PGT: USA vs Europe - Europe 3 United States 0 F

[Sanderson]

Ovechkin is #1. Did you watch the playoffs at all?

Two rounds of playoffs don't define whether a player is better than others. Oshie is quite clearly behind Ovechkin, Bäckström and Kuznetsov, making him most definately not the second best forward on the team.

That is even more true if you consider that Oshie
a) just had the first good playoffs of his career (6th attempt)
b) was still outscored by Bäckström
c) was significantly behind the other three over the much longer regular season

It's nice that Oshie finally looked good in the playoffs, but that doesn't negate all the other games that have been played.

 

[CrypTic]

Ovechkin is #1. Did you watch the playoffs at all?

That's what s/he's saying. Someone said Oshie was the 2nd best Caps player and s/he responded by listing Ovie, Backstrom and Kuzy, presumably to show that, at best, Oshie was the 4th best player.

Not sure why you got snippy about it.

 

[Scotty B]

Exactly my thoughts. I wrote earlier along the same lines - you just won't win against Canada by trying to push them around. Not even a skilled Team Canada will bend. They might not come back and dominate physically but they will absolutely not give an inch.

Maybe they learned from it, BUT TC lost the first exhibition game vs Yanks ( with Crosby in lineup ) and despite shot totals heavily in their favor, I thought loss was deserved.

Yanks dominated down low and got behind our D, time after time...Not only that but TC had plenty of walking wounded after that game and are probably still paying for it, even if we ignore that Yanks basically ended Seguin's tourney...

Team USA didn't bring anywhere near the same intensity vs T Euro, and although part of the problem was doubtless the bonehead decision to sit Buff, the rest is very difficult to understand???

No intensity, poor game plan...no push back and nothing effective, in terms of on the fly tactical adjustments either...

Team USA fans are right to be irate, and their media are justified in roasting Torts et al in effigy...

Especially after all that brash talk about wanting to emulate their 96 World Cup Team...that was a shameful, shameful display

 

[Rebels57]

This will hopefully be it for Burke, Holmgren, Lombardi and Tortorella with Team USA.

They could have had a defense of this:

McDonagh - Faulk
Carlson - Byfuglien
E. Johnson - Shattenkirk

Three well balanced units that have someone that can actually move the puck and support the offense.

Don't even get me started on Dubinsky, Backes, and Abdelkader.

 

[Big McLargehuge]

Hah, love it. Really hoping the rest of the tournament goes about as well as this for the US so the cavemen in charge of things are never allowed near Team USA ever again.

 

[Rabid Ranger]

This will hopefully be it for Burke, Holmgren, Lombardi and Tortorella with Team USA.

They could have had a defense of this:

McDonagh - Faulk
Carlson - Byfuglien
E. Johnson - Shattenkirk

Three well balanced units that have someone that can actually move the puck and support the offense.

Don't even get me started on Dubinsky, Backes, and Abdelkader.

I have to agree overall, although I think Backes was fine for a 4th line role. He's still a legit top six forward on a contender. I really wanted to rationalize the way this team was created but it looks 1) it's going to be ineffective overall 2) the players themselves aren't buying in. This might be one of those disasters that actually forces change.

 

[CrypTic]

This will hopefully be it for Burke, Holmgren, Lombardi and Tortorella with Team USA.

They could have had a defense of this:

McDonagh - Faulk
Carlson - Byfuglien
E. Johnson - Shattenkirk

Three well balanced units that have someone that can actually move the puck and support the offense.

Don't even get me started on Dubinsky, Backes, and Abdelkader.

It's unfortunate. I want to root for the USA but I can't bc of Torts and also who was left off (Tyler Johnson, Kessel before he had surgery, Faulk/Shattenkirk or other d-men, others), which is mostly on Lombardi. My main hope is that Lombardi and Torts are never invited back to lead/coach Team USA.

