When do you start to worry about Kakko & Laffy?
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LORDE
I am Lorde, YA YA YA
I'll admit I am worried about both already... it's been said many times that if there were flashes of "OH WOW! THAT'S WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT" it wouldn't be a bigger issue but there just haven't been those moments
Agree with the year 3/4 sentiment. As long as they continue to show some improvement. We really can’t count this as a full year either.
kakko has really stepped up defensively. Laf is learning. Let them grow. We weren’t going to be contenders this year- we are right where we all expected. But yes, it still hurts to watch sometimes.
kakko has really stepped up defensively. Laf is learning. Let them grow. We weren’t going to be contenders this year- we are right where we all expected. But yes, it still hurts to watch sometimes.
JustaFinnishGuy
Joonas Donskoi avi but not a SEA fan ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
You don't panick with Lafreniere until his ELC runs out.
Sorry for invading the NYR boards. Thought I was still on main
Sorry for invading the NYR boards. Thought I was still on main
I don't think that KK is ever going to be the elite goal scorer we hoped he would be. But, I do think that he will become, in time, a high quality top six forward. Although his production does not show it, he has shown marked improvement in many areas. He did take last season to heart and obviously worked on his skating. It shows. Last season, his lack of foot speed was evident, this year, much less so. I think he is beginning to envision what his future role in the NHL will be, a role where his foot speed will not be a negative: strong along the boards, strong physically, strong at taking the puck to the net, strong defensively. He has enough offensive talent to be a 25-30G, 25-30A point forward, eventually. I think his growth curve will be slow but steady. One day we will all awake to realize that the guy is a real solid NHL player and a core member of the team. Is this what we hoped for when we drafted him #2? No, but I would not say that this is KK's fault. I do not question his motivation, work ethic, or drive. This is not another case of LA. I do believe strongly that he needs time to continue to grow into his role. We need to be patient with him. Compared to last year, he now looks like an NHL player. Patience is called for.
Laf right now is completely lost. He looks frustrated and frankly puzzled. He appears down on himself and his ability to succeed in the NHL. For a young player who has had only success, this season has been a rude wake up call. His confidence is completely gone, or so it seems. But, I do think he has the talent to be successful in this league at a high level. He has just not yet figured out how to utilize that talent. Whatever he has done in the past, does not seem to work. He is trying to figure it all out. More than playing time in the AHL, what he needs is an off season. Obviously, he is was not physically prepared to play in a league of men. Next year, he will come to camp stronger, not only because he will be older, but because he will certainly be pointed to an intense off season training program. He also needs time to step back and process all that has happened this season, to understand why he did not meet his own high expectations for himself and the expectations of others. Some people shrink from self-evaluation, others take it to heart. I hope, from what I have seen, that he is in the latter category. He doesn't strike me as Alexandre Daigle. I would be surprised is he turns it around this season. But, I do expect to see marked improvement next year. That being said, I think we are a few years away from knowing what kind of player he will eventually be. Will he be a middle six or top line winger? I'm not sure yet. But, I'm certainly not ready to write him off after his struggles this year. I do think, that except of generational talent, it is becoming more an more difficult for young players, even those drafted top five, to come into the league and have immediate success. Patience is what we need, even though it is hard for us fans to have patience. But just try to visualize how frustrating it is for Laf.
Laf right now is completely lost. He looks frustrated and frankly puzzled. He appears down on himself and his ability to succeed in the NHL. For a young player who has had only success, this season has been a rude wake up call. His confidence is completely gone, or so it seems. But, I do think he has the talent to be successful in this league at a high level. He has just not yet figured out how to utilize that talent. Whatever he has done in the past, does not seem to work. He is trying to figure it all out. More than playing time in the AHL, what he needs is an off season. Obviously, he is was not physically prepared to play in a league of men. Next year, he will come to camp stronger, not only because he will be older, but because he will certainly be pointed to an intense off season training program. He also needs time to step back and process all that has happened this season, to understand why he did not meet his own high expectations for himself and the expectations of others. Some people shrink from self-evaluation, others take it to heart. I hope, from what I have seen, that he is in the latter category. He doesn't strike me as Alexandre Daigle. I would be surprised is he turns it around this season. But, I do expect to see marked improvement next year. That being said, I think we are a few years away from knowing what kind of player he will eventually be. Will he be a middle six or top line winger? I'm not sure yet. But, I'm certainly not ready to write him off after his struggles this year. I do think, that except of generational talent, it is becoming more an more difficult for young players, even those drafted top five, to come into the league and have immediate success. Patience is what we need, even though it is hard for us fans to have patience. But just try to visualize how frustrating it is for Laf.
Edge
Kris King's Ghost
This is true. But I think they are far closer to NJ and Philly than they are to Boston, Washington, Pittsburgh and the Islanders.
And sometimes, much like playoff brackets, it's also a matter of how you match up against specific teams.
NickyFotiu
NYR 2024 Cup Champs!
- Sep 29, 2011
- 17,202
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I do not buy that anyone is not at least concerned. Doesn't mean they think they will be busts. Just means they hoped for more at this point and now wonder how high their ceilings will be in the future. I'm always an optimistic guy but I'm concerned. You expect perennial all star players drafted at #1 and #2. The Rangers are not likely to draft that high again for decades.
