Player Discussion Vitali Kravtsov - Signed 2-Year Deal with Traktor Chelyabinsk

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I think the other part that’s lost in these conversations is that the best depth players are typically failed top-six players. Targeting so called “high floor” players in the draft or via waivers is often the worst option. If you’re making small bets, better to do so on the Kravtsovs, Tolvanens, and Sprongs over the Will Lockwoods and Tim Schallers. Bottom-line for me is I’m completely fine seeing more of this from management.

Exactly. Kravtsov had a high ceiling and was a good gamble. And his acquisition cost is being compared to the 1 in 1000 a 7th rd pick looks like Joe Pavelski.

I totally get it's mostly all meaningless transactions I just don't understand how this trade specifically is being shat on.
 
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We'll see where Kravstov is at after his two-year contract in the KHL is up. I see that Will Lockwood is a Group VI UFA, because he hasn't played enough NHL games, so it's doubtful the Rangers re-up him. And a seventh rounder has about as much chance on hitting as a Lotto 649 ticket.

So it's probably a 'win-win' for the Canucks and Kravstov. He earns more money playing in the KHL than he would in Abbotsford, and still benefits from a high-level of pro competition. And the Canucks retain his rights.
 
Outside a handful of high probability options potentially on the waiver wire/in the UFA market, I’m not sure the difference in baseline probabilities and outcomes between waiver fodder, low picks, and UFAs really matter one way or another across the sample of players you’re going to be able to bet on.

Having a 3% or 5% shot at a player across 20 or 30 bets based on which avenue you take probably won’t make much of a difference, compared to luck or developing a competitive advantage in identifying good players, giving them good training, etc.

The caveat being that you probably shouldn’t trade picks for players you can likely get for free. Draft picks are the only group that you get to see the evolution of a player without tying up a roster/contract spot with so have a bit of an advantage over the other two options. If a player goes gangbusters in their D+1 or D+2 season, you learn that for free. If a UFA does the same you’re competing against every other team in the league for him.

I think where you are in the competitive cycle matters probably more for what path you should follow than the odds. This Canucks team needs players to hit now, so should are more justified in bringing forward their bets. Less so for the 2015 Canucks.
I remember this thread on twitter & instantly thought *you* would be the Will Hunting character in real life :





 
Outside a handful of high probability options potentially on the waiver wire/in the UFA market, I’m not sure the difference in baseline probabilities and outcomes between waiver fodder, low picks, and UFAs really matter one way or another across the sample of players you’re going to be able to bet on.

Having a 3% or 5% shot at a player across 20 or 30 bets based on which avenue you take probably won’t make much of a difference, compared to luck or developing a competitive advantage in identifying good players, giving them good training, etc.

The caveat being that you probably shouldn’t trade picks for players you can likely get for free. Draft picks are the only group that you get to see the evolution of a player without tying up a roster/contract spot with so have a bit of an advantage over the other two options. If a player goes gangbusters in their D+1 or D+2 season, you learn that for free. If a UFA does the same you’re competing against every other team in the league for him.

I think where you are in the competitive cycle matters probably more for what path you should follow than the odds. This Canucks team needs players to hit now, so should are more justified in bringing forward their bets. Less so for the 2015 Canucks.

I remember this thread on twitter & instantly thought *you* would be the Will Hunting character in real life :







i feel like this ends with a long moody drive with miss misery playing in the background
 
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Shirokov and goldobin both good answers

Was goldobin as overrated on this board as i think he would have been?
 

I don't think anyone really cared by the time Goldobin left. Shirokov still had a small contingent of folks pining for his return for a bit there.

Not sure if he quite counts as it's obviously a different situation, but we're leaving out Larionov refusing to re-sign so that the Russian government wouldn't get a cut of his money, playing a year in Switzerland, and subsequently going to San Jose on waivers.
 
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Just hard to predict the outcome for Russian players. Valeri Nichushkin busted hard with Dallas; returned to the KHL for a couple of years, and then came back a new player.

Another Dallas first rounder Denis Guryanov got off to decent start and is now bouncing around the league.

So there's still a chance Kravstov returns to NA after his two-year contract is up......what kind of player he'll be is a complete mystery. But the odds aren't good.
 
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Just hard to predict the outcome for Russian players. Valeri Nichushkin busted hard with Dallas; returned to the KHL for a couple of years, and then came back a new player.

Another Dallas first rounder Denis Guryanov got off to decent start and is now bouncing around the league.

So there's still a chance Kravstov returns to NA after his two-year contract is up......what kind of player he'll be is a complete mystery. But the odds aren't good.
We still have his rights by then and maybe he’ll try to come back and see if we get another Kuzmenko
 
Just hard to predict the outcome for Russian players. Valeri Nichushkin busted hard with Dallas; returned to the KHL for a couple of years, and then came back a new player.

Another Dallas first rounder Denis Guryanov got off to decent start and is now bouncing around the league.

So there's still a chance Kravstov returns to NA after his two-year contract is up......what kind of player he'll be is a complete mystery. But the odds aren't good.

Nichushkin put up 10 points in 57 games the year he came back from the KHL. Before leaving for the KHL, he'd been a ~30 point guy in his D+1 and D+3, even after missing basically his entire D+2 due to injury.
 
Shirokov and goldobin both good answers

Was goldobin as overrated on this board as i think he would have been?

I don't think Goldy was ever overrated on this board. Shirokov keeping up with Goldy the past 3 KHL seasons is pretty incredible.
 
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Just hard to predict the outcome for Russian players. Valeri Nichushkin busted hard with Dallas; returned to the KHL for a couple of years, and then came back a new player.

Another Dallas first rounder Denis Guryanov got off to decent start and is now bouncing around the league.

So there's still a chance Kravstov returns to NA after his two-year contract is up......what kind of player he'll be is a complete mystery. But the odds aren't good.

Evgeny Dadonov is another who scored 8 goals in 55 AHL games when he left NA in 2012 and then returned in 2017 as a 65-point NHLer.

So it's not impossible and is worth retaining his rights to see if something weird happens.
 
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