Trade and Free Agency Thread - 2021/22 - Post Deadline

[Rude Dog]

Sandin 100% should be dealt has basically no real long term role in the organization

He needs to be part of the offer brining in Chychuran whose more similar to muzzin just younger and faster and can play a similar role vs Sandin whose ceiling is a similar role to rielly but not as good a player

Lilijgren's play this year makes him worthy of keeping and to win over Sandin

Sandin should be moved on from

Wonder zona would consider him as a big piece to return chych.

 

[WTFMAN99]

I'd rather guys like Curtis Lazar or Zac Aston-Reese. More speed and agitation. Lazar led the Bruins in hits this past year.

Deslauriers just seems like a player who's destined to get scratched in a playoff game, under Keefe's system

Deslauriers would have been a target if we brought in Trotz

I don't know if it's system related but physical forechecking types come here and wilt.

Simmonds, Martin, Clifford and Ritchie all did/do not look good.

Clifford didn't look any better with the Blues but still.

 

[OVO16]

Engvall for Greenway?
Roberson + Pick for Bertuzzi?

Add a couple of 4th-line Speedy Agitation guys like Lazar/Aston-Reese/Katchouk.....and suddenly the makeup of our team looks a lot more different.

 

[OVO16]

I don't know if it's system related but physical forechecking types come here and wilt.

Simmonds, Martin, Clifford and Ritchie all did/do not look good.

Clifford didn't look any better with the Blues but still.

It's absolutely system-related. Look at the teams in the playoffs right now.

Edmonton - Kassian
Calgary - Lucic, Gubrandson, Zadorov
New York - Reaves, Hunt
Tampa Bay - Maroon

I dont think those guys make it in a Keefe system. The fans/media would have been calling for their heads by the middle of the season

 

[WTFMAN99]

It's absolutely system-related. Look at the teams in the playoffs right now.

Edmonton - Kassian
Calgary - Lucic, Gubrandson, Zadorov
New York - Reaves, Hunt
Tampa Bay - Maroon

I dont think those guys make it in a Keefe system. The fans/media would have been calling for their heads by the middle of the season

Maybe we should try a new coach

Oh wait, we immediately committed to bringing Keefe back...

 

[showtime8]

It's absolutely system-related. Look at the teams in the playoffs right now.

Edmonton - Kassian
Calgary - Lucic, Gubrandson, Zadorov
New York - Reaves, Hunt
Tampa Bay - Maroon

I dont think those guys make it in a Keefe system. The fans/media would have been calling for their heads by the middle of the season

It also ties in with the 3rd line of players and their lack of physicality too.

You either had a line of Mikheyev - Kampf - Engvall or some mixture of Kerfoot and Nylander thrown in there. None of those players scream physicality.

Take a look at a line that St. Louis has in Saad - Barbashev - Kyrou. Skill, skating and some form of playing physical. Barbashev led the team in hits with 160. From those 3 Leafs mentioned, Kampf had the most at 80. Yes, I understand that you don't need to hit to retrieve the puck, but that dynamic of the line works.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

I think the leafs should restructure where they have an offensive 3rd line and move Kampf to 4th. So, outside of Namestnikov, none of these look very appealing.

Tierney, Janmark, and Rask would not be appealing in that case?

Tierney had a rough year (and wasn't much better last year), but I would like to think playing on a much better team and feasting on easier competition could allow him to return to the 40 point 3C form he had only a few years ago with Ottawa.

Rask has a little bit more of a track record of suckage, but I think the Leafs play in a system that is much better for him than Minnesota, who are far more of a grind-it-out on the cycle type team.

We also need to think about the guys we already have here too. Anderson and Abruzzese are guys who thrive more on the cycle, but can also easily keep up with players on the rush as well (albeit in different ways). Steeves, meanwhile, thrives as more of a rush player but has the tenacity to be a bit of a pain on the forecheck and cycle as well. Spezza/Simmonds/Clifford are cycle, grind-it-out players who can't be trusted defensively (but Spezza can at least win draws) and can't play huge minutes at ES. Considering Spezza is the only one who can really play on either special team, that means the 4th line is not used much at all.