Machinehead
HFNYR MVP
I think a lot of the anxiety stems from the fact that franchise players don't play in the NHL long before they're exactly that.
History tells us these two *probably* won't be that based on their start, because it does tend to happen right away.
But here's the good news: it doesn't need to happen for them because it already did. After 103 NHL games, and I think even before that, it's apparent that Adam Fox is a franchise player. We did it. Celebrate with a drink. Rebuild worth it.
Back to Kakko and Lafreniere, there's still no evidence to suggest they aren't excellent, excellent prospects who couldn't end up on the very next tier.
Again, just because it's a recent example, Martin Necas didn't play in the NHL until D+3. Marchand had 1 point in 20 games before becoming a full-time player D+5. Zibanejad broke out D+6. Draisaitl was so bad D+1, they sent him back to junior hockey. Maybe the McDavid's and the Matthew's don't but lots of great players put it together late.
History tells us these two *probably* won't be that based on their start, because it does tend to happen right away.
But here's the good news: it doesn't need to happen for them because it already did. After 103 NHL games, and I think even before that, it's apparent that Adam Fox is a franchise player. We did it. Celebrate with a drink. Rebuild worth it.
Back to Kakko and Lafreniere, there's still no evidence to suggest they aren't excellent, excellent prospects who couldn't end up on the very next tier.
Again, just because it's a recent example, Martin Necas didn't play in the NHL until D+3. Marchand had 1 point in 20 games before becoming a full-time player D+5. Zibanejad broke out D+6. Draisaitl was so bad D+1, they sent him back to junior hockey. Maybe the McDavid's and the Matthew's don't but lots of great players put it together late.
haohmaru
boomshakalaka
2023. I'm worried a whole lot more about Shesterkin's ability to stay healthy and whether Georgiev can sort his head out. Also, the lack of interested in ADA, whether Gauthier can put the pieces together, whether the Rangers are boneheads and trade Buchnevich despite him finally being the player they thought he could be, which Zibanjed we have moving forward, etc...
Kakko and LaF aren't really on my radar at this point.
Kakko and LaF aren't really on my radar at this point.
Edge
Kris King's Ghost
I would say, maybe disappointed or frustrated, but not worried.
Just feeding off what @Machinehead said for a second. Let's even assume they don't become Franchise players. Just for the sake of conversation.
Is it still okay if they're posting 80 and 70 points each instead of 100 and 90?
I mean what if they aren't MacKinnon or Matthews?
What if they're "only" Zibanejad and Panarin? Or only Barkov and Huberdeau?
Even if they don't become "franchise" players, I feel there's a hell of lot of great outcomes between "best results" and "bad results".
Machinehead
HFNYR MVP
I do see things I'm concerned about, or just things I've noticed for the sake of not sounding alarmist.
But those things are related to whether or not the Rangers are making all of the right decisions as it relates to development, rather than the players themselves.
The players have more tools to work with than any Rangers prospects I remember.
But those things are related to whether or not the Rangers are making all of the right decisions as it relates to development, rather than the players themselves.
The players have more tools to work with than any Rangers prospects I remember.
Sure that’s fine as long as we pay them accordingly. If they aren’t gonna be those upper tier players (90-110) points that’s fine JG just has to be smart in how he pays them because you are gonna have to balance out the roster with better players too not like the oilers roster (albeit they are starting to accumulate so decent prospects for depth)
NickyFotiu
NYR 2024 Cup Champs!
- Sep 29, 2011
- 17,202
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A what if floor of Zibs and Panerin would be very good. Barkov and Huberdeau would be very good as well. I do not look at those as only as good situations since they are far from there now (at age 19).
Fans can not expect them to become Mathews or MacKinnon. That is a large burden to put on these guys but you do expect guys drafted that high to be frequent all stars if things go well. Now lets say for some reason they do not. Nobody is to blame. The draft still has a lot of luck involved including timing. Guys like Crosby, Mathews and Mackinnon are superstars. They are not available in every draft.
Number 9
What rhymes with Gagne?
- Jul 16, 2005
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I’m satisfied if Kakko turns into Barkov but I still want more out of Lafreniere.
I still don't get this. Goal differential-wise they're far closer to the teams you mentioned other than the Islanders. Why is that not important to look at? I feel everyone is just looking to trash the team. And yes I'm aware I trash Shesterkin and used to Lundqvist after painful losses but the Rangers' goal differential is very solid and I think that's significant.
Machinehead
HFNYR MVP
Barkov is probably above Kakko's ceiling even if everything went right. Barkov is a 90 point player.
I'd be very happy if Kakko became Nash with the Rangers. 60-70 points and good at everything.
will1066
If you score four, you better f'n win the game
- Oct 12, 2008
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Is your radar broken? Lol What kind of radar doesn't keep track of a first-overall pick and a second- overall selection?
will1066
If you score four, you better f'n win the game
- Oct 12, 2008
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LeetchisGod
This is a bad hockey team.
will1066
If you score four, you better f'n win the game
- Oct 12, 2008
- 52,378
- 75,480
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