GDT: Training Camp discussion - Camp now open

[ACC1224]

I remember when this thread was about Training Camp.......squirrels.

 

[Dekes For Days]

You didn't say the Leafs got worse from their deadline deals? See bolded from your quote. How do you know?

I already explained my position:
"I believe the additions made us worse because we had a worse record after, worse defensive results after, the additions didn't play very well as individuals, and we lost and had one of our worst underlying playoff performances in part due to glaring transition struggles that seemed to pop up when we overloaded with defensemen with poor transition ability."

Leafs allowed less goals this past playoffs than the three series they played in the two years prior. That has no bearing on your assessment of the acquisitions?

The acquisitions weren't the cause of the lesser goals against. Woll was, and he was already here. Our defensive play and transition got worse.

 

[Sypher04]

What Knies has shown so far is not all that close to Hyman.
Domi is not better than Kerfoot.
Kampf is not equal to Spezza.
Reaves is not equal to Simmonds.
Lorentz doesn't even have a contract, and isn't an upgrade on anybody. Cowan is likely headed back to the OHL.
Robertson is really the only current roster player with an argument of being better than a 2020-2021 counterpart, but it doesn't make up for the rest.
Hopefully we see big progression in our youth to push us ahead, but there's really no argument for it being better (than even our 3rd best forward group of those 3 years) at this point in time.

Kerfoot is more versatile but he’s not better than Domi, especially not in a top 6 role.
I’m no Kampf fan but he’s better for the required role than Spezza was. Just overpaid.
Simmonds was garbage, Reaves is similarly garbage. Neither would have a chance of being a regular on merit.

Holl and Dermott are not behind OEL and Benoit. Muzzin is a decent step above everybody not named Rielly. And while I like Tanev, there are questions around if 35-year old Tanev can live up to prime Brodie; not to mention the uncertainty around Hakanpaa coming off what some considered a career-threatening injury.

Holl and Dermott are firmly behind OEL and Benoit. You could not be more wrong on this.

I think it would be pretty hard to argue Woll/Stolarz as a better quality tandem going into this season than Andersen/Campbell would have been going into 2020-2021. Andersen was still considered a starting goalie at that point, and had a lot more experience. Campbell wasn't well established, but had some decent past results, played well after joining us the previous year, and had 11th overall pedigree. Ideally, our goaltending results this year are better, but that's really just hoping.

By name recognition sure. That said Andersen really only played well here when we sucked. His play steadily got worse as the team around him improved which is infuriating

 

[IPS]

Holl and Dermott are not behind OEL and Benoit.

What are we expecting from Holl this year James?

Think he's gonna be able to crack it being a full timer on the incredibly elite Detroit Red Wings this year?

How bout Dermott too? Think he's gonna be able to get more than 17 minutes a game on the insanely elite Arizona Coyotes?

It's actually so hilarious how wrong you've been about Toronto's D all these years, literally none of your opinions have held up to the test of time when they've moved onto other teams.

 

[Fogelhund]

""

 

[IPS]

By name recognition sure. That said Andersen really only played well here when we sucked. His play steadily got worse as the team around him improved which is infuriating

James was literally proclaiming Andersen as the root of all of Toronto's problems during that time, but now all of a sudden he was "still considered a starting goalie"

 

[stickty111]

Have to think cuts are coming any time now. Marlies have pre season games on Saturday and Sunday, and they haven't even started camp yet.

 

[Antropovsky]

I already explained my position:
"I believe the additions made us worse because we had a worse record after, worse defensive results after, the additions didn't play very well as individuals, and we lost and had one of our worst underlying playoff performances in part due to glaring transition struggles that seemed to pop up when we overloaded with defensemen with poor transition ability."

The acquisitions weren't the cause of the lesser goals against. Woll was, and he was already here. Our defensive play and transition got worse.

So, injuries to Matthews and Nylander didn't play a part on worst underlying playoff performances? How did you offset their injuries to conclude the underlying results with their injuries still was worst than prior playoffs?

This seems like it would take some really inpressive data analysis to figure out.

 

[IPS]

So, injuries to Matthews and Nylander didn't play a part on worst underlying playoff performances? How did you offset their injuries to conclude the underlying results with their injuries still was worst than prior playoffs?

This seems like it would take some really inpressive data analysis to figure out.

He's actually literally avoided those points everytime he's been quizzed up on the results of last year's playoffs vs the years under Dubas.

James would have given his left nut to have those kinds of excuses for the playoff failures under Dubas.

 

[Racer88]

You're in for a shock when you find out how old the two D we signed for long term are.

I know how old they are ….i just couldn’t resist. It was too easy

 

[notbias]

So, injuries to Matthews and Nylander didn't play a part on worst underlying playoff performances? How did you offset their injuries to conclude the underlying results with their injuries still was worst than prior playoffs?

This seems like it would take some really inpressive data analysis to figure out.

We had better underlying stats in the games that people were missing...

I'm not blaming those players, just saying.

1,2, and 4 were the best games for us.

