Management Travis Green [Head Coach]

[L'Aveuglette]

Man, I'm not a fan of this hire. That being said Green's record looks a lot like Tocchet's did before he joined the Canucks. Here's hoping that Green can have the same impact.

I don't see it though.

Vancouver has Demko, we have Korpisalo and Forsberg.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

And like I said in the post you guys quoted, I have no faith in a team Korpisalo is gonna play ~40 games for, so imo, we can throw in the towel if that's the plan as it seems to be. He is a team killer and it won't matter who is coach.

Maybe if they move Forsberg & get another 1b/backup, the backup/1b will eventually get more than 50% of the starts?

I also think better team D play will also help whomever is in nets.

This post is admittedly a glass half full attempt I suppose.

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

Maybe if they move Forsberg & get another 1b/backup, the backup/1b will eventually get more than 50% of the starts?

I also think better team D play will also help whomever is in nets.

This post is admittedly a glass half full attempt I suppose.

I have zero faith in Korpisalo. Negative basically. Doesn't matter what is in front of him, his year this year is pretty close to his career normal and what we should expect. He got signed because of an outlier season.

My opinion is if he plays close to half the games, the team is already doomed, regardless of how they play in front of him. Just seeing him in camp might be enough for the guys to know they're done.

 

[JimmyApples]

Here is an interesting quote from a Canucks fan on Reddit who goes against the hivemind - I thought he had some interesting points that go against the already conceived notion

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For us at least, it's because our reddit fan base is incredibly stupid. See: all the idiotic "get ready for dump and chase" comments*. (Green had extremely shitty rosters filled with past-their-prime grinders and plugs and no defencemen to speak of who, by necessity, dumped it in on the rare occasion they managed to leave their own zone. The few guys with talent, like Pettersson, Horvat, and a few others with speed/skill, had solid zone entry stats throughout his tenure.)

Green tried to play a very fast, skilled game during his time in Vancouver, but it was reliant on having D who could move their feet and the puck well (which he never had) and forwards who had decent speed and hands (of which he had about 3 max at any one time). Quick/skilled exits + passes through the NZ and high pressure counterattacks, along with aggressive 2 man forechecks were common, but rarely executed well due to a lack of quality personnel. It's frequently reported that Green and Tocchet are good friends and share similar ideas and views on coaching, if that gives Sens fans any comfort.

He was really good with the young guys on the roster who managed to develop well despite all the "mentors" Benning continually chased after. He also showed really good scouting and adjustments to the systems during the bubble playoff run, specifically implementing wholesale changes to the forecheck tailored to the Blues and Vegas which were extremely impactful. Unfortunately his last-ditch attempt to create a defense-first structure during his final season were very unsuccessful, but again, that can largely be chocked up to personnel. The defensive stats ended up being worse under Boudreau and did not improve until Benning was canned and Rutherford and Allvin flipped ~80% of the roster, including 4/6 D and pretty much the entire bottom 6.

Seriously, I really cannot harp enough on how shitty the teams he had under Benning were. He had a top pairing of Stecher-Hutton for a large part of one season due to injuries to Tanev and Edler, and the "Sea of Granlunds" became a meme because of the parade of useless, overpaid, past-their-prime forwards that Benning collected like bobbleheads. Here is a selection from a previous comment of mine. Keep in mind that many of those names ended up playing top 6/top 4 minutes out of sheer necessity.

Is Green a world-beater? Probably not. But he's definitely a better coach than he's been able to show so far. Even Scotty Bowman would've struggled under the complete and utter ineptitude that was Benning and Weisbrod.

*The "dump and chase" stupidity actually came from an exceptionally dumb user in a /r/canucks GDT who "counted" the dump-ins for a third period against Montreal (iirc) once, and then presented their "stats" in a standalone post later. Hence the braindead circlejerk was formed.

That’s a good read.

I mean, we have no other options but to give Green a chance. Hopefully he can bring our team success despite the goaltending issues.

I’m more upset about the alleged hiring criteria (cheaper the better), than the actual hiring itself.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

For real.

If the difference between Berube and Green is, say, in the $2-4m range, then where are we at as a franchise when this happens?

Exactly. I can handle making a mistake and trading for a crappy goalie or mediocre coach, if we know the mistake can be corrected by being willing to spend a few dollars. But if we're making decisions this early based on dollars in areas where the isn't even a spending cap....I don't know. Did someone miss something somewhere in the calculations or is there something else going on here?

 

[Speatleysson]

Spend a billion on the team.. refuse to spend 1-2 million extra on a winning coach to take the team to the next level.

 

[inthewings]

Man, I'm not a fan of this hire. That being said Green's record looks a lot like Tocchet's did before he joined the Canucks. Here's hoping that Green can have the same impact.

I don't see it though.

It also looks a lot like Craig Berube's record after being fired by the Flyers two seasons into his NHL coaching career.

 

[Relapsing]

Exactly. I can handle making a mistake and trading for a crappy goalie or mediocre coach, if we know the mistake can be corrected by being willing to spend a few dollars. But if we're making decisions this early based on dollars in areas where the isn't even a spending cap....I don't know. Did someone miss something somewhere in the calculations or is there something else going on here?

It begs too many questions. Are we going to spend money to bring in the beet scouts we can? What about filling out the rest of our front office?

For all the talk about how much additions need to happen throughout the backend of this org, penny pinching on a HC is counter to that message. And the rumours of Green bringing in a first time NHL assistant he worked with in Utica an assistant coach he worked with for 4 years in Vancouver but hasn't had a stint anywhere else since screams the same.

