs did good and the right thing. That obviously has completely changed now since Rantanen shows what he can do and plays absolute lights out.

Haven't watched the post season presser but if they really thought they sign him at 12 and still traded him, that's dumb in my opinion. At the time of the trade I thought they are pretty sure, he will be north of 13 that's why they did it.

 

[hirawl]

I can definitely understand selling high on elite talent past their prime. I think it's the way to go really. What is absolutely bat shit crazy is to do that over 750k with cap going up like it is. And the player is still in his prime.

That's just so dumb I can't get my head around it.

 

[jalapenoWithAnH]

To be fair, if Rantanen was playing like that or slightly below that level consistently in the last two years, the Avs don't trade him. But he didn't too much he was just lazy and nobody knows how he just got a 4 point night while looking terrible.

Good for him to go on a run like that and as a hockey fan, this is a great story line.

Imagine saying someone is lazy when that guy is averaging TOI of 22 minutes per game in Colorado for the past three seasons and having 100 point back to back seasons.

Also he was like 6th in scoring at the time he was traded. Revisionist history right here smh

 

[Nate070]

Rantanen wouldn't have made the back-to-back hat tricks if not for the rigid nutrition and training program put in place by MacKinnon, so it is still quite safe to say he is a byproduct of MacKinnon.

 

[jalapenoWithAnH]

I can definitely understand selling high on elite talent past their prime.

He is 28 my dude, what are you on about

 

[solidmotion]

He is 28 my dude, what are you on about

read the rest of the post

 

[Soedy]

Imagine saying someone is lazy when that guy is averaging TOI of 22 minutes per game in Colorado for the past three seasons and having 100 point back to back seasons.

Also he was like 6th in scoring at the time he was traded. Revisionist history right here smh

You seen him play? He wasn't engaged most of the time. I explicity said, that he STILL put up points, yet the eye test couldn't really explain how he got all the points. He still get them, the talent was always there.

He is 28 my dude, what are you on about

Dude, in the next sentence he is saying, that he is still in his prime and therefore does NOT understand why they did it.

 

[LOFIN]

Imagine saying someone is lazy when that guy is averaging TOI of 22 minutes per game in Colorado for the past three seasons and having 100 point back to back seasons.

Also he was like 6th in scoring at the time he was traded. Revisionist history right here smh

It's not revisionist history FFS

A lot of Avs fans have been down on Mikko for a few seasons now, and it's because they actually watch him play night in and night out. And while you obviously haven't, you can look up the advanced stats and see what was going on. FACT: Mikko Rantanen had regressed, and could not drive play or produce without MacKinnon. That's not an opinion, it's a straight-up fact.

Now, if that was because of coaching (like not managing his minutes properly), that's a different discussion. And we are going to have it in length and detail, if Rantanen continues to play like this, especially continuing next season. If he does that, there is going to be a giant discussion about the way Colorado handled it.

 

[Ratbath]

Colorado could've signed him for their last offer, 11.6, had Rantanen really known that they were serious about trading him. This has been reported by the likes of LeBrun.

you mean rantanen could have signed the first offer they gave him but because he said "maybe we should talk about it?" they traded him immediately.

 

[LOFIN]

you mean rantanen could have signed the first offer they gave him but because he said "what about a trifle more?" they traded him immediately?

If we are to believe what Kypreos is reporting (and his reporting about what was going on with Rantanen has been spot on all year long), it basically went like this:

- The Avs say that 11.6M, this is where we will cap out
- Rantanen's agent says we still want 13M
- Rantanen himself goes to the Colorado front office, and says that he's willing to come down from their number and make the deal work
- Colorado basically never reacts to it, and Rantanen is traded like a day or two after that

 

[aylib]

1 assist in 4 games and -4.

Of course the whole Dallas team doesn't score a lot, and their scoring leader is defenseman with 3 points in 4 games. Still, Rantanen is paid to be a leader, and he isn't to put it mildly.

Did you get your answer? Aged like milk

 

[Ratbath]

If we are to believe what Kypreos is reporting (and his reporting about what was going on with Rantanen has been spot on all year long), it basically went like this:

- The Avs say that 11.6M, this is where we will cap out
- Rantanen's agent says we still want 13M
- Rantanen himself goes to the Colorado front office, and says that he's willing to come down from their number and make the deal work
- Colorado basically never reacts to it, and Rantanen is traded like a day or two after that

yes. we agree.

my conjecture is they did have enough space to fit rantanen if they wanted to at roughly the same number he eventually signed with the stars. they chose depth and i think they chose poorly.

 

[jonlin]

Mikko Rantanen had regressed, and could not drive play or produce without MacKinnon

I guess Dadonov, Lindell and Hintz are more talented than MacKinnon and Makar, as Rantanen has regressed that much and now is producing?

 

[LOFIN]

I guess Dadonov, Lindell and Hintz are more talented than MacKinnon and Makar, as Rantanen has regressed that much and now is producing?

Sigh. Did you even read my post in its entirety?