GDT: Trade and Free Agency Thread - 2021/22 PART IX

[hobarth]

I think there's quite a few players TO could/should trade/move in order to get over the hurdle of any success in the playoffs.

My list, it wouldn't break my heart to see any of them traded and I think most/all have shown they don't have what it takes to ensure future success:

Rielly
Muzzin
Holl
Dermott
Lyubushkin
Kerfoot
Mikheyev
Kampf
Kase
Clifford
Simmonds
Robertson

I think moving a lot of these guys would be additions by subtractions, it's tiresome watching the same players not have what it takes when the going gets tough year after year.

I don't necessarily think these guys are useless but together on one team they are not assets.

Click to read more...

 

[Mess]

Maple Leafs Sign Morgan Rielly To Eight-year Contract Extension

October 29, 2021

The Toronto Maple Leafs announced today that the hockey club has signed defenceman Morgan Rielly to an eight-year contract extension. The average annual value of the contract is $7.5 million.

Maple Leafs Sign Morgan Rielly To Eight-year Contract Extension

I think its pretty safe to say that he isn't going anywhere soon.

 

[Mess]

New thread to continue discussion.

Old Thread : ....GDT: - Trade and Free Agency Thread - 2021/22 PART VIII

 

[Havoc]

wtf is Rielly doing on your list

 

[PROUD PAPA]

wtf is Rielly doing on your list

His name sticks out like a sore thumb.
And how has Robertson shown what he does or doesn't have? Or Lyubushkin for that matter.

 

[Nylanderthal]

I think there's quite a few players TO could/should trade/move in order to get over the hurdle of any success in the playoffs.

My list, it wouldn't break my heart to see any of them traded and I think most/all have shown they don't have what it takes to ensure future success:

Rielly
Muzzin
Holl
Dermott
Lyubushkin
Kerfoot
Mikheyev
Kampf
Kase
Clifford
Simmonds
Robertson

I think moving a lot of these guys would be additions by subtractions, it's tiresome watching the same players not have what it takes when the going gets tough year after year.

I don't necessarily think these guys are useless but together on one team they are not assets.

So literally the whole team aside from the 4 “core” forwards and 2 young Swedish D? Oh bunting & Spezza made your cut.
Edit: fail to see either goalie, which considering the play of both of late and the general topic of conversations here I kinda think is really odd tbh.

 

[Griffin76]

Are we allowed to vote someone off the island around here??

 

[Scion]

I think there's quite a few players TO could/should trade/move in order to get over the hurdle of any success in the playoffs.

My list, it wouldn't break my heart to see any of them traded and I think most/all have shown they don't have what it takes to ensure future success:

Rielly
Muzzin
Holl
Dermott
Lyubushkin
Kerfoot
Mikheyev
Kampf
Kase
Clifford
Simmonds
Robertson

I think moving a lot of these guys would be additions by subtractions, it's tiresome watching the same players not have what it takes when the going gets tough year after year.

I don't necessarily think these guys are useless but together on one team they are not assets.

I stopped reading after Rielly.

 

[Havoc]

His name sticks out like a sore thumb.
And how has Robertson shown what he does or doesn't have? Or Lyubushkin for that matter.

I honestly didn't make it far enough to know he snuck Robertson in at the end

 

[Scion]

Are we allowed to vote someone off the island around here??

My thoughts exactly.

 

[kb]

I stopped reading after Rielly.

I didn't know some one who loved Babcock had a burner account.

I see a lot of very good solid players who could win.

 

[Judas Tavares]

Just bringing this tweet over to the new thread cause I found it interesting.



As mentioned before, this would take us out of the big cat sweepstakes but still leave us enough to make some good moves.

If we are truly pursuing upgrades, then I'd like to see the guys those upgrades are replacing shipped out for picks. And shipped out before the moves are made.

Let's say Mikheyev and Dermott are the odd ones out. Ship each out for let's say a 4th. Opens up more cap space, maybe enabling us to avoid extra retention. Also gives us some additional picks to use as sweeteners in these deals

 

[hamzarocks]

Honestly Sandin should be on the table for a Chychuran deal

Sandin will be blocked by Rielly for basically the next 8 years. He's never touching that level of play and we don't want him to be taking minutes away from Rielly a top 10-15D in the league since 2018.

If we are getting Chychuran he is better and probably stays better than Sandin for the remainder of his current contract. That's 3 years I believe where we have a top 50D at 4ishM. In the crazy case that Sandin does become better than Chychuran in the next few years his playstyle and value would be coming mostly from an area which Rielly is already provide plenty of value

Chychuran can replace and provide more value to tbe team as the 2LHd then Muzzin did in 2019 and 2020.

I would deal Sandin + 2022 1st + 2023 2nd for Chychuran straight

Next 2 years the D-Core is set

Rielly - Brodie
Chychuran - Lilijgren

With the potential return from a muzzin deal being a 3RHD/3LHD with value who can compliment Niemela who should be a leaf by 2023

 

[Contenderorpretender]

I think there's quite a few players TO could/should trade/move in order to get over the hurdle of any success in the playoffs.