We mostly need a 4th line with some kind of identity. Is it going to be fast and play off of the rush? Slow and grinding? A solid mix of both in a way that it can all work? Will it be trusted to handle defensive situations, and which types? Is it just going to be pure offense and try to take advantage of skill mismatches? Namestnikov works for some, but not all. Janmark/Rask can likely work in the same subset of identities that a guy like Namestnikov would. However Zach Sanford and Nick Cousins would work well in an entirely different set, or with a different combination of players.

Our 3rd line has an identity: Chew up as many tough defensive minutes as you can, keep it simple on both the rush and on the cycle in the offensive end. More or less perfect for guys like Engvall, Kampf, Kase, and Anderson.

 

[WTFMAN99]

Tierney, Janmark, and Rask would not be appealing in that case?

Tierney had a rough year (and wasn't much better last year), but I would like to think playing on a much better team and feasting on easier competition could allow him to return to the 40 point 3C form he had only a few years ago with Ottawa.

Rask has a little bit more of a track record of suckage, but I think the Leafs play in a system that is much better for him than Minnesota, who are far more of a grind-it-out on the cycle type team.

We also need to think about the guys we already have here too. Anderson and Abruzzese are guys who thrive more on the cycle, but can also easily keep up with players on the rush as well (albeit in different ways). Steeves, meanwhile, thrives as more of a rush player but has the tenacity to be a bit of a pain on the forecheck and cycle as well. Spezza/Simmonds/Clifford are cycle, grind-it-out players who can't be trusted defensively (but Spezza can at least win draws) and can't play huge minutes at ES. Considering Spezza is the only one who can really play on either special team, that means the 4th line is not used much at all.

We mostly need a 4th line with some kind of identity. Is it going to be fast and play off of the rush? Slow and grinding? A solid mix of both in a way that it can all work? Will it be trusted to handle defensive situations, and which types? Is it just going to be pure offense and try to take advantage of skill mismatches? Namestnikov works for some, but not all. Janmark/Rask can likely work in the same subset of identities that a guy like Namestnikov would. However Zach Sanford and Nick Cousins would work well in an entirely different set, or with a different combination of players.

Our 3rd line has an identity: Chew up as many tough defensive minutes as you can, keep it simple on both the rush and on the cycle in the offensive end. More or less perfect for guys like Engvall, Kampf, Kase, and Anderson.

My friend knows Tierney, he's a die hard Leaf fan, he'd love to be here.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

It also ties in with the 3rd line of players and their lack of physicality too.

You either had a line of Mikheyev - Kampf - Engvall or some mixture of Kerfoot and Nylander thrown in there. None of those players scream physicality.

Take a look at a line that St. Louis has in Saad - Barbashev - Kyrou. Skill, skating and some form of playing physical. Barbashev led the team in hits with 160. From those 3 Leafs mentioned, Kampf had the most at 80. Yes, I understand that you don't need to hit to retrieve the puck, but that dynamic of the line works.

I think it is more about identity than simply having physicality. STL's line identifies more with physicality. Our identified more with speed and using it to bear down on the opposition. Our 3rd line was consistently effective this year. Perhaps not always in the offensive zone, but it was rarely used in the offensive zone anyways and still found ways to put the puck in the net.

It is the 4th line that had a lot more question marks. Clifford and Simmonds were used to provide physicality, but it was very sporadic and it left the 4th line ineffective most nights. Spezza provided some depth offense but he didn't have the right support to do it properly most nights. Then you sometimes had some young guys who were more pure skill and capable of playing on the rush, but paired with guys who mostly sucked on the rush (and those young guys were still getting their feet wet). It did almost look like it was difficult to find something that all worked together properly. Kase, Spezza, and Blackwell worked fine together, but they lacked chemistry. It seemed like a line that was mostly just there to chew up minutes than to do anything really productive for the team.

 

[showtime8]

I think we see the Leafs swing a bigger trade with the Flyers this off-season. For a team that was 2nd last in scoring (Goals for), the Flyers should be looking at the Leafs for some help (2nd most in the league).

I'm not really sure what direction they go or how big of a trade it becomes, but there are 3 or 4 pieces on that team that make sense in my mind:

1. Travis Konecny - Kind of a pest to play against with potential to score and skates well. This is the type of player that I would look at as my main target. Does it become a Kerfoot + Robertson + ? Or is it in a larger deal.

