Confirmed with Link: Toronto gets Campbell and Clifford for Moore, 2nd (cond) & 3rd (Part II)

[TVs Frank]

One issue with Kyle Clifford is a history of concussions. He was on injury reserve in 2918/19 and 2017. His style of play leaves him vulnerable to reinjury. Not saying we shouldn't have taken Clifford, but as Vancouver found out with Ferland, concussion histories come with a high degree of risk.

Note: Interestingly, it was after a fight with Clifford that Ferland went on injury reserve back at the end of October 2019 and has been pretty much injured ever since. If you watch the fight, Clifford only got one clean shot in that knocked off Ferland’s helmet, which makes me think that when you have a concussion history it doesn’t take much to have a serious reinjury.

 

[TMLS]

Please make Campbell the starting goalie even when Andersen comes back. Campbell so much better positionaly and better reflexes than Andersen. He was 10-14-1 and still put up a .928 sv% on a garbage team last year. Pretty sure he was a top 10 draft pick too, as a goalie that is super tough to do.

 

[Wafflewhipper]

Glad we didnt overpay for Georgiev

I'm feeling optimistic about having some new players in the line up. I'll worry about the cost later to evaluate the trade as a fan

Me too! This trade fit like a glove.

 

[Wafflewhipper]

Please make Campbell the starting goalie even when Andersen comes back. Campbell so much better positionaly and better reflexes than Andersen. He was 10-14-1 and still put up a .928 sv% on a garbage team last year. Pretty sure he was a top 10 draft pick too, as a goalie that is super tough to do.

That avatar is effecting your thinking. Damn i cringe seeing that thing. You must like him too or you wouldn’t have photoshopped it to make him look better

 

[Gabriel426]

Are we going to start calling Muzzin and Clifford the Bash Brothers?

 

[TMLS]

This team needs to go on a big win streak if they wanna make the playoffs. The goaltending was horrendous on 2 must win games. Hopefully Dubas didn't wait too late to get a competent backup.

Trust me on this, Campbell will be a better starting goalie than that choke Andersen. He way quicker and has better reflexes than Andersen too, plus he actually likes playing in high pressure games unlike the choker Andersen. Cant wait to see him steal the starting job from the overrated Andersen. You will realize how slow Andersens reflexes are compared to a true atheletic goalie like Campbell.

 

[Mess]

Like the trade but it will be a loss if we fail to make the playoffs and let Clifford walk for nothing along with Barrie and possibly Muzzin.

Dubas went all in and mortgaged the future for this year and if the Leafs miss the playoffs and those UFA walk then the damage the prospect pool both picks and players will be significant and all lost with little to no residual value..

Leafs trade 1st 2019 + 2 X former 2nd round picks Grundstrom + Durzi
Leafs traded Kadri + Rosen + 3rd for Barrie and Kerfoot
Leafs traded 1st (2020/21) to dump Marleau
Leafs traded Moore and 2 X 3rds for Campbell and Clifford.

Leafs will be out 2 X 1sts + 2 former 2nd round prospects + 3 X 3rds and only have Kerfoot and Campbell to show as remaining pieces just for renting Muzzin, Barrie and Clifford for this year.

If Leafs miss the playoffs this year..
Can you imagine trading 2 X 1sts + 3 X 3rds + Grundstrom, Durzi, Moore, Rosen for Kerfoot (3rd line Centre) and Jack Campbell (backup goalie)?

 

[TMLS]

That avatar is effecting your thinking. Damn i cringe seeing that thing. You must like him too or you wouldn’t have photoshopped it to make him look better

Yes BIG TIME Babcock supporter here!!!!

 

[indigobuffalo]

Please make Campbell the starting goalie even when Andersen comes back. Campbell so much better positionaly and better reflexes than Andersen. He was 10-14-1 and still put up a .928 sv% on a garbage team last year. Pretty sure he was a top 10 draft pick too, as a goalie that is super tough to do.

That’s a really confident quote. Should maybe look up where Rick DiPietro or Al Montoya were drafted...

 

[TMLS]

That’s a really confident quote. Should maybe look up where Rick DiPietro or Al Montoya were drafted...

Trust Campbell better than overated Andersen who stands there frozen on decent shots bc his reflex super slow. Campbell will steal starting job from him by end of next year. Andersen is not a goalie you go on a cup run with, he chokes in high pressure games.

 

[Gabriel426]

@Gary Nylund

Re: "We definitely need picks, it's just that we needed a backup goalie and a guy like Clifford more IMO. We still have a lot of picks and most importantly, we still have our top prospects."

I agree. I acknowledged that in the 1st paragraph of my post as follows:

"Qty two 3rd rounders isn't that big of a deal. And, somehow we found ourselves in a corner without a reliable backup that we could count on. So we addressed an obvious and necessary need, so that's the good part of this, at least short term.

However, as I mentioned in the post, it wasn't just about "this trade" & the two 3rds that were lost. A lot depends on the definition of "lots of picks" I guess. But two 1sts, two 2nds & two 3rds is not exactly a small amount of picks (quantity or quality wise). That's a trend versus an one-off occurrence.

I think we'd need to be extremely lucky for us not to be impacted by this some time in the future. Other teams like Pittsburgh, L.A. and Chicago have found this out and were all impacted eventually. They eventually found out how difficult it was to maintain their high level of success without replenishing their prospect pools with good, low cost ELC talent.

The difference between those teams and us though is those teams had multiple Cup wins versus what we've accomplished. You'd expect them to run out of gas so-to-speak eventually. But, we haven't even really started.

It was also kind of ironic how we've reversed our stance on this subject in just a couple of years.

