Was Lemieux still in his peak in 1995-96?

[Video Nasty]

Of course not, but he was still the best forward by a large margin. He was also the best in 1996-1997, regardless of how much I loved Kariya.

 

[The Panther]

In the pre-game of this one they talked about some of the line combinations the Pens were messing with after they lost Sandstrom who really was an underrated component of the team that year. With a healthy Sandstrom, he was NOT himself in those playoffs and Francis, I'm 100% confident they wouldn't have stumbled against the Panthers

This is a random, but I almost lost my s*** laughing at how Ed Patterson (career of 68 games) takes out the Canucks' goalie... in classic late-90s' fashion, it's no penalty for what would probably be a match penalty and a suspension today:

 

[Pominville Knows]

Yes. Inflated PP totals or not, the guy scored 161 friggin points in 69 games with half a back and a cancer survivor. This is also at the onset of the DPE, where a 2nd line after Lemieux would sometimes see the likes of Dave Roche, Ian Moran, and Joe Dziedzic (sp).

Regarding that second line though... Petr friggin' Nedved scored 99 that year, and there are others as well. Come on now.

Edit: Yeah, have a look at that forward corps man. You even had Naslund playing there.

 

[HF007]

I am not sure I see even an argument, pre cancer 89-92 Lemieux find a way to score more than 1 goal in 7 games against the Panthers, +10 while scoring over an even strength point a game with those wingers and all of those being from his PK scoring?

He is just one of those that can still be a Art Ross an Hart winner not only past his peak but while missing games at the same time.

I disagree, he got introduced to modern goaltending and defensive schemes that we see today

 

[MadLuke]

I disagree, he got introduced to modern goaltending and defensive schemes that we see today

If the only one goal in 7 games to get eliminated of a series is not a strong enough arguments that Mario Lemieux was at one point better than he was in 95-96, what about:

NHL Stats

The official source for NHL Stats including skaters, goalies, teams stats and more.

www.nhl.com

most even strenght points
1989
Lemieux: 102 in 76 games (+41)
Yzeman: 101 in 80 games
Gretzky: 100 in 78 games

1993
Lemieux: 96 in 60 games (+55)
Yzerman: 87 in 84 games

1996:
Jagr: 95 in 82 games
Nedved: 76 in 80 games
Lindros: 75 in 73 games
Lemieux: 73 in 70 (+10, at least +9 of those coming from the PK play)

Peak Lemieux outscore the opposition more than that and does not have less even strength points than Peter Nedved (even if he has the chance to play with Lemieux)

 

[markymarc1215]

Regarding that second line though... Petr friggin' Nedved scored 99 that year, and there are others as well. Come on now.

Edit: Yeah, have a look at that forward corps man. You even had Naslund playing there.

You are right. I looked it up and the Pens had 7-8 legit top 6 forwards. They had Glen Murray on the 3rd line, so they were deep.

 

[JianYang]

This is so true. I still can't decide if the mid-/late-90s' NHL was a step up in quality or a step down in quality from, say, the late 80s' era. There had always been lots of violence, but somewhere around the mid-90s it became 'easier' for no-skill players to simply physically disable skilled players... and get away with it.

I still cringe when I think of François Leroux, for example, taking out Lafontaine with a shoulder to the head. Or the fact that Gino Odjick had a career.

Here's the NHL executives' response to superstars being pummeled by no-skill, six-foot six goons:

Full disclosure, I wasn't old enough to remember the 80s, but I've seen alot of video, and I thought there was alot of egregious hooking and holding going on back then too.

The big differences to me was that the game was becoming more of a science as the 90s progressed. Teams were becoming more robotic, and they were utilizing the hooking and holding into their systems. Coaches were turning teams into defensive machines. And of course, the goaltending was also evolving into a science with bigger equipment and more goalies adapting one general style.

80s hockey looked more fun because it it was less systems oriented, more chaotic, and there was still many different kinds of goalies with their unique brand of stopping pucks, but I think the hooking and holding tolerance was pretty similar with the 90s.

 

[markymarc1215]

Just hard to argue that 161 points in 69 games isn't a peak level performance for any player. We may never see another player get 161 points in a full 82 game season, and if they do, it will be lauded as the best season in the modern era without question.

 

[Pominville Knows]

Got it to 85+114 for 199 points by adding Lemieuxs 89 EV and SH with his 96 PP numbers, 73 games i guess.
I don't know man, that does not sound the same in my ears. He had lost a step but possibly gotten better on the PP.

Just hard to argue that 161 points in 69 games isn't a peak level performance for any player. We may never see another player get 161 points in a full 82 game season, and if they do, it will be lauded as the best season in the modern era without question.