 

[The Waffler]

The cup is soooo ours

 

[stempniaksen]

Exactly. I can handle making a mistake and trading for a crappy goalie or mediocre coach, if we know the mistake can be corrected by being willing to spend a few dollars. But if we're making decisions this early based on dollars in areas where the isn't even a spending cap....I don't know. Did someone miss something somewhere in the calculations or is there something else going on here?

Despite their not being a cap on coaching/front office, it certainly seems like there's a budget. Unfortunately that typically separates the winners and losers.

Despite me being along for the ride as a Sens fan (what other choice do I have) it's odd to see this group taking shape despite all the early promises from ownership. Green instead of Berube for maybe/probably financial reasons, Staois holding down two major roles on this team when Andlauer talked about a 2 headed monster. No one new brought in beyond Poulin.

It's not destined to fail, but it's a far cry from what I thought the front office would look like in all honesty. We've all just got to hope for the best while expecting...less than that.

 

[BondraTime]

It begs too many questions. Are we going to spend money to bring in the beet scouts we can? What about filling out the rest of our front office?

For all the talk about how much additions need to happen throughout the backend of this org, penny pinching on a HC is counter to that message. And the rumours of Green bringing in a first time NHL assistant he worked with in Utica screams the same.

He has 5 years NHL experiance

 

[Golden_Jet]

Wasn’t my choice, but I’ll give him a chance, and sees how he does.

 

[stempniaksen]

It begs too many questions. Are we going to spend money to bring in the beet scouts we can? What about filling out the rest of our front office?

For all the talk about how much additions need to happen throughout the backend of this org, penny pinching on a HC is counter to that message. And the rumours of Green bringing in a first time NHL assistant he worked with in Utica screams the same.

I don't disagree with a lot of what you said but if you're referencing Baumgartner he was an assistant in Vancouver with Green so he's got NHL experience as well. It's his only NHL experience, but he wouldn't be a first timer.

 

[SidSixpointSeven]

Don't feel too bad, apparently the next three most qualified and available candidates were Tom Green, Red Green and the Green Bastard ...

 

[Good in Osgoode]

Tanev’s worst years were under Green.

Of course they were. Cripes.

 

[Relapsing]

I don't disagree with a lot of what you said but if you're referencing Baumgartner he was an assistant in Vancouver with Green so he's got NHL experience as well. It's his only NHL experience, but he wouldn't be a first timer.

He has 5 years NHL experiance

Ah, so you're right. 4 years with Vancouver under Green. Hasn't had a stint since.

Not a ringing endorsement, but I appreciate the correction pals

 

[Tragedy]

He has 5 years NHL experiance

Don't let facts ruin a good narrative

 

[flyingfingers]

It also looks a lot like Craig Berube's record after being fired by the Flyers two seasons into his NHL coaching career.

Well... not really. Berube was 75-58-28 in Philadelphia. That's a winning % that's quite a bit better than Travis Green's, who's much more comparable to DJ Smith.

Berube was 2/2 for being above .500 in his first stint.
Green was 1/5.

 

[Speatleysson]

Wasn’t my choice, but I’ll give him a chance, and sees how he does.

This is the patient and most level headed approach..

My approach: we've been doing this and saying this for ******* years.

 

[coladin]

I'm so disappointed. All these years waiting and it starts out with a giant f***ing thud.

I'm even open to the idea that this could work out, but to already see the $'s being a major issue, it tells me they have no chance of ever winning anything. Budget teams don't win, simple as that.

We got the Acura of coaches.

"Nice Acura...I thought you were going with the Bimmer?"

"I was, but this thing brakes and turns good, and 0-60 is right there...and it is $10K less!"

 

[Hale The Villain]

Spend a billion on the team.. refuse to spend 1-2 million extra on a winning coach to take the team to the next level.

Unfortunately I think the high sale price may have hurt the ability of this team to afford top off-ice personnel.

We're definitely not one of the rich teams and can't afford to pay the top coaching candicates 3M+, so a coach like Berube was always a long shot.

 

[Relapsing]

Unfortunately I think the high sale price may have hurt the ability of this team to afford top off-ice personnel.

We're definitely not one of the rich teams and can't afford to pay the top coaching candicates 3M+, so a coach like Berube was always a long shot.

It will be interesting to see where other coaches end up and what everyone is getting paid to see how whatever we're paying Green could have otherwise been spent

 

[inthewings]

Well... not really. Berube was 75-58-28 in Philadelphia. That's a winning % that's quite a bit better than Travis Green's, who's much more comparable to DJ Smith.

Berube was 2/2 for being above .500 in his first stint.
Green was 1/5.

I meant in terms of accomplishing nothing with a mediocre to bad roster and then getting fired. I'm not going to compare team winning % of two different teams and chalk the difference up to the coach.

Again, I have no real opinion of Green as a coach or as a person. I just think the reaction to the hire is a bit hysterical. The guy everyone is is mad about not hiring has also been fired twice in the last 9 years, and I don't necessarily think it's a bad thing that the team isn't willing to pay a coach for a Stanley Cup his team won a few years ago. Those kinds of hires have typically not resulted in the same kind of success with the new team. Willing to wait and see until Staios proves that he doesn't deserve the benefit of the doubt.

What I will criticize is that press release, because my god it was embarrassing.

 

[Hale The Villain]

We got our guy!

In all the celebration about a new owner we kind of forgot that we're still a small market team that has an internal budget.

We may be able to spend to the cap on players, but we don't have unlimited resources to hire "best in class" off-ice personnel.

Still if we're going bargain bin shopping for a head coach there were other options I preferred.

 

[Senscore]

Vancouver has Demko, we have Korpisalo and Forsberg.