Player Discussion Trent Frederic II

[BruinDust]

This is a false equivalency argument.

A couple short cross-checks off the faceoff (which the ref watched and deemed not worth a penalty) is nothing like truly instigating a fight (hence, why there was no instigator penalty). Gustaffson could have skated away but came back with a cross-check of his own and continued to engage until they both dropped the gloves.

Post Hoc Ergo Proptor Hoc actually describes the argument here being made.

So, you now claim to know what Frederic was thinking?

You think 99.9% of players in the NHL have fought before --or that the rabbit crosschecks were so horrific that it was a "must fight" situation?

Look at the situation, Winnipeg had just made it 6-1. And when I say 99.9% I mean they would of gotten back up and in the face of the player who crossed checked them. Not that every time it results in a fight.

And they weren't rabbit cross-checks (first one knocked Gustafsson to his knees) even if the ref didn't call it (as if that matters what the ref did or didn't do, especially in a 6-1 game).

Frederic was just being a sook. A player lashing out late in a game where him and his team were getting pummeled. Let's not act like that never happens in a competitive game of hockey.

I've always respected and valued your opinion on here this board but your giving Frederic a free pass here.

 

[LouJersey]

Look at the situation, Winnipeg had just made it 6-1. And when I say 99.9% I mean they would of gotten back up and in the face of the player who crossed checked them. And they weren't rabbit cross-checks (first one knocked Gustafsson to his knees) even if the ref didn't call it (as if that matters what the ref did or didn't do, especially in a 6-1 game).

Frederic was just being a sook. A player lashing out late in a game where him and his team were getting pummeled. Let's not act like that never happens in a competitive game of hockey.

I've always respected and valued your opinion on here this board but your giving Frederic a free pass here.

20 shifts last night, 0 hits, 1 shot, 2 blocks. You wouldn't really have known he was playing if you didn't notice him in the screen when Seattle was scoring. Many players invisible

 

[NeelyDan]

He still gets 4.5x3 if he hits open market

 

[BruinDust]

20 shifts last night, 0 hits, 1 shot, 2 blocks. You wouldn't really have known he was playing if you didn't notice him in the screen when Seattle was scoring. Many players invisible

I watched the first half of the game and every time Frederic was out there he was just skating around puck watching.

He's officially dead last on the team in plus/minus.

 

[LSCII]

He still gets 4.5x3 if he hits open market

So let him go get that somewhere else. Not worth it. Total passenger.

 

[LouJersey]

So let him go get that somewhere else. Not worth it. Total passenger.

If they don’t re up him they better take advantage of a dumb GM trade deadline

I watched the first half of the game and every time Frederic was out there he was just skating around puck watching.

He's officially dead last on the team in plus/minus.

Ironically the often embattled Shane Wright out worked him on the second Seattle goal as well.

 

[LSCII]

If they don’t re up him they better take advantage of a dumb GM trade deadline

This team desperately needs to be sellers at the deadline. The problem with doing that though is I want zero part of Sweeney and Neely making those trades. The level of incompetence is off the charts.

 

[LouJersey]

This team desperately needs to be sellers at the deadline. The problem with doing that though is I want zero part of Sweeney and Neely making those trades. The level of incompetence is off the charts.

That’s fair. They won’t be dealing futures at least. Hopefully they can get it together at some point but two coaches now and the talent level does not look sufficient

 

[BruinDust]

This team desperately needs to be sellers at the deadline. The problem with doing that though is I want zero part of Sweeney and Neely making those trades. The level of incompetence is off the charts.

Turns out their vision of being the NHL's most penalized team doesn't equate to winning hockey games. Who would of thought?

 

[Therewolf31]

Another country heard from

What?

 

[NeelyDan]

So let him go get that somewhere else. Not worth it. Total passenger.

Yeah not saying I’d pay it necessarily, but someone def does

 

[LouJersey]

Yeah not saying I’d pay it necessarily, but someone def does

He has 5 year 4+ all over him in July IMO. I think he should have been a center this whole time, but I wouldn't mind re upping him and ditching Coyle if you put him at center.

