HF Habs: Trade Proposal Thread #88: 2024 Off-Season Thread

[Boss Man Hughes]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1818330838888833374

Habs have gotten Suzuki, Dach, Newhook, Barron, Haje, Montembault from trades.

 

[Habby4Life]

Offer Cgy’s 1st (Florida) and Barron and get it done. A massive upgrade in the top 6.

 

[Boss Man Hughes]

That's the way it usually works. It doesn't mean it's the way it's always going to work that way.

Hughes has done something few GMs have done in the past. He's gone ALL IN on trading away vets and garnered a crap ton of prospects either trading for them or picks. By doing this he's accelerated the rebuild signficantly. In three years he's gotten:

Dach (trade)
Newhook (trade)
Demidov (draft)
Barron (trade)
RB (draft)
Slaf (draft)
Mesar (draft)
Hutson (trade)
Beck (draft)
Engstrom (draft)
Hage (draft)

That is a shitload of great young talent to amass in three years. You don't normally see that kind of volume or quality in such a short period of time. And we already have two more 1sts in the next draft.

That's not to say more trades won't come. For sure they will. And some of the guys here will probably be moved. But the drafting for picks and prospects has been incredible. This is not a normal rebuild, it's one that's been done very aggressively. And that bodes very well for us. Especially considering that there were young pieces (Suzuki, Guhle, CC, Mailloux) already here to begin with.

And (just as importantly) he's also hired somebody who's great at development. So we're maximizing those assets as well.

Haje is from 2 draft picks they traded for.

 

[sampollock]

Rumour is he got the picks early to prepare interviews and shared them.

AHHHH
that is a nono

 

[ReHabs]

Haje is from 2 draft picks they traded for.

I don't think you can count Hage as a trade acquisition. Doesn't make sense.

 

[B1g B1rd]

That's the way it usually works. It doesn't mean it's the way it's always going to work that way.

Hughes has done something few GMs have done in the past. He's gone ALL IN on trading away vets and garnered a crap ton of prospects either trading for them or picks. By doing this he's accelerated the rebuild signficantly. In three years he's gotten:

Dach (trade)
Newhook (trade)
Demidov (draft)
Barron (trade)
RB (draft)
Slaf (draft)
Mesar (draft)
Hutson (trade)
Beck (draft)
Engstrom (draft)
Hage (draft)

That is a shitload of great young talent to amass in three years. You don't normally see that kind of volume or quality in such a short period of time. And we already have two more 1sts in the next draft.

That's not to say more trades won't come. For sure they will. And some of the guys here will probably be moved. But the drafting for picks and prospects has been incredible. This is not a normal rebuild, it's one that's been done very aggressively. And that bodes very well for us. Especially considering that there were young pieces (Suzuki, Guhle, CC, Mailloux) already here to begin with.

And (just as importantly) he's also hired somebody who's great at development. So we're maximizing those assets as well.

I miss Bargain!

 

[Habby4Life]

I don't think you can count Hage as a trade acquisition. Doesn't make sense.

When they say trade acquisition they are talking about supplementing draft the core with current nhl guys. It also said via FA.

 

[Knackys]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1818330838888833374

To be fair VGK is an exception and should not count since its an expansion team and nobody was drafted by them in the first place.

 

[Rapala]

a quarter of the way to naming the entire league as being in on Laine

And always make sure you lead with the Habs.

 

[Rapala]

I see this repeated often and I am not sure if it is accurate.


2016-17 73 out of 82
2017-18 82 out of 82
2018-19 82 out of 82
2019-20 68 out of 71* Covid year
2020-21 46 out of 56* Covid year
2021-22 56 of 82 due to injury
2022-23 55 out of 82 due to injury
2023-24 18 out of 82 due to player assistance program


I see two distinct seasons where he battled injuries for a good part of the year. Last year he missed the season mostly due to the player assistance program while also recovering from a clavicle injury. For the first 5 of 8 seasons he played the majority of the season's games.

Can we please closely examine claims we want to make before making them.

Also, he's had a whole year off to potentially recover from any lingering injuries that might harder to heal with you are playing for 8 of 12 months of the year.

I love how he is trending.

 

[Rapala]

https://x.com/i/web/status/1818330838888833374

And almost all of them were acquired by an already contending team.
That sounds exactly like us.
Maybe we should try to break .500 before going all in on questionable expensive forwards.