My list, it wouldn't break my heart to see any of them traded and I think most/all have shown they don't have what it takes to ensure future success:

Rielly
Muzzin
Holl
Dermott
Lyubushkin
Kerfoot
Mikheyev
Kampf
Kase
Clifford
Simmonds
Robertson

I think moving a lot of these guys would be additions by subtractions, it's tiresome watching the same players not have what it takes when the going gets tough year after year.

I don't necessarily think these guys are useless but together on one team they are not assets.

Lol I won't discuss Rielly. But if you think getting rid of kampf would be addition by subtraction, you have terrible math skills.

 

[SprDaVE]

Just bringing this tweet over to the new thread cause I found it interesting.



As mentioned before, this would take us out of the big cat sweepstakes but still leave us enough to make some good moves.

If we are truly pursuing upgrades, then I'd like to see the guys those upgrades are replacing shipped out for picks. And shipped out before the moves are made.

Let's say Mikheyev and Dermott are the odd ones out. Ship each out for let's say a 4th. Opens up more cap space, maybe enabling us to avoid extra retention. Also gives us some additional picks to use as sweeteners in these deals

This seems like not much will happen then. You have to give to get and if you're not offering any of the good assets, you probably won't be offered anything good. Although I have a good feeling Kral, SDA, Kokkonen, Hirvonen, Holmgren, Dzusak and the other midish level prospects are more than available for the right trade.

The Leafs will probably try to play moneyball for an upgrade somewhere. Lyub was more or less that kind of addition.

 

[dubplatepressure]

This seems like not much will happen then. You have to give to get and if you're not offering any of the good assets, you probably won't be offered anything good. Although I have a good feeling Kral, SDA, Kokkonen, Hirvonen, Holmgren, Dzusak and the other midish level prospects are more than available for the right trade.

The Leafs will probably try to play moneyball for an upgrade somewhere. Lyub was more or less that kind of addition.

I don't know, I think a package of our 2nd, Steeves, and Holl can probably get you something pretty decent.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

This seems like not much will happen then. You have to give to get and if you're not offering any of the good assets, you probably won't be offered anything good. Although I have a good feeling Kral, SDA, Kokkonen, Hirvonen, Holmgren, Dzusak and the other midish level prospects are more than available for the right trade.

The Leafs will probably try to play moneyball for an upgrade somewhere. Lyub was more or less that kind of addition.

You can get some really good players with those pieces, especially when teams start to realize their asking prices are ludicrous and need to take what they can get.

Really, it almost looks like they are looking for reclamation projects. Someone who can maybe upgrade their 4th line and maybe step into a higher role if things go well, but won't cost a lot on the cap or in terms of assets.

Remember that even if we get someone with term, we don't have a ton of cap to work with next year unless we are dumping a lot of other guys who are valuable to this team (i.e. Kerfoot and Holl).

 

[Judas Tavares]

This seems like not much will happen then. You have to give to get and if you're not offering any of the good assets, you probably won't be offered anything good. Although I have a good feeling Kral, SDA, Kokkonen, Hirvonen, Holmgren, Dzusak and the other midish level prospects are more than available for the right trade.

The Leafs will probably try to play moneyball for an upgrade somewhere. Lyub was more or less that kind of addition.

Seems to me like the goal might be to add for example a Gio, Braun and middle 6 forward instead of going for one big fish.

 

[Magic Man]

Would I trade Topi Niemela for JT Miller? Yeah, I can't say for sure that Niemela will ever impact a hockey game at the level JT does. JT has 20 more points than the next closest forward on his team, He's top-10 in league scoring, while bringing just about every other intangible. Topi is a really good prospect right now. Do I want to trade him for basically anyone else right now? Nope. Rentals aren't worth it to me and no one else with term who is available outside of Chychrun really commands that type of prospect.

 

[SprDaVE]

Seems to me like the goal might be to add for example a Gio, Braun and middle 6 forward instead of going for one big fish.

Yeah maybe. But then add the other tidbits that the Leafs don't want to chase a big rental, it dwindles down the trading pool considerably. Most forwards you'd want with term will cost a 1st or at the very least one of the prospects listed.

You can get some really good players with those pieces, especially when teams start to realize their asking prices are ludicrous and need to take what they can get.

Really, it almost looks like they are looking for reclamation projects. Someone who can maybe upgrade their 4th line and maybe step into a higher role if things go well, but won't cost a lot on the cap or in terms of assets.

Remember that even if we get someone with term, we don't have a ton of cap to work with next year unless we are dumping a lot of other guys who are valuable to this team (i.e. Kerfoot and Holl).

Sounds to me like they want the perfect fit without having to give up much. I don't see a lot of fits. I'm sure they can find a solid secondary player or two with the players/prospects I listed but... It feels not likely to happen.