 

[Rebels57]

It's unfortunate. I want to root for the USA but I can't bc of Torts and also who was left off (Tyler Johnson, Kessel before he had surgery, Faulk/Shattenkirk or other d-men, others), which is mostly on Lombardi. My main hope is that Lombardi and Torts are never invited back to lead/coach Team USA.

That really is all we can hope for because if the NHL sends players to the Olympics in 2018, they are going to have all of these young guys from Team NA to pick from like Matthews, Gaudreau, Eichel, Ghost, etc and I don't want those jackasses messing up what could be a serious Gold contender.

 

[Dr. Ogrodnick]

It's unfortunate. I want to root for the USA but I can't bc of Torts and also who was left off (Tyler Johnson, Kessel before he had surgery, Faulk/Shattenkirk or other d-men, others), which is mostly on Lombardi. My main hope is that Lombardi and Torts are never invited back to lead/coach Team USA.

Can't see how they stick around unless the US surprises and beats Canada. Otherwise this tourney is a fiasco. Torts is a one trick pony, and his trick is being phased out of the NHL and is completely wrong for this kind of tourney.

 

[pucka lucka]

Is Torts really the best the Team USA could do? I mean an blowhard retread that players hate for a short tournament with the elite seems like the opposite of what you'd want.

NHL is so far behind the other 3 major sports in terms of coaching and team management. You know why Abdelkader is on an NHL team? Because the talent isn't deep enough to be able to choose a T. Johnson or Ryan or Kessel instead of him.

 

[Sensinitis]

This will hopefully be it for Burke, Holmgren, Lombardi and Tortorella with Team USA.

They could have had a defense of this:

McDonagh - Faulk
Carlson - Byfuglien
E. Johnson - Shattenkirk

Three well balanced units that have someone that can actually move the puck and support the offense.

Don't even get me started on Dubinsky, Backes, and Abdelkader.

Come on, that D is almost just as bad as the current one...
They need guys to move the puck man. Guys that can move well, combined with a few responsible, safety type of guys. Btw, mcdonagh on the 1st pair ? Seriously?

Suter - Carlson
Yandle - Erik Johnson
Fowler - Faulk
Shattenkirk/Byfuglien

Something of the sort would be nice. Yandle is absolutely necessary to this team. With the speed they got on the wing with Kane Wheeler Pacioretty, and if they had acted rationnally and picked Kessel, it would be very beneficial.

Suter, Carlson and EJ are all more than solid in their own zone. Fowler and Faulk can hold their own.
Buff is good but he hasnt been overly impressive internationally and he can be a real liability.

 

[Uncle Bill]

Maybe they learned from it, BUT TC lost the first exhibition game vs Yanks ( with Crosby in lineup ) and despite shot totals heavily in their favor, I thought loss was deserved.

Yanks dominated down low and got behind our D, time after time...Not only that but TC had plenty of walking wounded after that game and are probably still paying for it, even if we ignore that Yanks basically ended Seguin's tourney...

Team USA didn't bring anywhere near the same intensity vs T Euro, and although part of the problem was doubtless the bonehead decision to sit Buff, the rest is very difficult to understand???

No intensity, poor game plan...no push back and nothing effective, in terms of on the fly tactical adjustments either...

Team USA fans are right to be irate, and their media are justified in roasting Torts et al in effigy...

Especially after all that brash talk about wanting to emulate their 96 World Cup Team...that was a shameful, shameful display

Several things to consider...

Much of the US's hard-nosed plays that game were reckless cheap shots. Too many in fact. The play that injured Seguin was another reckless play, this time suter using his stick to take Seguin's feet out resulting in a serious injury.

Quick was outstanding. He alone won that game. Price was weak.

I'm not saying the USA can't beat Canada. I'm saying going all truculent alone won't turn the trick. And if the USA starts running Canada when it matters, you will see a much different reaction from Canada.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Several things to consider...

Much of the US's hard-nosed plays that game were reckless cheap shots. Too many in fact. The play that injured Seguin was another reckless play, this time suter using his stick to take Seguin's feet out resulting in a serious injury.