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

I see this repeated often and I am not sure if it is accurate.


2016-17 73 out of 82
2017-18 82 out of 82
2018-19 82 out of 82
2019-20 68 out of 71* Covid year
2020-21 46 out of 56* Covid year
2021-22 56 of 82 due to injury
2022-23 55 out of 82 due to injury
2023-24 18 out of 82 due to player assistance program


I see two distinct seasons where he battled injuries for a good part of the year. Last year he missed the season mostly due to the player assistance program while also recovering from a clavicle injury. For the first 5 of 8 seasons he played the majority of the season's games.

Can we please closely examine claims we want to make before making them.

Also, he's had a whole year off to potentially recover from any lingering injuries that might harder to heal with you are playing for 8 of 12 months of the year.

So his last 4 seasons he's missed a minimum of 10 games.

Yeah, he's not injury prone.


He's also had a whole year off from not playing. We'll have to see where his (and Dach's) body are at and how long they take.

His contract, unless heavily retained, or taking a contract back hampers the Habs ability to be big players next year in the offseason.

He also potentially takes Cole's spot on the pp


But let's say he comes in and does well. Gets close to, or over 40 goals. If you want to keep him he's now going to cost over 10 mill a season. You hope he wants a 3-5 year deal max, but he likely wants a 7, or 8 year deal to finish off his career which is something teams can't really do. You can't really commit to players anymore when they're close to 40 unless they're exceptional and your team is still good.

Laine definitely adds some positives, but overall there's more reason to just let him be. The main positive he adds is that he's someone new to actually watch and the potential to see what he and Dach could do 5 on 5.

If you're getting Laine at 50% and sending Anderson back while also getting Olivier, hell yeah let's do it.

If you're getting Laine at 50% and a 2nd for a 4th and some bum prospect, then potentially.

If you have to give up real assets then pass.

This is also the 2nd team he's asked for a trade from.

 

[salbutera]

And almost all of them were acquired by an already contending team.
That sounds exactly like us.
Maybe we should try to break .500 before going all in on questionable expensive forwards.

Verhaeghe, Reinhart, Bennett, Montour, Forsling, Nichushkin, Burakovsky, Kessel, Bonino, Honrnqvist etc, I wouldn’t qualify as expensive ..

 

[Rapala]

Verhaeghe, Reinhart, Bennett, Montour, and Forsling I wouldn’t qualify as expensive ..

True but how much would it have cost us to get them here?
I'm not against adding at the right time this isn't it.
We are still evaluating after having basically lost a year with Dach going down.
It's hard to determine exactly what you need when you still don't know exactly what you have.

 

[salbutera]

True but how much would it have cost us to get them here?
I'm not against adding at the right time this isn't it.
We are still evaluating after having basically lost a year with Dach going down.
It's hard to determine exactly what you need when you still don't know exactly what you have.

When Zito added those 5-players after being named Fla GM, I’m sure he didn’t think we’ve got the Cup wrapped up…. those players exhibited talent / character traits he wanted within his roster construct…

Every summer those types of players are available as stage Thompson was for reportedly a mid round pick prior to hue breakout season …

 

[Sterling Archer]

It’s sad but the more and more people who say CBJ and Habs are closing in on a deal for Laine, the more I think it’s not going to happen.

 

[ReHabs]

His contract, unless heavily retained, or taking a contract back hampers the Habs ability to be big players next year in the offseason.

Since we pick up UFAs all the time... we happen have enough space to get a big UFA even with Laine on board. We don't have enough space to pick up two big UFAs without buying out Anderson and/or Gallagher but I don't think it's a reasonable scenario to position against tbh.

He also potentially takes Cole's spot on the pp

Good teams have various options and give TOI and prime opportunities to the best perceived option. There's absolutely nothing wrong with the Habs having scoring depth. And if it ever seems like the Habs have simply too many productive forwards -- by God, I reckon one of them could be traded away.

But let's say he comes in and does well. Gets close to, or over 40 goals. If you want to keep him he's now going to cost over 10 mill a season.

In the case that he performs well it seems like a very good problem to have, no? Gamble paid off, player performed beyond expectations, team enjoyed his company and contribution, etc. What exactly is the issue? If Hughes wants to keep him, he'll keep him. If Hughes wants to move on, he'll move on.