 

[NeelyDan]

He has 5 year 4+ all over him in July IMO. I think he should have been a center this whole time, but I wouldn't mind re upping him and ditching Coyle if you put him at center.

I'm not out on Freddy just yet. I'm not happy with him, and I have some serious concerns - but I have to admit I'm far from out on him at this point. Someone made a point that if he played with a third of the fire Kastelic does, he'd be at an entirely different level and that's part of my concern. It's also why I still see (probably to my detriment) potential.

 

[LouJersey]

I'm not out on Freddy just yet. I'm not happy with him, and I have some serious concerns - but I have to admit I'm far from out on him at this point. Someone made a point that if he played with a third of the fire Kastelic does, he'd be at an entirely different level and that's part of my concern. It's also why I still see (probably to my detriment) potential.

Yeah I am with you. What I don't want to happen is to let him go for nothing. That would be an awful move by management. Decide and get whatever done one way or another.

 

[BruinDust]

I'm not out on Freddy just yet. I'm not happy with him, and I have some serious concerns - but I have to admit I'm far from out on him at this point. Someone made a point that if he played with a third of the fire Kastelic does, he'd be at an entirely different level and that's part of my concern. It's also why I still see (probably to my detriment) potential.

Couldn't we make this same statement about a large portion of players in the NHL?

 

[NeelyDan]

Couldn't we make this same statement about a large portion of players in the NHL?

We could. So it comes down to faith in the player - you have none, and while I don't align, I get it.

 

[BruinDust]

We could. So it comes down to faith in the player - you have none, and while I don't align, I get it.

I just don't think it's that simple as he needs to work harder or play with more fire. Part of playing hard and fast is being assertive. I watch him play and I don't think he thinks the game well enough or fast enough to be assertive. There are times when he should be moving his feet or laying a solid hit he simply doesn't. To me it's more of a case he needs to play smarter not harder. No player can go balls-to-the-wall 100% of the time unless they are some 4th liner getting one or two shifts a period and/or see the ice 5 mins a game only to unleash havoc. Getting a regular shift part of it is using the energy you do have wisely, and he doesn't do that IMO. I'd rather he make 1-2 hard meaningful hits a game instead wasting his energy making 5 or 6 inconsequential ones.

Maybe one day a coach will get through to him but that coach ain't Joe Sacco.

 

[4ORRBRUIN]

I just don't think it's that simple as he needs to work harder or play with more fire. Part of playing hard and fast is being assertive. I watch him play and I don't think he thinks the game well enough or fast enough to be assertive. There are times when he should be moving his feet or laying a solid hit he simply doesn't. To me it's more of a case he needs to play smarter not harder. No player can go balls-to-the-wall 100% of the time unless they are some 4th liner getting one or two shifts a period and/or see the ice 5 mins a game only to unleash havoc. Getting a regular shift part of it is using the energy you do have wisely, and he doesn't do that IMO. I'd rather he make 1-2 hard meaningful hits a game instead wasting his energy making 5 or 6 inconsequential ones.

Maybe one day a coach will get through to him but that coach ain't Joe Sacco.

There entire team knows Joe Sacco is a temporary coach, nothing is going to change until they find Monty's replacement. It ain't Joe Sacco

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

He has 5 year 4+ all over him in July IMO. I think he should have been a center this whole time, but I wouldn't mind re upping him and ditching Coyle if you put him at center.

What makes you think he should be a center?

He's not good on faceoffs, he's not a playmaker, his hockey IQ is questionable.

 

[LouJersey]

What makes you think he should be a center?

He's not good on faceoffs, he's not a playmaker, his hockey IQ is questionable.

Guess I am still thinking about Wisconsin. You’re right maybe it is too late

 

[Hookslide]

What makes you think he should be a center?

He's not good on faceoffs, he's not a playmaker, his hockey IQ is questionable.

In fairness to Freddy he has never been given a real shot at playing center I honestly would not mind seeing him get a shot, but timing now might be in the cards.