I don't know, I think a package of our 2nd, Steeves, and Holl can probably get you something pretty decent.

I feel like Steeves is on the level of Robertson. Someone that can join the Leafs right now have some sort of impact. He's been turning heads. PPG in the AHL as a rookie is pretty good. I don't see him used in a trade unless it's too good to say no to. I value him a whole lot more than other prospects.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

Seems to me like the goal might be to add for example a Gio, Braun and middle 6 forward instead of going for one big fish.

I seriously question why people think the Leafs are going to add another RD when they already have Holl (currently) sitting in the pressbox due to a lack of spots in the lineup.

Holl is already better than the vast majority of RD rentals on the market, including Braun.

Now I don't think Holl is going to be a permanent fixture in the pressbox, but then you have Lyubushkin or Liljegren sitting there instead... Which is not any more ideal.

If we add a defenseman, it is because Muzzin is not coming back at all... And it would be a LD.

 

[Judas Tavares]

I feel like Steeves is on the level of Robertson. Someone that can join the Leafs right now have some sort of impact. He's been turning heads. PPG in the AHL as a rookie is pretty good. I don't see him used in a trade unless it's too good to say no to. I value him a whole lot more than other prospects.

I think the team has a very sizeable crop of B prospects. Some you could argue they have a case for being a lower A prospect. Some you could easily put in the C crop. But the list seems to be:

Abramov
Abruzzese
Hirvonen
Holmberg
Kokkonen
Kral
Rubins
Steeves
Tverberg
Voit

They won't get you a big fish, but maybe coupled together or along with a mid-round pick, you could land an upgrade. But yes, filtering out the A list and our 1st and rental vs. term, the possibilities do shrink.

 

[Magic Man]

I think the team has a very sizeable crop of B prospects. Some you could argue they have a case for being a lower A prospect. Some you could easily put in the C crop. But the list seems to be:

Abramov
Abruzzese
Hirvonen
Holmberg
Kokkonen
Kral
Rubins
Steeves
Tverberg
Voit

They won't get you a big fish, but maybe coupled together or along with a mid-round pick, you could land an upgrade. But yes, filtering out the A list and our 1st and rental vs. term, the possibilities do shrink.

Pretty good list. I'd drop Voit to the C list. But, other than that, that looks like the right group of guys for the B list.

 

[Menzinger]

This seems like not much will happen then. You have to give to get and if you're not offering any of the good assets, you probably won't be offered anything good. Although I have a good feeling Kral, SDA, Kokkonen, Hirvonen, Holmgren, Dzusak and the other midish level prospects are more than available for the right trade.

The Leafs will probably try to play moneyball for an upgrade somewhere. Lyub was more or less that kind of addition.

Yep. And I suspect they may opt to try and do the same. Add another Bunting type forward and/o r an undervalued D with strong analytics.

Went big fish hunting last tdl. A different approach can't hurt I suppose

 

[hamzarocks]

If leafs want to go all in for this and next season these are the deals I look at

Trade 1; Add our 3rd best forward on the team

Toronto: JT Miller@50%, Luke Schenn

To Van: Justin Holl(cap piece), Nic Robertson (top 30 prospect league wide), Topi Niemela (top 50 prospect league wide) and 2022 2nd

Leafs give up 2 A- prospects, add a top 60 pick and then holl is a vet who the Canucks can either keep and look at seeing if he fits on the team or move in the offseason for a mid round pick or two

Trade 2: Add our #2D for both the now and future

To Toronto: Jacob Chychuran

To Arizona: Rasmus Sandin, Toronto 2022 1st, and 2023 2nd

Leafs give up our best/2nd best young NHL player (non Core players, as those guys while young are established now as a top 3ish player, a top 20ish player and a top 50ish player)

Trade 3: Get a goalie with term whose proven to be elite

To Toronto: Saros

To Preds: Mrazek, 2023 1st and 2024 st

Leafs give 2 1sts for a goalie but both are late picks with the team we will have. Saros is proven elite and is one of the best in the league. Has 3 years term after this at only 5M. We also move on from Mrazek. Preds get to add for a retool if they choose to go that route and they have Askarov for the very near future making the loss of Saros bearable.

Leafs roster after these deals for the 2022 playoffs

Bunting - Matthews - Marner
Nylander - JT - JT Miller
Mikheyev - Kerfoot - Kase
Engvall - Kampf - Spezza

Rielly - Brodie
Chychuran - Lilijgren
Muzzin* - Lyubushkin

Saros
Campbell

Scratches: Dermott/Schenn/Simmonds/Clifford

With Muzzin on LTIR it works capwise with Simmond and Clifford to Taxi squad. Come playoffs with the cap not counting we can run Muzzin in the team as our 3LHD.

This team on paper has no holes and would be 2019-2021 Tampa level deep, with them being better in the net, better top end producers and probably a similar level defensive core