What happened to the offense?

[Xspyrit]

horrible take. Sens have traded offense for winning.

The team is winning, who cares about everything else. 3rd in the division.

It's easy to say after we're scored 3 goals, which is our highest total in 5 games and only the 5th time we scored 3 goals or more in 17 games.

At the time of that post, we were 7-7-2 since December 22nd with only 1.81 GF/GP while being shutout 5 times in 11 games

People acting like there was no problem might just prefer to bury their heads in the sand. I want to win and I want it to be sustainable. If we can't score we're in deep shit, just as much as when we were giving up too many goals.

 

[CanadianHockey]

I'm still chalking it up to the team has lost some of its scoring while reorienting around defensive play especially given the offence dried up around the same time as Ullmark went down. The offence will return, I suspect we are underachieving relative to the talent on the roster. PDO and shooting percentages lend credibility to that argument. Not sold that we are contenders without adding, but willing to ride out this season, get a first playoff exposure, then add in the postseason or at next year's trade deadline.

 

[umma gumma]

Well I disagree, there's 18 skaters on a team and if your playoffs success hinges on 1 player, there might be a problem. I don't think Marner has been the only problem for them.

If Marner came here he would be the Sens highest paid player. At the salary he would command, you're damned right I expect him to be leading the way and be our most important player when we need him the most. He has not shown the ability to do that. I don't want us to be paying double digits for a guy that is nowhere to be found in elimination games.

And we laugh at teams that flex their 'playoff success'. Who cares.

 

[Xspyrit]

If Marner came here he would be the Sens highest paid player. At the salary he would command, you're damned right I expect him to be leading the way and be our most important player when we need him the most. He has not shown the ability to do that. I don't want us to be paying double digits for a guy that is nowhere to be found in elimination games.

And we laugh at teams that flex their 'playoff success'. Who cares.

I understand your POV but I don't think teams are going to restrain themselves from offering him big money. They are aware that he can't be your main actor to playoffs success but probably believe he has the talent to be part of the solution.

 

[Tuna99]

It's easy to say after we're scored 3 goals, which is our highest total in 5 games and only the 5th time we scored 3 goals or more in 17 games.

At the time of that post, we were 7-7-2 since December 22nd with only 1.81 GF/GP while being shutout 5 times in 11 games

People acting like there was no problem might just prefer to bury their heads in the sand. I want to win and I want it to be sustainable. If we can't score we're in deep shit, just as much as when we were giving up too many goals.

Blah blah blah, Sens are 3rd in the division without their starting goalie and lots of injuries on D. This 2-1, 3-2 games is their new identity, instead of worrying endlessly about the end of the world just enjoy it. It’s real and it’s just the start of a long run of winning hockey and a Cup from this core group. The offense will improve, just like it did under jacques Martin after his culture set in and over the years the group got better at winning, winning within their system, better at offense .

Travis Green is 50 games into his tenure with his starting goalie out of the lineup most of the season and Ottawa is 3rd in their division. It can’t all happen at once, we haven’t even seen a deadline move yet. Lots can be done to improve.

 

[umma gumma]

I understand your POV but I don't think teams are going to restrain themselves from offering him big money. They are aware that he can't be your main actor to playoffs success but probably believe he has the talent to be part of the solution.

Oh I agree 100%, I just don't want it to be the Sens. He can be Charmin somewhere else.

 

[NyQuil]

The easy answer is the powerplay.

I don’t care how well defensively you are playing, the PP shouldn’t require that kind of attention to detail.

 

[Micklebot]

The easy answer is the powerplay.

I don’t care how well defensively you are playing, the PP shouldn’t require that kind of attention to detail.

I think the PP would benefit from more practice time, the compressed schedule isn't doing us any favours on that front,

 

[MiscBrah]

The easy answer is the powerplay.

I don’t care how well defensively you are playing, the PP shouldn’t require that kind of attention to detail.