2. Scott Laughton - He's your 3rd line centre that you can play in that spot for the next 5 years. You've got a physical centre, with not a ton of offensive potential, but exactly what you'd be looking for in playoff hockey.

3. Morgan Frost - I think the Flyers move on from Frost because they don't exactly know what he's going to be at the next level. I think you could find a role for him throughout the line-up.

This could be a bigger deal with a bunch of pieces that you move to change the dynamics of each team. Maybe this is a deal that you need to include some prospects to get it done.

 

[Brobust]

Tierney, Janmark, and Rask would not be appealing in that case?

Tierney had a rough year (and wasn't much better last year), but I would like to think playing on a much better team and feasting on easier competition could allow him to return to the 40 point 3C form he had only a few years ago with Ottawa.

Rask has a little bit more of a track record of suckage, but I think the Leafs play in a system that is much better for him than Minnesota, who are far more of a grind-it-out on the cycle type team.

We also need to think about the guys we already have here too. Anderson and Abruzzese are guys who thrive more on the cycle, but can also easily keep up with players on the rush as well (albeit in different ways). Steeves, meanwhile, thrives as more of a rush player but has the tenacity to be a bit of a pain on the forecheck and cycle as well. Spezza/Simmonds/Clifford are cycle, grind-it-out players who can't be trusted defensively (but Spezza can at least win draws) and can't play huge minutes at ES. Considering Spezza is the only one who can really play on either special team, that means the 4th line is not used much at all.

We mostly need a 4th line with some kind of identity. Is it going to be fast and play off of the rush? Slow and grinding? A solid mix of both in a way that it can all work? Will it be trusted to handle defensive situations, and which types? Is it just going to be pure offense and try to take advantage of skill mismatches? Namestnikov works for some, but not all. Janmark/Rask can likely work in the same subset of identities that a guy like Namestnikov would. However Zach Sanford and Nick Cousins would work well in an entirely different set, or with a different combination of players.

Our 3rd line has an identity: Chew up as many tough defensive minutes as you can, keep it simple on both the rush and on the cycle in the offensive end. More or less perfect for guys like Engvall, Kampf, Kase, and Anderson.

I was hoping for younger guys with more breakout potential. RFA castoffs from other teams. Maybe Max Domi.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

supposedly Elliotte Freidman has said that The Leafs have David Perron as a target this off season can anybody confirm this?

 

[Apex Predator]

I was hoping for younger guys with more breakout potential. RFA castoffs from other teams. Maybe Max Domi.

I know Max Domi is polarizing here but i would love to sign him. He’s a feisty player with some skill. He grew up in Toronto so he knows what the market is like and how much it would mean to win!

 

[WTFMAN99]

supposedly Elliotte Freidman has said that The Leafs have David Perron as a target this off season can anybody confirm this?

I haven't heard it but I would like it...but also be shocked if they pulled it off.

The only reason I say this is because anytime he's had a chance to sign a new contract, he chooses St.Louis.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

I haven't heard it but I would like it...but also be shocked if they pulled it off.

The only reason I say this is because anytime he's had a chance to sign a new contract, he chooses St.Louis.

I agree but it would be a hell of an support piece, if they could somehow replace Mikyehev with Perron that would be great.

Dubas talked about wanting to find the right support pieces to put around Matthews, Marner, and Nylander

Perron would be a hell of a start

 

[Amadeus]

I haven't heard it but I would like it...but also be shocked if they pulled it off.

The only reason I say this is because anytime he's had a chance to sign a new contract, he chooses St.Louis.

It was speculation not a rumor. He said Perron is a perfect fit for them. He is for sure.

 

[facelessjoe1990]

how about sandin for connor zary 1 for 1?

 

[TMLAM34]

My friend knows Tierney, he's a die hard Leaf fan, he'd love to be here.

With Kerfoot most likely gone, I can definitely see the Leafs signing a player like Tierney to help replace him on the PK.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

I was hoping for younger guys with more breakout potential. RFA castoffs from other teams. Maybe Max Domi.

