GDT: UFA Frenzy 2024 - We're ALL Gonna Die

[bleedgreen]

The nonverbals and the non-elaborative answer from Tulsky struck me as “I knew he was frustrated but was surprised he left when he did.” I think this was brewing under the surface, people knew of the ongoing difficulties of working with Dundon (and let’s be honest, so did we, they were just always spun as good-natured and playful “oh that darn Dundon!” type ribbing in the public eye), but the actual quitting part of it came out of left field operationally.

I listened to it last night, so I don’t remember the exact wording and tone, but in the moment it struck me as “we didn’t know he was leaving” and then a palpable “dot dot dot” that contained the true story.

Of course it’s all open to interpretation. I think it’s fair to say Tulsky has way more to say and isn’t going to. We’re all going to read between the lines the way we see it individually. I found Rod’s statement about DW being a buffer and the way he said it very telling about what it’s like to work for TD. At least to be the guy in Rod’s shoes.

We’re an interesting team to say the least.

Sounds like Jake had played them like a fiddle making them think he was staying leading to going cold on Skjei and Pesce

I took it from the comments that holding the money for Jake had an impact elsewhere. Either for keeping guys or getting guys, and the way Rod is I think it’s keeping guys. We maybe keep one of Skjei or Pesce if we knew earlier we were out on Jake. At least in Rod’s mind.

 

[Svechhammer]

in the wake of all this Waddell talk, how f***ing cool is it that a guy who started as an intern with the Canes is now the Team President 20 years later?


And you guys wonder why “insiders” are wrong all the time. The two of you can’t even get the same story from presumably reliable sources.

To be fair my source has recently moved to Columbus to take on new employment opportunities, so...

Let's just say I probably won't be as well connected anymore, lol

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

I may be putting words in @Boom Boom Apathy 's mouth, but I think everyone who is mentioning more responsibility for Don is in the GM role specifically, not the total of number of roles he had (such as president) and has now.

Correct. The Canes have been a GM by committee with an owner that is hands on talking with agents, talking to the league, doing negotiations himself, etc.. Waddell's role as GM wasn't a traditional GM role.

It can be frustrating to work in that environment over a long period of time if an owner/boss above you is overly involved in your day to day responsibilities.

 

[AD Skinner]

Given Rod's comments about not liking how We do negotiations and I definitely think this is his last contract with us.

I think it’s likely going to be his last anyway. I’ve always kinda seen his whole motivation as returning the team he feels like most defined his career to respectability. He’s done that, and is close to winning it all with them again- if he does that in the next five years I think he rides off into the sunset. If he doesn’t, the team is likely headed toward a down period just due to the cyclical nature of pro sports and he doesn’t need to be around for that, he’s done what he set out to do.

This is all complete armchair psych 101 bullshit though so who the hell knows

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

DW is reported to be very wealthy from Atl real estate deals. I don’t put stock in him leaving just for $$$.

I didn't say it was just for $$$. But I also know a lot of rich people that still have money play a part in their decisions.

Rather, with the huge re-development coming downstream he judged that the workload would be too much at his age and take him away from what he prefers, hockey operations.

And my point was that in Carolina, his role in hockey operations was likely less than he'd like with the "Borg" mentality and an owner who is so hands on.

 

[A Star is Burns]

Brindy isn't built for things like the offseason and its personnel moves, contract negotiations, and preseason. He is built for the season and the playoffs. I think a lot of his frustration that you could feel and hear at times in the interview is reflective of the things that he doesn't care about being front and center right now. And, as he mentioned, of course he's frustrated that the business side eroded some talent and removed some guys he's gotten to know for many years now. I think once the season rolls around, he'll be fine and a lot of this will melt away.

Waddell, I'm not really sure what's to be gained at this point. I'm in the camp that doubts it was any one thing. I think there's a decent chance he would have worked things out here, even if there were some issues, if the Columbus job hadn't been still sitting open.

Tulsky did mostly give generic non answers in his portion. I think he'll always have a bit of that in him because it's probably just part of his experiences and who he is. But as he grows in the position and gains experience, we might get a little more honesty/transparency from him. I liked that he mentioned that what their scouts really tried to look for in free agency was for things that Rod values that maybe not a lot of other coaches value. I do think we occasionally have tried to fit guys in that might not be the best fits even if they were really talented in the past. We'll see how it works out.