Quick was outstanding. He alone won that game. Price was weak.

I'm not saying the USA can't beat Canada. I'm saying going all truculent alone won't turn the trick. And if the USA starts running Canada when it matters, you will see a much different reaction from Canada.

Like father like son. Team USA should focus on beating the teams it should beat first.

 

[Uncle Bill]

Buff is good but he hasnt been overly impressive internationally and he can be a real liability.

Until this tourney, buff has never played internationally. And last season Buff scored more goals and more points than any other American defenceman.

 

[TheBigThree]

Not having Byfuglien in the line up yesterday still boggles my mind. He was literally crucial in the win over Canada and in pre-tournament.

 

[Bixby Snyder]

Like father like son. Team USA should focus on beating the teams it should beat first.

Gary is Ryan's uncle not father.

 

[pucka lucka]

Like father like son. Team USA should focus on beating the teams it should beat first.

Suter? Gary is his uncle. If that's what you were getting at....

 

[Scotty B]

Several things to consider...

Much of the US's hard-nosed plays that game were reckless cheap shots. Too many in fact. The play that injured Seguin was another reckless play, this time suter using his stick to take Seguin's feet out resulting in a serious injury.

Quick was outstanding. He alone won that game. Price was weak.

I'm not saying the USA can't beat Canada. I'm saying going all truculent alone won't turn the trick. And if the USA starts running Canada when it matters, you will see a much different reaction from Canada.

Some of it was. When Couture's head was driven into boards ( man he looked concussed , surprised he's Ok) that was partly his fault for being so low. Kesler driving Weber head first into the boards was a dirty play, surprised it wasn't worthy of a I game suspension. Play where Seguin gets sent feet first into boards was also dirty, as was the blindside shot Giroux took in the back ( think he's still nursing a hurt ).

Still if you take away about 3 cheap shots, Yanks played well. They were much more efficient offensively cause they got behind our D and dominated down low. Gotta credit them there. Sure Price gave up a bad rebound resulting in a goal. BUT, in the main, that game was just a case of Yanks sending a message/wanting it more.

If we see another game like that first one, not only may it seriously hurt TC's chances of winning this tourney, -- may not have enough healthy bodies -- Team USA may well win that game. If they do, can't see them losing to Czechs...Big Hill to climb, but start by winning on Teusday and they likely make sudden death round, where anything can happen...

 

[Rebels57]

Come on, that D is almost just as bad as the current one...
They need guys to move the puck man. Guys that can move well, combined with a few responsible, safety type of guys. Btw, mcdonagh on the 1st pair ? Seriously?

Suter - Carlson
Yandle - Erik Johnson
Fowler - Faulk
Shattenkirk/Byfuglien

Something of the sort would be nice. Yandle is absolutely necessary to this team. With the speed they got on the wing with Kane Wheeler Pacioretty, and if they had acted rationnally and picked Kessel, it would be very beneficial.

Suter, Carlson and EJ are all more than solid in their own zone. Fowler and Faulk can hold their own.
Buff is good but he hasnt been overly impressive internationally and he can be a real liability.

That was my mistake leaving Suter off. He would obviously still be there.

Shattenkirk and Faulk are both excellent puck-movers though. As is Yandle so having him involved would be great. Cam Fowler has no business being on the team over McDonagh though.

 

[Uncle Bill]

Which type of game is more likely to happen? The first USA - Canada game or the second?

With torts coaching, I'm less concerned with the USA.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Which type of game is more likely to happen? The first USA - Canada game or the second?

With torts coaching, I'm less concerned with the USA.

Well, for the most part Canada did outplay and outchance the US team in the first meeting, but Quick was the difference maker and Price performed poorly.

If the US gives up as many chances as they gave up against Europe, then Canada will easily crush them. There's only so much a goalie can do, and giving up a flurry of outnumbered chances isn't going to lead to much success.

What an embarrassment will it be when this team fails to advance to the elimination round.

 

[ijuka]

Which type of game is more likely to happen? The first USA - Canada game or the second?