 

[Suntouchable13]

So when are they gonna get serious? Are we gonna see any cuts? I know they are on their team bonding trip right now, but there are only 2 preseason games left and exactly a week till the opener. Who are we gonna see in the lineup tomorrow against Detroit?

 

[therealkoho]

Are we going to start listing all the D we had that were worse than Muzzin?

Ahhh good ol memory lane, the favourite game of LeaFland which always leads to a rousing bout of self flaggelation.

It's like reading 3 Tanner articles back to back to back!

 

[Rare Jewel]

So when are they gonna get serious? Are we gonna see any cuts? I know they are on their team bonding trip right now, but there are only 2 preseason games left and exactly a week till the opener. Who are we gonna see in the lineup tomorrow against Detroit?

They're not., lol

This club signs injured players, not to mention a few other things that could be addressed.

 

[Fogelhund]

What are we expecting from Holl this year James?

Think he's gonna be able to crack it being a full timer on the incredibly elite Detroit Red Wings this year?

How bout Dermott too? Think he's gonna be able to get more than 17 minutes a game on the insanely elite Arizona Coyotes?

It's actually so hilarious how wrong you've been about Toronto's D all these years, literally none of your opinions have held up to the test of time when they've moved onto other teams.

Arizona who?

 

[notbias]

What are we expecting from Holl this year James?

Think he's gonna be able to crack it being a full timer on the incredibly elite Detroit Red Wings this year?

How bout Dermott too? Think he's gonna be able to get more than 17 minutes a game on the insanely elite Arizona Coyotes?

It's actually so hilarious how wrong you've been about Toronto's D all these years, literally none of your opinions have held up to the test of time when they've moved onto other teams.

"What do we expect from Gretzky this year?"

Shockingly, time exists.

 

[therealkoho]

It's not that they aren't capable NHL players, it's the price for cap relief. All teams around the league are aware of Toronto's cap issues ... they're not going to help us out of a bind for free.

The Mathieu Joseph trade from this summer is a good example. Similar abilities/cap hit/term to Kampf/Jarnkrok.

Oh boy

I'm an NHL GM without any cap issues in this scenario and Im looking for a low cost bottom 6 forward, I think in reality or at least if reality has any part in it, that NHL GM I'm playing is more than happy to fork over a 3rd just for the charity aspect of it to get hold of 2 years of that player.

If Treliving were handing out NHL ready bottom 6 forwards including a mid round pick with nothing coming back even Shanahan would call the looney bin and have him committed.

 

[HockeyVirus]

One week until real hockey is back. We've made it folks, it is right there. Was a great offseason, let's hope they are able to build throughout the year and peak when it counts.

 

[Sypher04]

Arizona who?

View attachment 911721

Also Dermott is with the Oilers now

 

[therealkoho]

Like, thwse guys was such G's. Aki Berg was once one of the promising finnish d-talents. They aint make suckas like that no more.

Suckas huh

 

[therealkoho]

I don't think you need to worry about that, they'll both be on the team.

Do you actually see Pacioretty being signed?

 

[ACC1224]

Do you actually see Pacioretty being signed?

I do. Dependable vet who can score goals.

....and stop trying to get the thread back on topic!

 

[Dekes For Days]

Kerfoot is more versatile but he’s not better than Domi, especially not in a top 6 role.
I’m no Kampf fan but he’s better for the required role than Spezza was. Just overpaid.
Simmonds was garbage, Reaves is similarly garbage. Neither would have a chance of being a regular on merit.
Holl and Dermott are firmly behind OEL and Benoit. You could not be more wrong on this.

In the year Kerfoot got some top-six opportunities, he scored more points than Domi did last year. He's also good defensively and a good PKer, instead of a complete black hole in that regard. I also didn't even say that he's better than Domi. I just said Domi wasn't better. People really underrate Kerfoot around here, and tend to overrate Domi because of his last name.

Spezza back then was quite a bit better than Kampf is now. He won his minutes and paced 46 points with minimal ice time. Kampf doesn't really even have a role anymore. We just throw Reaves with him and have a horrible 4th line that can't do anything. Simmonds wasn't very good, but could at least be passable in a depth role in that first year. Reaves is just complete garbage at this point, and drags every line he's on into unplayable territory. I'm not sure how you think a bottom pairing defenseman and somebody who played really well for us in a difficult top-4 role in 2020-2021 are "firmly behind" two bottom pairing defensemen.

By name recognition sure. That said Andersen really only played well here when we sucked. His play steadily got worse as the team around him improved which is infuriating

Yes, it was infuriating that as our team and defense improved, Andersen got worse. I certainly had more than a few issues with Andersen, and those concerns ended up being justified, but I'm not sure how one can claim superiority with two completely unproven goalies that haven't been more than backups in this league.

 

[Fogelhund]

Do you actually see Pacioretty being signed?

Absolutely.

 

[al secord]

Do you actually see Pacioretty being signed?

I think it's inevitable. Still not sure how I feel about it. Not much risk though.