I also thought the small piece Tulsky talked about our internal cap software was interesting. His main point about being able to not only look at what guys are available, but what guys are available that our scouting has ranked as a B+ or better. I also thought the somewhat related point of always making sure that you have a certain amount of cap flexibility so that you can pounce on a potential franchise changer was a good one as well. It's good to know we'll still be on the hunt for those types.

I also think you could tell there was a large amount of frustration from both on the Guentzel front. I think they both thought that was getting done and then a wrench got thrown in things. Brindy hated it because it probably made it more of a certainty we'd lose guys like Skjei and Pesce because there was no time to pivot there, and Tulsky mentioned about having to be ready to pivot to B, C, and D plans when things don't go as planned. It definitely changed the trajectory of things going forward big time.

 

[Stickpucker]

I do not get the impression that Dundon led to the departure of Waddell. He just had an opportunity pop up that pulled him in stronger than his desire to stay, and leaving was not an easy choice to make.

That is part of the risk though when you tell people to go find what you're worth.

Hey...turns out I'm worth 3x as much and these guys don't want me dealing with trivial bullshit I don't care about and are empowering me on the things I do.

Nice knowing you!

 

[Blueline Bomber]

I think it’s likely going to be his last anyway. I’ve always kinda seen his whole motivation as returning the team he feels like most defined his career to respectability. He’s done that, and is close to winning it all with them again- if he does that in the next five years I think he rides off into the sunset. If he doesn’t, the team is likely headed toward a down period just due to the cyclical nature of pro sports and he doesn’t need to be around for that, he’s done what he set out to do.

This is all complete armchair psych 101 bullshit though so who the hell knows

I think the only other team he may coach is Philadelphia. He may take a year or two off from coaching, but if Philly comes calling about a job opening, I wouldn't be surprised if he answers.

 

[Borsig]

You know what? About the only person who isn't tired of Dundon's bullshit is Dundon.

Taking out upper bowl seats, nickel and diming RBA and the players, Turning BYB into a sportsbook, ticket prices going WAY up, and so on. I've had about enough of the dude, even if he did het rid of the cancer that was Karmonos.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

Lol.

Reinhart signs for under value in Florida. What a win for Florida

Carolina tries the same thing. Man what POS Dundon is. That dude just tries to win every contract negotiation.

Classic

 

[Joe McGrath]

I think the only other team he may coach is Philadelphia. He may take a year or two off from coaching, but if Philly comes calling about a job opening, I wouldn't be surprised if he answers.

I think thats possible. I also think its pretty likely he doesn’t need that stress on his late 50s (assuming he stays his whole contract here).

I think its more likely that he coaches little Slavo, etc for the JR Canes than put himself through this shit anymore. Then again, money talks.

 

[Borsig]

His bullshit caused Guentz to walk and you know it.

 

[Daeavorn]

Ok Re
OK Reach Armstrong.

There is nothing but fear mongering with zero evidence. This approach has had us in contention for 5 years so until there is some noticeable drop off its just bitching to bitch.

Every step of the way, because this approach is different its been condemned, yet here we are a top 5 team over that span in wins.

Also there was long trepidation and concern Rod wasn't going to re sign to his current contract and once it was done he said there was never a doubt.

Step off the ledge and let them do what they do

Well I really touched a nerve there huh?

I'm not the kind of person that just trusts leadership blindly.

Tom Dundon is clearly shown to have a grading rough personality that wears on people over time.

We have multiple people citing that the contract negotiation while not the sole reason done left definitely played a part.

I also think that Dundon messing with the season ticket packages and removing some seating as well as raising prices requires him to maintain the current level of success otherwise fans are going to leave and do something else.

I'm nowhere near jumping off a ledge to be honest.

I'm simply stating my opinion and what I believe.

P.S. I think that if Rod never wins an ECF game during his tenure as our head coach and we end up going 0-8 or 0-12, it's hard for me to say that was successful in and of itself.

 

[AD Skinner]

Going 0-12 in the ECF would mean you won two playoff rounds in a year 3 different times. When you’re talking about coaches who have done that you’re talking about very successful ones

 

[Big Daddy Cane]

Random thoughts:

It's an exciting lineup in the sense that there are few combos that really jump out at you. Aho will have Jarvis/Necas to his right at full health. Barring the cliff, Burns will be next to Slavin. Anything can happen with the rest.

If he stays, I wonder about Drury as a full-time winger. He played next to Staal during the 2023 playoffs. Does he actually have chemistry with Necas or was that a function of timing? Play them both with Aho and see if Svechnikov+Jarvis can elevate Kuznetsov/Kotkaniemi/Roslovic.