There's some nuance here, so hopefully this won't fall into the more simplistic bucket of "we needed to do it". I agree with that, but also think like most things, it will have (longer term) consequences.

Would have been easier if the previous thread wasn't closed, so sorry about that.

You are right but one thing the Leafs has done well in the past few years is getting Euros and young UFA signings. Zai, Soup, Moore and Holl were not drafted from the Leafs and the fact that these 4 are either 4 or 5 Dman and mid 6 wingers are literally like late 1st rounder to mid 3rd rounder. Ofcourse, the Leafs got a few busts too, such as Oz, Borgman, Rosen, Lindholm and Sosh. As long as the Leafs can continue to find solid NHLers from abroad, the effect of trading away mid round picks is not as bad.

 

[Wafflewhipper]

Yes BIG TIME Babcock supporter here!!!!

Lol i was just kidding. Nothing could make him look better

 

[Chief keefe]

That’s a really confident quote. Should maybe look up where Rick DiPietro or Al Montoya were drafted...

LOOL in defence of Rick though he did have really bad luck too

 

[Wafflewhipper]

You are right but one thing the Leafs has done well in the past few years is getting Euros and young UFA signings. Zai, Soup, Moore and Holl were not drafted from the Leafs and the fact that these 4 are either 4 or 5 Dman and mid 6 wingers are literally like late 1st rounder to mid 3rd rounder. Ofcourse, the Leafs got a few busts too, such as Oz, Borgman, Rosen, Lindholm and Sosh. As long as the Leafs can continue to find solid NHLers from abroad, the effect of trading away mid round picks is not as bad.

I think they are after that Russian goalie thats wanting to play in the Nhl and his contract is up soon. Biliov or something like that. Not usually so lazy but I don’t wantbto go look. We might get him yet. Great numbers over there.

This Guy Maple Leafs interested in record-breaking KHL goalie Timur Bilyalov - Sportsnet.ca

 

[7even]

Low key jacked to see Clifford in this lineup.

 

[Polaris1010]

If Leafs miss the playoffs this year..
Can you imagine trading 2 X 1sts + 3 X 3rds + Grundstrom, Durzi, Moore, Rosen for Kerfoot (3rd line Centre) and Jack Campbell (backup goalie)?

Did this really happen?

It did. It is public record.

People around the league laughing their asses off.

GM Gord Stellick would have out-traded GM Kyle Dubas every day of the week and twice on Sunday.

Soon to be fired!

 

[Once]

Now that this has sunk in, what a great deal. I wanted Clifford real bad last year because he’s the ideal ‘grit guy’ for the modern NHL. He can still play, pot a few goals, and just oozes character.

Campbell’s numbers are better than Hutch’s ever were and this gives me hope. Idk how some people are looking down on this.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

This is a great trade. Now I am not worried about another Freddy injury. This guy can get red hot. Now there is a guy who can go on a 20 game run. Who knows if Freddy can't do it then maybe Campbell takes over the net.

 

[ShaneFalco]

 

[Isaac Nootin]

Dubas went all in and mortgaged the future for this year and if the Leafs miss the playoffs and those UFA walk then the damage the prospect pool both picks and players will be significant and all lost with little to no residual value..

Leafs trade 1st 2019 + 2 X former 2nd round picks Grundstrom + Durzi
Leafs traded Kadri + Rosen + 3rd for Barrie and Kerfoot
Leafs traded 1st (2020/21) to dump Marleau
Leafs traded Moore and 2 X 3rds for Campbell and Clifford.

Leafs will be out 2 X 1sts + 2 former 2nd round prospects + 3 X 3rds and only have Kerfoot and Campbell to show as remaining pieces just for renting Muzzin, Barrie and Clifford for this year.

If Leafs miss the playoffs this year..
Can you imagine trading 2 X 1sts + 3 X 3rds + Grundstrom, Durzi, Moore, Rosen for Kerfoot (3rd line Centre) and Jack Campbell (backup goalie)?

What a pathetic way to look at things.

Not surprising.

 

[KingsHockey24]

 

[Polaris1010]

Low key jacked to see Clifford in this lineup.

We have to look forward to something!

Anything.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

You are right but one thing the Leafs has done well in the past few years is getting Euros and young UFA signings. Zai, Soup, Moore and Holl were not drafted from the Leafs and the fact that these 4 are either 4 or 5 Dman and mid 6 wingers are literally like late 1st rounder to mid 3rd rounder. Ofcourse, the Leafs got a few busts too, such as Oz, Borgman, Rosen, Lindholm and Sosh. As long as the Leafs can continue to find solid NHLers from abroad, the effect of trading away mid round picks is not as bad.

True, but I still think the draft is the #1 tool in the toolbox. Those other methods are more supplemental versus primary imho. I've never kept track, but I think there have been a lot of busts from the KHL & other leagues (you named some).

But, yes I agree that we need to hit on these other methods versus the traditional draft route if we keep trading picks away. We'll have to. I'm starting to get this deja-vu feeling though. We've been down this road before - Burke era free wallets.

 

[indigobuffalo]

Trust Campbell better than overated Andersen who stands there frozen on decent shots bc his reflex super slow. Campbell will steal starting job from him by end of next year. Andersen is not a goalie you go on a cup run with, he chokes in high pressure games.

Hard to imagine Andersen is overrated having never won a Vezina despite seeing more and stopping more shots than any other goalie since he became a Leaf, but I guess we’re not going to rely on data to gauge how “reliable” a goalie is.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m excited we got Campbell, but your claims he’s more trustworthy, more reliable, or less “chokey” are simply your heavily biased and poorly supported opinion.

I hope you end up being right? I guess?

 

[Dough72]

adding a single 4th liner isn't even close to fixing that problem