Given that they still rank middle of the pack for PP% and top 10 for PPGF, it shows their hot start on the PP. They have been at 12.8% since January 1 (5/39), but our overall PP% is still 22.2%.

 

[Micklebot]

Given that they still rank middle of the pack for PP% and top 10 for PPGF, it shows their hot start on the PP. They have been at 12.8% since January 1 (5/39), but our overall PP% is still 22.2%.

The talent is there (at the very least to be better than they have been lately). I suspect the issue is we have other priorities in our limited practice schedule,

 

[NyQuil]

I think the PP would benefit from more practice time, the compressed schedule isn't doing us any favours on that front.

Just anecdotally, I always get the sense that they are trying too hard for the bang-bang-bang set play which puts too much pressure on those passes and the one-timer.

It should be a bit more free-wheeling and using the options available rather than forcing the pass to the bumper.

 

[Micklebot]

Just anecdotally, I always get the sense that they are trying too hard for the bang-bang-bang set play which puts too much pressure on those passes and the one-timer.

It should be a bit more free-wheeling and using the options available rather than forcing the pass to the bumper.

I feel like a well oiled PP is one where you have time to process your options because
a) you instinctively know where everyone will be, and they are there
b) passes are crisp and not bobbled, so the defenders aren't afforded as much time to adjust for the next move.

It's a lot easier to be free wheeling when you aren't trying to settle down a pass that was a bit off with a defender rushing you. A good PP has at least two options that feel automatic for every puck touch and guys moving in sync to create the lanes.

I do agree it feels like we try to force one play, and I think when you are struggling, forcing the perfect play is less effective then reverting to filtering some point shots through to crash the net for rebounds.

 

[DylanSensFan]

Was my post not clear? I said "money would come back", meaning it wouldn't be just for picks and prospects... (I'll throw a proposal for the purpose of the lineup below)

I also said "we'd need to have a plan to acquire some offensive talent", meaning that you don't trade them if you're not acquiring worthy replacements.

If by trading Tkachuk and Norris, I end up with Mitch Marner and Sam Bennett, I'd do it (just for fun because it won't happen)

Tkachuk + Norris for Lafreniere + 2nd + 3rd (Rangers take on Norris contract so the return for Brady is reduced)

I love Chuck Norris but I think the forward group below would be quite efficient (would have to make Perron's cap disappear too). In my scenario, I signed Marner 8 years x 11 M$. If he'd want more, then I wouldn't be able to afford him. And lol at your Boeser example, only Dorion would give him that kind of contract.

I think the defense and Goaltending is set with Yakemchuk coming up to eventually replace Jensen but the forward group needs a major revamp

Lafreniere - Stutzle - Batherson
Bennett - Pinto - Marner
Amadio - Greig - Giroux
Reinhardt - Ostapchuk - Cousins

Sanderson - Zub
Chabot - Jensen
Kleven - Matinpalo
JBD

Ullmark
Merilainen



If they want to have the highest AAV as possible, they will get it, of course. If they want to be on a contender, they might have to be reasonable (obviously, wouldn't be us). I said that is what I would sign them for, not the highest they would get. The importance of words.

However, I'd go 11 M$ for 8 years on Marner since he's younger and I expect him to age better than Rantanen, but anyone throwing 12 M$+ at Rantanen for the max term is going to regret it, 29 y/o next season.

Draisaitl is in a clear tier above. Matthews (13.25 AAV) and MacKinnon (12.6 AAV) too so they should be signed below that.

Mitch Marner is a no show in the playoffs. No thanks!

 

[Xspyrit]

Oh I agree 100%, I just don't want it to be the Sens. He can be Charmin somewhere else.

