Lehner will get paid, but is not counting against the cap

[tantalum]

It's a Lehner win more than anything. I don't think there was any way he would count towards the cap given he did not satisfy his end of the bargain. Same as any other contract violation.

A recent example was Nichuskin who was suspended and in the assistance program. He did not count against the Avs cap.

 

[Romang67]

Pretty sure every other team would’ve had to put him on LTIR. But apparently Vegas is allowed to somehow pay him but not have any salary cap consequences whatsoever for…reasons????

Would they have? He didn't show up to take his physical. Could they even have put him on LITR without that?

IMO, weirdest thing about all of this (except Lehner, of course), is that Lehner is getting paid. He's in breach of contract. Not sure what's going on there.

 

[Blueline Bomber]

I'm guessing what's happened is that Lehner isn't able to pass the physical to be considered to be on LTIR. Vegas probably terminated his contract after that, but because everyone is aware of Lehner's mental and financial situation, they're still willing to pay the remainder of his contract, as long as it doesn't count against their cap to do so.

 

[JianYang]

serious answer: I think Vegas obviously get perks but I don't really see it here? Players are required under the CBA to take physicals. By missing his, Lehner violated the CBA. If anything this is just a win for Lehner who still gets paid despite Vegas having a strong argument to terminate his contract? Or rather a win for his numerous creditors.

joke answer: League also announces Vegas gets Ottawa's 2027 1st round pick

Did he not report to camp? Not reporting to camp sounds like a breach of contract to me. It's reasonable to me then to conclude that his salary shouldn't count towards the cap, because a breach of contract like that probably means that he's not getting a paycheque from the knights regardless.

 

[M88K]

This doesn't feel like a gift to Vegas but a gift to Lehner.

Vegas wanted to cancel his contract (valid reason to do so) Means no cap hit and no money.
They got no cap hit, but still have to pay the money.
Seems like this is the first time they've actually gotten a negative from the league.

 

[hangman005]

 

[LOFIN]

It's a Lehner win more than anything. I don't think there was any way he would count towards the cap given he did not satisfy his end of the bargain. Same as any other contract violation.

A recent example was Nichuskin who was suspended and in the assistance program. He did not count against the Avs cap.

If the Avalanche were applied to the same standards, I'm pretty sure they would be happy to tell Nuke to stay the f*** away in Russia snorting coke and collecting pay cheques, if that opened up the Avs over 6M in capspace. They are currently talking about welcoming Nuke back because they don't have any other option.

 

[Tobias Kahun]

Would they have? He didn't show up to take his physical. Could they even have put him on LITR without that?

IMO, weirdest thing about all of this (except Lehner, of course), is that Lehner is getting paid. He's in breach of contract. Not sure what's going on there.

Clearly he’s not in breach and Vegas tried to terminate him unfairly.

 

[HanSolo]

This doesn't feel like a gift to Vegas but a gift to Lehner.

Vegas wanted to cancel his contract (valid reason to do so) Means no cap hit and no money.
They got no cap hit, but still have to pay the money.
Seems like this is the first time they've actually gotten a negative from the league.

No but you see, having one extra LTIR slot is a massive unfair advantage.

 

[Romang67]

Clearly he’s not in breach and Vegas tried to terminate him unfairly.

Is that clear? If so, why isn't he on LTIR, or even just on the team?

 

[HanSolo]

Clearly he’s not in breach and Vegas tried to terminate him unfairly.

How is failing to report to camp to take a mandatory physical not breach, exactly?

 

[tantalum]

If the Avalanche were applied to the same standards, I'm pretty sure they would be happy to tell Nuke to stay the f*** away in Russia snorting coke and collecting pay cheques, if that opened up the Avs over 6M in capspace.

And that would have happened if he was refused re-instatement. But while in the program that was exactly the standard. He was under a contract suspension and he did not count against the cap. The difference is he wasn't paid and wouldn't get paid but the Avs did and would have the cap space.

This is a win for Lehner more than anything as he violates his contact conditions and somehow still gets paid. But it's a violation and as such is under a contract suspension for playing purposes so he shouldn't count against the cap. Just like every other player on contract suspension.