We don't know who is an RFA castoff yet. These are just UFA's. The only RFA castoff I know of at this point is Mete, and I don't think that is what the Leafs really need.

Maybe you get Christian Fischer (ARI), Dylan Gambrell (OTT), Kevin Stenlund (CBJ), Emil Bemstrom (CBJ), and Adam Gaudette (OTT). Brendan Lemieux (LAK) may also be one. I don't think NYR gives up on Blais, nor does NJD give up on Wood, just because they were hurt. The only ones on defense I would expect are possible are Jacob Larsson (ANA) and Haydn Fleury (SEA).

The problem with those guys is that they are not very good and have never really been that good. Some of them may be very interesting depth options for the Marlies or as AAAA guys who may have a chance to compete with some of our prospects, but they don't have the track record a lot of those UFA options do and are far less likely to win jobs. They are fringy type players on weaker teams, and I think I would rather just take a bet on our prospects (who are younger and have more promise) if I am going with a fringy guy without much of a proven track record.

There are not many worthwhile cheap non-tender candidates worth mentioning either because they are getting non-tendered for just being bad rather than too expensive.

Now if a guy like Luke Kunin (NSH) is non-tendered, because he does have a fairly high QO for a guy who only had 13 goals, 22 points, and not much in terms of high end defensive value to make up for it, then he is a guy I would go after hard. Like Rask, he is a guy who would fit better in our system than Minnesota's (or Nashville's for that matter). Former 1st rounder who is only turning 25. But I think that is the best you can realistically hope for, and it is 50/50 at best right now.

Of course, there could also be some buyouts as well (Phil Myers from NSH is a decent bet and one that I am sure the Leafs will have interest in), but we'll cross that bridge before it comes because that is even harder to predict.

I think it is also important to consider bounce back potential. Sanford is only 27. Tierney is only 27. A few other guys on that list are in that age range themselves, and they have proven they were capable for more than one year when they were in their early-mid 20's. A fresh start on a good team like ours could be a way to get great value out of a cheaper contract.

 

[Maplebeasts]

how about sandin for connor zary 1 for 1?

No thanks. Not really sure Zary becomes anything impactful and with Muzzin being so injured and slowing down we're going to need Sandin.

 

[Menzinger]

The only trade I'd consider for Sandin/Lily would be for a young centre of a similar age (or maybe bit younger)

 

[Menzinger]

Engvall for Greenway is intriguing.

Minnesota gets Cap-savings which they need badly and gets a potentially better offensive player with speed (albeit not by a lot), which they're missing as well.

Leafs get a heavier version of Engvall with more grit

It is. But the Wild are VERY high on the guy. Would likely want a strong return

 

[SprDaVE]

I think we see the Leafs swing a bigger trade with the Flyers this off-season. For a team that was 2nd last in scoring (Goals for), the Flyers should be looking at the Leafs for some help (2nd most in the league).

I'm not really sure what direction they go or how big of a trade it becomes, but there are 3 or 4 pieces on that team that make sense in my mind:

1. Travis Konecny - Kind of a pest to play against with potential to score and skates well. This is the type of player that I would look at as my main target. Does it become a Kerfoot + Robertson + ? Or is it in a larger deal.

2. Scott Laughton - He's your 3rd line centre that you can play in that spot for the next 5 years. You've got a physical centre, with not a ton of offensive potential, but exactly what you'd be looking for in playoff hockey.

3. Morgan Frost - I think the Flyers move on from Frost because they don't exactly know what he's going to be at the next level. I think you could find a role for him throughout the line-up.

This could be a bigger deal with a bunch of pieces that you move to change the dynamics of each team. Maybe this is a deal that you need to include some prospects to get it done.

All good targets. I think Laughton fits pretty much what we need more of on paper. He's signed long-term though at 3M per, which isn't good at all for a 30 point producer. Not sure the Flyers would want to punt him out so soon either.

 

[WTFMAN99]

how about sandin for connor zary 1 for 1?

Good god no.

With Kerfoot most likely gone, I can definitely see the Leafs signing a player like Tierney to help replace him on the PK.

Yea, I think he's good for like 30 points a year.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

It was speculation not a rumor. He said Perron is a perfect fit for them. He is for sure.

where did he say it? I want to hear/see it