Don't worry I'd much rather have Rantanen (or many others) but our top-6 will need a massive injection of skill. Problem is where to find it? We don't really have dispensable assets and it's hard to attract UFAs in their prime so what if Marner WANTS to come to Ottawa without asking too much? (let's say he would do 11 M$ x 7 years)

I understand the soft argument but for me it was always about MAKING the playoffs first and then we'll see. I have seen some Sens fans talk this way for years but... we kept missing the playoffs, which is why some outsiders mocked us. Don't shoot the messenger, I'm just reporting what I have seen on the main boards.

Mitch Marner is a no show in the playoffs. No thanks!

I would want him to make the playoffs every season though!

Blah blah blah, Sens are 3rd in the division without their starting goalie and lots of injuries on D. This 2-1, 3-2 games is their new identity, instead of worrying endlessly about the end of the world just enjoy it. It’s real and it’s just the start of a long run of winning hockey and a Cup from this core group. The offense will improve, just like it did under jacques Martin after his culture set in and over the years the group got better at winning, winning within their system, better at offense .

Travis Green is 50 games into his tenure with his starting goalie out of the lineup most of the season and Ottawa is 3rd in their division. It can’t all happen at once, we haven’t even seen a deadline move yet. Lots can be done to improve.

Damn, you better be right! As of now, I don't see it but of course I have the fan hope that it will happen. I believe we'll still need to make the right moves though.

I'm sorry, never been a big fan of blind optimism. Yeah it's cool to be 3rd at the moment but we could also be 7th with just 2 losses in a row... There's a lot to like about the season but it's hard for me to ignore that we are -13 at 5v5 hockey for example...

I believe this thread was made because there is Sens fans worried about the offense, as IIRC we were in the middle of being SHUTOUT 5 times in 11 games. I mean, it's a bit crazy to tell these people "blablabla" there's absolutely no reason for your concerns! Why not let them be? Do they tell you to NOT be positive? Why even come on the internet if all you guys want to see is 100% positivity?

Make another forum where it's prohibited to post something that is not 100% positive? I really don't get it lol

 

[MiscBrah]

Don't worry I'd much rather have Rantanen (or many others) but our top-6 will need a massive injection of skill. Problem is where to find it? We don't really have dispensable assets and it's hard to attract UFAs in their prime so what if Marner WANTS to come to Ottawa without asking too much? (let's say he would do 11 M$ x 7 years)

I understand the soft argument but for me it was always about MAKING the playoffs first and then we'll see. I have seen some Sens fans talk this way for years but... we kept missing the playoffs, which is why some outsiders mocked us. Don't shoot the messenger, I'm just reporting what I have seen on the main boards.



I would want him to make the playoffs every season though!



Damn, you better be right! As of now, I don't see it but of course I have the fan hope that it will happen. I believe we'll still need to make the right moves though.

I'm sorry, never been a big fan of blind optimism. Yeah it's cool to be 3rd at the moment but we could also be 7th with just 2 losses in a row... There's a lot to like about the season but it's hard for me to ignore that we are -13 at 5v5 hockey for example...

I believe this thread was made because there is Sens fans worried about the offense, as IIRC we were in the middle of being SHUTOUT 5 times in 11 games. I mean, it's a bit crazy to tell these people "blablabla" there's absolutely no reason for your concerns! Why not let them be? Do they tell you to NOT be positive? Why even come on the internet if all you guys want to see is 100% positivity?

Make another forum where it's prohibited to post something that is not 100% positive? I really don't get it lol

There's also the factor that we had elite offensive talent on those Martin teams and depth. 2002-03 we had Hossa, Alfie, White, Havlat, Bonk, Redden, Chara, Fisher, and Spezza. We have some skilled players right now, but I don't think the offensive depth is there. I guess only time will tell.

 

[coladin]

Team is learning how to win. And they are winning. They have been snakebitten as they are creating chances, just not burying them.

The offence will come, I think. We aren't the Islanders yet, but the PP needs to get going

 

[umma gumma]

I understand the soft argument but for me it was always about MAKING the playoffs first and then we'll see. I have seen some Sens fans talk this way for years but... we kept missing the playoffs, which is why some outsiders mocked us. Don't shoot the messenger, I'm just reporting what I have seen on the main boards.