I know there's a desire towards a superline of some sort, but I don't think the depth is there to do it before the in-season trade market opens. Speaking of, one guy that would make a lot of sense in this lineup later on: Nino Niederreiter.

 

[Blueline Bomber]

Lol.

Reinhart signs for under value in Florida. What a win for Florida

Carolina tries the same thing. Man what POS Dundon is. That dude just tries to win every contract negotiation.

Classic

Reinhart signed under value in Florida just like Slavin signed under value with us. Both organizations knew their players well, knew they could probably get more, but signed cheaper to help the team.

But those are rarities, not the norm. The norm is that players know what they're worth, usually have a number in mind that matches closely to what other similar players have received, and trying to get them to deviate millions away from that number is just insulting.

 

[Boom Boom Apathy]

Ah, the off-season.

Yesterday we spent 4 pages arguing the merits of Necas not signing an extension based on a tweet from noted twitter insider HasbolaCanes (admittedly, probably 20% of the posts were mine). Today, based on a press conference, we've spent a few pages discussing all the possible reasons why Waddell left, and how we are sick of Dundon because of it.

 

[SlavinAway]

Ah, the off-season.

Yesterday we spent 4 pages arguing the merits of Necas not signing an extension based on a tweet from noted twitter insider HasbolaCanes (admittedly, probably 20% of the posts were mine). Today, based on a press conference, we've spent a few pages discussing all the possible reasons why Waddell left, and how we are sick of Dundon because of it.

Those are rookie numbers. We can do better than this guys! And gals!

 

[CanesFanBudMan]

I <3 Dundon

 

[LakeLivin]

Will be interesting to see how he does. Before Dundon nobody would have hired him as a GM. The next few years looking at CBJs and the Hurricanes trajectories will be insightful into the inner workings of the borg

I hear what you're saying but I suspect that Waddell and Tulsky have probably made enough of an impact on each other that the differences between how they operate won't be quite as stark today as they would have been before they worked together for a decade. I suspect that each has learned from the other, at least to some extent.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

Reinhart signed under value in Florida just like Slavin signed under value with us. Both organizations knew their players well, knew they could probably get more, but signed cheaper to help the team.

But those are rarities, not the norm. The norm is that players know what they're worth, usually have a number in mind that matches closely to what other similar players have received, and trying to get them to deviate millions away from that number is just insulting.

those are rare but it doesnt mean teams are some how cheap or bad negotiators because they offer something under the original ask of the player.

 

[Stickpucker]

Ah, the off-season.

Yesterday we spent 4 pages arguing the merits of Necas not signing an extension based on a tweet from noted twitter insider HasbolaCanes (admittedly, probably 20% of the posts were mine). Today, based on a press conference, we've spent a few pages discussing all the possible reasons why Waddell left, and how we are sick of Dundon because of it.

Ah the regular season.

We will spend lots of time talking about which big sexy men's are best at chasing a little rubber disc around while slapping at it with sticks. The rest of the time we will talk about Bojangles, Anton Babchuk, Chad Larose, the ghost of Eric Staal, and the sexual habits of dieties.

 

[hblueridgegal]

I’m wondering if Rod is having second thoughts about signing his extension given all the offseason BS going on…surely he could have gotten more money elsewhere had he chosen to do so…all of this nonsense is not exactly giving me the warm and fuzzies about the upcoming season!

It looked the losses of so many players + Don was still hitting him hard in the interview - on a personal and professional level.

 

[Nikishin Go Boom]

Ah the regular season.

We will spend lots of time talking about which big sexy men's are best at chasing a little rubber disc around while slapping at it with sticks. The rest of the time we will talk about Bojangles, Anton Babchuk, Chad Larose, the ghost of Eric Staal, and the sexual habits of dieties.

wait it isnt a burnt biscuit? my southern roots feel better now that someone isnt actually burning biscuits.

 

[Blueline Bomber]

those are rare but it doesnt mean teams are some how cheap or bad negotiators because they offer something under the original ask of the player.

Depends on the frequency of how often they do it and the rigidity in their negotiations. And everything we’ve heard from…literally everyone…is that Dundon is a real piece of work when it comes to negotiations. We’ve heard it from outside sources, we’ve heard it from inside sources, we’ve heard it from RBA and Tulsky.

It only matters in the end if it winds up costing us in the long run. And while it wasn’t exactly smooth sailing up to this point (Hello Aho Offersheet), I think the RBA negotiations immediately followed by the Guenztal one were the first real sign we’ve seen that Dundon could really hurt this organization if he doesn’t change his tactics in that regard.