With torts coaching, I'm less concerned with the USA.

Czech Republic vs Team Europe is played before this match.

The outcome of that match changes many things. If Team Europe wins, it's a must win for Team USA or they are guaranteed to be out of semi finals.

 

[Scotty B]

Well, for the most part Canada did outplay and outchance the US team in the first meeting, but Quick was the difference maker and Price performed poorly.

If the US gives up as many chances as they gave up against Europe, then Canada will easily crush them. There's only so much a goalie can do, and giving up a flurry of outnumbered chances isn't going to lead to much success.

What an embarrassment will it be when(/if ) this team fails to advance to the elimination round.

That's why I expect Yanks to bring their A game on Teusday, that + the hate they have for living largely in the shadow of their cross border rival. This will probably be the most intense/physical game of the tourney...

Hope TC hasn't let their insurance lapse

 

[Corax]

Tatar is 30+ scorer with 3rd line minutes. Gaborik when healthy is top 10 goal per game player, Hossa is what every team needs. Brings leadership same with Chara. You add a ton of talent to Slovak team, what was the plan? Kopitar, Nielsen, Draisaitl, Josi, Niederreiter.
What did anyone expect? That Team Europe will use pre-tournament to show off? Hossa probably did not even skate. At 37, you want to keep energy for important games.

Ask NYI about Nielsen, they tell you that he is underrated center. They played well against youngsters, but if your goalie allows 4 goals in spam of few minutes. It was 5:4 by middle of 3rd period. And then Sweden they played what they needed.

Everyone of them knows D first. Played in Wild, Kings, Bruins, Red Wings. Are these some 4th liners or what? Weak defense, bad goalie? Where did you see the weak spot to roll over Team Europe? Heart? If they can play with engagement for a team from another side of globe, why would they play bad here?

Energy was not there last game. Who says Canada wins because you lost to Europe? A guy with make up on TV?

Team US was not better, not even on the paper. And those few players would change little. team Europe is well balanced team that knows how to play D and has ton of skill to capitalize.
It is one game. If this was the series, second game could have ended exactly opposite. This is hockey. You dont win games by being the most hyped team to pump up TV ratings in NA. It is played on ice.

 

[Scotty B]

Tatar is 30+ scorer with 3rd line minutes. Gaborik when healthy is top 10 goal per game player, Hossa is what every team needs. Brings leadership same with Chara. You add a ton of talent to Slovak team, what was the plan? Kopitar, Nielsen, Draisaitl, Josi, Niederreiter.
What did anyone expect? That Team Europe will use pre-tournament to show off? Hossa probably did not even skate. At 37, you want to keep energy for important games.

Ask NYI about Nielsen, they tell you that he is underrated center. They played well against youngsters, but if your goalie allows 4 goals in spam of few minutes. It was 5:4 by middle of 3rd period. And then Sweden they played what they needed.

Everyone of them knows D first. Played in Wild, Kings, Bruins, Red Wings. Are these some 4th liners or what? Weak defense, bad goalie? Where did you see the weak spot to roll over Team Europe? Heart? If they can play with engagement for a team from another side of globe, why would they play bad here?

Energy was not there last game. Who says Canada wins because you lost to Europe? A guy with make up on TV?

Team US was not better, not even on the paper. And those few players would change little. team Europe is well balanced team that knows how to play D and has ton of skill to capitalize.
It is one game. If this was the series, second game could have ended exactly opposite. This is hockey. You dont win games by being the most hyped team to pump up TV ratings in NA. It is played on ice.

Team Europe played well and were full value for their victory. People underestimated them sans doubt. They were patient, tactically superior and jumped on their opportunities to counterattack with both numbers and speed...resulting in many, many odd man rushes. Really, except for a few moments on pp, Yanks never threatened/ never looked capable of mounting a comeback. And Quick, despite what some people are saying to the contrary, was in no way to blame. That 3rd goal was a lucky deflection, and the first two goals? Man, he had NO CHANCE...