You hope he wants a 3-5 year deal max, but he likely wants a 7, or 8 year deal to finish off his career which is something teams can't really do. You can't really commit to players anymore when they're close to 40 unless they're exceptional and your team is still good.

Laine will be a ancient and decrepit 28 years old when his contract expires. If he pursues a 8 year deal, that takes him to the ripe old age of 36. Practically a mummy.

If you don't like signing 28 year olds who (in this scenario) score close to or over 40 goals to 8 year deals, lemme tell you: you won't like the contract any big player the Habs would sign next year in the offseason either.

 

[Rapala]

When Zito added those 5-players after being named Fla GM, I’m sure he didn’t think we’ve got the Cup wrapped up…. those players exhibited talent / character traits he wanted within his roster construct…

Every summer those types of players are available as stage Thompson was for reportedly a mid round pick prior to hue breakout season …

Florida were already pushing and the Huberdeau trade put them over the top even if it took another tweak.
I do agree he saw value where some didn't.
They were certainly a playoff team.

 

[Goldthorpe]

While I agree with the sentiment that we'll need to clean up our D pipeline one way or another, I don't think Management focus is or even should be on trade value maximization. They want to identify and sign longer term the best D prospects we have, and if they can take their sweet time doing so they will. It doesn't matter *that much* if the overall trade value of some of these prospects suffer - the goal is to find the best of the bunch for the team long term.

Sure, we could still a trade happens between now and the season start, but Hughes also positioned himself to not have to trade anyone if he doesn't like what he sees. He actually has less pressure to "fix" this situation than we may collectively believe.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Offer Cgy’s 1st (Florida) and Barron and get it done. A massive upgrade in the top 6.

I’m with you on this. It’s a solid shot at adding elite level talent. You miss 100% of the shots you don’t take. Risk is 2 years and two futures. We’ll be ok and I think the rewards outweigh the risks

 

[MON4NHLTOR4MLB]

Laine could be a great get if cheap. Even Harris, a guy and a pick could bust but could end up being unreal. He even sniffs the player he was to start his career and we’re in big time business.

 

[waitin425]

Habs have gotten Suzuki, Dach, Newhook, Barron, Haje, Montembault from trades.

Through trades but primarily developed with us. None of them were established vets in the 23-30 age range when we scored them.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Barron has 28 points in 87 games while only getting PP time with our terrible second unit. For a 21/22 year old those are very good numbers.

After the last 2-3 decades of young D getting benched every mistake for a veteran, it is surprising to see how little patience some people have for our young D at times.

Barron has a lot of ups and downs defensively, but so have Guhle, Harris, Xhekaj and Struble. It is to be expected for guys with under 100 games in the NHL.

I’ll add.. Barron’s goals is well above average for his age. 12/94 prorates to 10 or 11 goals per 82 games. That coming from games spread out.

Only thing this kid is missing is Maturity/Experience! To be honest, I think he’s a future Matheson/Petry type. Great age 26-32 years

I’m ok with Barron in a trade package for either of Laine, Zegras, Necas, Mcgroarty but not as just some throw in trade value. Screw that! This is a rare RD with Skating/Size/Shot power. Thats no throw in type

 

[waitin425]

While I agree with the sentiment that we'll need to clean up our D pipeline one way or another, I don't think Management focus is or even should be on trade value maximization. They want to identify and sign longer term the best D prospects we have, and if they can take their sweet time doing so they will. It doesn't matter *that much* if the overall trade value of some of these prospects suffer - the goal is to find the best of the bunch for the team long term.

Sure, we could still a trade happens between now and the season start, but Hughes also positioned himself to not have to trade anyone if he doesn't like what he sees. He actually has less pressure to "fix" this situation than we may collectively believe.

We are getting little hints of who they value on D.

I think Harris and/or Struble are likely trade chips.

Future will be a combination of....

Hutson - Rein
Guhle - Mailloux
Xhekaj - Barron

5 former first rounders. Very nice.

 

[Treb]

To be fair VGK is an exception and should not count since its an expansion team and nobody was drafted by them in the first place.

They had Nicolas Hague.

Cotter and Rondbjerg on the roster but did not play.