 

[Tobias Kahun]

How is failing to report to camp to take a mandatory physical not breach, exactly?

So if he was actually in breach of his contract, he’d be getting zero money.

Rich people aren’t just giving away millions for fun

 

[Jee]

That's what happens when Arizona isn't in the league anymore to eat salary cap.

 

[hangman005]

Pretty sure every other team would’ve had to put him on LTIR. But apparently Vegas is allowed to somehow pay him but not have any salary cap consequences whatsoever for…reasons????

Probably because he didn't show up for his medical so he could be put on LTIR. The only one who seems to actually have benefit is Lehner who still gets paid instead of having is contract terminated.

 

[HanSolo]

So if he was actually in breach of his contract, he’d be getting zero money.

Rich people aren’t just giving away millions for fun

Hence why this isn't a "big win" for Vegas. The fact that Lehner failed to appear for his physical is material fact. It's not a question. That's a breach of the contract. You don't think the Vegas org could think of a better use for 5 million real dollars than helping Lehner pay off his creditors? They tried to terminate the contract, the NHL didn't let them.

 

[LOFIN]

And that would have happened if he was refused re-instatement. But while in the program that was exactly the standard. He was under a contract suspension and he did not count against the cap. The difference is he wasn't paid and wouldn't get paid but the Avs did and would have the cap space.

This is a win for Lehner more than anything as he violates his contact conditions and somehow still gets paid. But it's a violation and as such is under a contract suspension for playing purposes so he shouldn't count against the cap. Just like every other player on contract suspension.

The point here is this: this allows teams get out of players cap hit by paying them to stay away. Of course the teams would prefer to terminate the contract, but that would be grieved 99% of the time by the NHLPA and would be a mess. This is a clean way to get out of a cap burden.

 

[oXo Cube]

I get the process here, but seems like a questionable precedent.

What's to stop any other LTIRetired player from just not reporting and 'reaching a settlement' that has them get paid anyway?

 

[LOFIN]

Probably because he didn't show up for his medical so he could be put on LTIR. The only one who seems to actually have benefit is Lehner who still gets paid instead of having is contract terminated.

NO. Vegas is benefiting that they don't have to fight Lehner in an appeal to get out of his cap hit, and that might not even be guaranteed to happen. Retroactive caphits can occur for terminations gone bad.

The owner is losing money, but from the team sporting perspective Vegas is absolutely doing a highway robbery here. And a lot of the teams in this league would probably be more than happy to spend extra to gain more capspace. Not all owners, but plenty of them.

 

[HanSolo]

NO. Vegas is benefiting that they don't have to fight Lehner in an appeal to get out of his cap hit, and that might not even be guaranteed to happen. Retroactive caphits can occur for terminations gone bad.

The owner is losing money, but from the team sporting perspective Vegas is absolutely doing a highway robbery here. And a lot of the teams in this league would probably be more than happy to spend extra to gain more capspace. Not all owners, but plenty of them.

This only makes sense if Lehner was actively trying to make the team and there was a possibility he could've been cleared. Odds are Lehner would've failed the physical, would've been put right back on LTIR and wouldn't have counted against the cap anyway. The only material difference is it's one less LTIR slot filled up. I don't see that as some grievous injustice to the rest of the league.

 

[KrisLetAngry]

I see both sides of it.

Vegas is paying Lehner but not on LTIR.

Vegas will be in LTIR at some point this year soon don't worry guys.

A small small advantage but in reality he didn't meet his contract obligations.

Players union wins by keeping Lehner paid.

NHL / Vegas win by having him off the boons.

 

[All Mod Cons]

Is there a team that makes HF whine more than the VGK?

Toronto

 

[SoupNazi]

I don’t really see this as a gift to Vegas. Lehner, yes. Vegas, no.

 

[LOFIN]

The only material difference is it's one less LTIR slot filled up. I don't see that as some grievous injustice to the rest of the league.

Which, if you are at all familiar with how the NHL salary cap works, is VERY SIGNIFFICANT! Teams want to avoid using LTIR if they can, because that accrues cap space. LTIR is not a "get out of jail free" card, it has consequences.

 

[McHelpus]

Vegas is now under the cap with this no? How is this not a gift to them?