How has that worked out for the Leafs?

Who cares about the main board. They laugh at the Leafs annual playoff failures also. Why you'd want that stink here is beyond me.

 

[Xspyrit]

How has that worked out for the Leafs?

Who cares about the main board. They laugh at the Leafs annual playoff failures also. Why you'd want that stink here is beyond me.

Pretty well if you look at results. Since Marner's rookie season in 2016-17, they have made the playoffs every season (even though they choked in the qualifying round of the first Covid season). So since 2016-17, they have the 3rd best record in the league by P% and the 2nd highest GF/GP. Very similar to Ottawa's 2000-08 teams but thankfully we won some rounds in the playoffs too

Don't worry, I have enjoyed their playoffs woes as much as anybody because they have some annoying posters on the main boards. I like to visit the main boards because I am a hockey fan and not just a Sens fan. I like to talk about a wide variety of subjects, even if often related to the Sens. I have zero animosity towards the Leafs, I don't really encounter Leafs fans in real life as I live in Montreal.

Finally, the "stink" of a player can change... Marian Hossa had a "stink", until it finally changed and he started winning Cups after 31 y/o. Look at Bobrovsky too. Same with the Sharks players. Is it really Paveslki, Marleau or even Thornton fault if they didn't win a Cup? Marner is really not the first player I would go after (like I said, many others before) but IF he wanted to come here as a FREE wallet and reasonable cap hit... it would be hard to say : "No thanks we are overflowing with talent and elite players who want to sign here"

 

[DueDiligence]

Pretty well if you look at results. Since Marner's rookie season in 2016-17, they have made the playoffs every season (even though they choked in the qualifying round of the first Covid season). So since 2016-17, they have the 3rd best record in the league by P% and the 2nd highest GF/GP. Very similar to Ottawa's 2000-08 teams but thankfully we won some rounds in the playoffs too

Many people would say the Leafs have underachieved considering they were lucky enough to draft a generational goal scorer in Matthews and 2 years later add Tavares, a former #1 OA , in his prime. Combined with Marner they should have won a number of playoff rounds.

 

[DylanSensFan]

The easy answer is the powerplay.

I don’t care how well defensively you are playing, the PP shouldn’t require that kind of attention to detail.

They need to open up that right side for Josh Norris one timers. They need to figure out a way to pull players to the left side. They also need to rotate Tim and Norris onto that right side, because Tim can shoot that mofo if he gets a pass. I think just opening up that one-timer could be enough to get some PP mojo going.

 

[aragorn]

- they are playing the best defensive hockey in yrs all the while under several unfortunate issues
- they have lacked their #1 goalie for a good number of games all yr
- they have had several injuries to key players forcing changes to the lineup numerous times
- this may have something to do with the low scoring although scoring is down throughout the entire NHL & they have had numerous opportunities & simply failed to bury more of their chances.
- they have plenty of skill & they have a couple of young guys who clearly have top six potential in Greig & Pinto once they get a little more experience. And they have a few more prospects who have top 9 potential & top 4 potential in Montgomery, Halliday & Yakemchuk who can all add some offence. And Merilainen is proving that maybe he is the #1 goalie of the future giving Ott some depth at almost every position. Matinpalo has played well, Sebrango has played well as has Kleven on D all yr.
- people seem to forget that most of our guys are still young even though some are entering their prime & they will all get better with experience. They should also add at least two good players to their prospect pool in this yr's draft & while they will potentially lose a 1st rd pick next yr & their 2nd they will still have a 3 3rd rd picks & maybe get lucky with later picks as they did with Batherson.
- IMO they are in great shape & should only get better if their key players can stay healthy.

 

[Tuna99]

Don't worry I'd much rather have Rantanen (or many others) but our top-6 will need a massive injection of skill. Problem is where to find it? We don't really have dispensable assets and it's hard to attract UFAs in their prime so what if Marner WANTS to come to Ottawa without asking too much? (let's say he would do 11 M$ x 7 years)

I understand the soft argument but for me it was always about MAKING the playoffs first and then we'll see. I have seen some Sens fans talk this way for years but... we kept missing the playoffs, which is why some outsiders mocked us. Don't shoot the messenger, I'm just reporting what I have seen on the main boards.



I would want him to make the playoffs every season though!



Damn, you better be right! As of now, I don't see it but of course I have the fan hope that it will happen. I believe we'll still need to make the right moves though.

I'm sorry, never been a big fan of blind optimism. Yeah it's cool to be 3rd at the moment but we could also be 7th with just 2 losses in a row... There's a lot to like about the season but it's hard for me to ignore that we are -13 at 5v5 hockey for example...

I believe this thread was made because there is Sens fans worried about the offense, as IIRC we were in the middle of being SHUTOUT 5 times in 11 games. I mean, it's a bit crazy to tell these people "blablabla" there's absolutely no reason for your concerns! Why not let them be? Do they tell you to NOT be positive? Why even come on the internet if all you guys want to see is 100% positivity?

Make another forum where it's prohibited to post something that is not 100% positive? I really don't get it lol

You’re not a victim of not being Mr 100% positive - this is what you wrote about a team that is 3rd in their division

People acting like there was no problem might just prefer to bury their heads in the sand. I want to win and I want it to be sustainable.

You’re the problem because Ottawa is winning and winning over 50 games and you’re acting like they are about to fall off a cliff and after 7 years of horrible disgusting hockey they are good and you act like it’s fake and my point is - it isn’t fake it’s real and it’s here for many years so enjoy it

 

[SanderSen]

"Brick by brick, my fellow citizens, brick by brick."

Ottawa is coming from a multi-year culture of cheating to create offense, lax team defence, and losing in the process. This year the team has been receptive to being defensively responsible that has required a rewiring of bad habits and instincts for a lot of players.

The turn around has been dramatic and the results in the standings show it is working. The next step of turning that into more offense is a work in progress. Step one though has been getting the defensive team work together.

 

[umma gumma]

Pretty well if you look at results. Since Marner's rookie season in 2016-17, they have made the playoffs every season (even though they choked in the qualifying round of the first Covid season). So since 2016-17, they have the 3rd best record in the league by P% and the 2nd highest GF/GP. Very similar to Ottawa's 2000-08 teams but thankfully we won some rounds in the playoffs too

Don't worry, I have enjoyed their playoffs woes as much as anybody because they have some annoying posters on the main boards. I like to visit the main boards because I am a hockey fan and not just a Sens fan. I like to talk about a wide variety of subjects, even if often related to the Sens. I have zero animosity towards the Leafs, I don't really encounter Leafs fans in real life as I live in Montreal.

Finally, the "stink" of a player can change... Marian Hossa had a "stink", until it finally changed and he started winning Cups after 31 y/o. Look at Bobrovsky too. Same with the Sharks players. Is it really Paveslki, Marleau or even Thornton fault if they didn't win a Cup? Marner is really not the first player I would go after (like I said, many others before) but IF he wanted to come here as a FREE wallet and reasonable cap hit... it would be hard to say : "No thanks we are overflowing with talent and elite players who want to sign here"

The results are that since then he's won one more playoff series than Brady. That's not pretty well. At all. They have severely underachieved.

Hossa never had a stink because he used to bust his ass in the playoffs and was the farthest thing from soft. Sens fans never wanted to get rid of Hossa; Leaf fans are ready to trade Marner after every first round exit.

 

[GCK]

I understand your POV but I don't think teams are going to restrain themselves from offering him big money. They are aware that he can't be your main actor to playoffs success but probably believe he has the talent to be part of the solution.

I expect Marner to accept a 12.5-13M 8 year deal with Toronto. They can’t afford to lose him.