Proposal: Toronto-Chicago

[Just a Fan]

Put him on a line with Jeremy Bracco. Ignore Craig Button and you wont appear to be so ill informed.

Ah, i'm ill informed....that clearly explains how Fleury's value has doubled although he went from a Vezina win to a 908 save%....thanks for opening my eyes....lol

 

[Sinbad]

Well ya, because it's an overpayment....and quite a sizeable one at that.

If the breakdown is 1st for taking Mrazek (which i also don't agree with) how does Fleury go from winning the Vezina and being traded to Chicago for a nothing prospect to a guy with just under 3 goals against and a 908 save% this season now being worth Robertson+?

Vegas had no leverage when they traded Fleury.

Fleury submits his 10 team no trade which reduces the number of potential trade partners to 21.

Conservatively, another 10 teams have solid goaltending and no need for Fleury (Gibson, Markstrom, Anderson, Bobrovsky/Knight, Saros, Shesterkin, Bennington, Vasikevsky, Demko, Hellebuyck), now you are down to 11 potential trade partners.

Of those 11 teams, how many would have the $7m in cap space to eat the full hit of Fleury’s contract that Vegas desperately needed in order to be cap compliant?

That is why the Hawks were able to get him basically for free, it had nothing to do with his abilities. As for Fleury’s play this year, he has had some bad games but overall he has been extremely good, especially considering the team in front of him.

 

[Just a Fan]

Vegas had no leverage when they traded Fleury.

Fleury submits his 10 team no trade which reduces the number of potential trade partners to 21.

Conservatively, another 10 teams have solid goaltending and no need for Fleury (Gibson, Markstrom, Anderson, Bobrovsky/Knight, Saros, Shesterkin, Bennington, Vasikevsky, Demko, Hellebuyck), now you are down to 11 potential trade partners.

Of those 11 teams, how many would have the $7m in cap space to eat the full hit of Fleury’s contract that Vegas desperately needed in order to be cap compliant?

That is why the Hawks were able to get him basically for free, it had nothing to do about his abilities. As for Fleury’s play this year, he has had some bad games but overall he has been extremely good, especially considering the team in front of him.

Being polite, an expiring vet goaltender with his current stats isn’t worth a Robertson level prospect +.

 

[Sinbad]

I didn't skip it over, I was responding specifically to your valuation of Fleury 50% retained. And no, dumping mrazek is not worth giving away a first either. The way I see it, Chicago won't be a playoff team for the next couple seasons and don't have a goalie going into next year, what are their options?

Mrazek, 2022 first round pick, 2023 second round pick, topi niemela and another prospect (hirvonen, abruzzese, whoever) for Fleury 50% retained and Connor Murphy. That's probably more or less what that trade would look like

As you said yourself, the Hawks won’t be a playoff team for a few years so they don’t need a star in net. Having said that, there will be a ton of free agents looking for deals after the season:

Kuemper, Koskinen, Greiss, Halak, Korpisalo, Francouz, Holtby, Forsberg, Husso, Fleury…

Hell, with the way Jack Campbell has played since Christmas, they may be able to sign him for less than Mrazek’s $3.8m.

 

[Sinbad]

Being polite, an expiring vet goaltender with his current stats isn’t worth a Robertson level prospect +.

Being polite as well, the game isn’t played on paper, stats are nice and definitely need to be taken into consideration but you also have to watch the games to get a true reflection of Fleury’s play. The team and D in front of him are horrendous which plays a significant role in his stats.

 

[dj Mahoney]

Being polite, an expiring vet goaltender with his current stats isn’t worth a Robertson level prospect +.

You'll soon see again that stats in the regular season are meaningless Mathews,Marner , Tavares have great stats during the season and suck every year in the post season. Fleury has been to 5 finals . Pay up or book your Tee Times ,5 or 6 teams bidding on Blackhawks Fleury with expiring contract.

 

[Just a Fan]

You'll soon see again that stats in the regular season are meaningless Mathews,Marner , Tavares have great stats a suck every year in the post season. Fleury has been to 5 finals . Pay up or book your Tee Times ,5 or 6 teams bidding on Blackhawks Fleury with expiring contract.

I like golf…so no worries here, no need to stupid overpay for Fleury.

 

[Just a Fan]

Being polite as well, the game isn’t played on paper, stats are nice and definitely need to be taken into consideration but you also have to watch the games to get a true reflection of Fleury’s play. The team and D in front of him are horrendous which plays a significant role in his stats.

And the Leafs D will make Fleury shine? No interest in overpaying.

 

[therealkoho]

Robertson is a no go. The leafs need low cap impact players. With Amirov’s health he is the only one who fits this bill right now. Knies may soon join but he doesn’t have the offensive upside of Robertson.


Also Fleury said he doesn’t want to be traded

If Blackhawks do trade Marc-Andre Fleury, which teams are possibilities?

Marc-Andre Fleury acknowledged Wednesday he has thought about the possibility of a trade this spring.

“If I move, I would love a chance to win,” he said. “That’s what I play for, and that’s what I love. But it’s still a big ‘if’ at this point.”

So if Fleury is traded by the Blackhawks, where will he go?

On one hand, answering that question is simpler in Fleury’s case than for most major trade-bait items. There are only 32 starting goalie jobs in the NHL, and an even smaller slice of teams fit the two descriptions — trying to win now, and needing goaltending help — that would make them plausible suitors.

that sound's nothing like a no, no?

 

[HockeyVirus]

should really simplify this

Leafs get
fleury 50%

Hawks get
2022 1st round pick toronto
Mrazek
Robertson
Conditional 2nd 2023 that becomes a third if the leafs dont win a round this year

the first round pick is roughly the value of fleury with retention. The cost for dumping Mrazek is Robertosn and the conditional pick which might be a bit light tbh due to mrazek's term but overall this deal is a lot closer imo

lol people said the same about Ritchie...

 

[ChiHawk21]

Fluery 50% for Robertson 2nd and Mrazek boom done

 

[Just a Fan]

Fluery 50% for Robertson and Mrazek boom done

A Chicago fan already said he doesn’t want Robertson….so, to late.

 

[seanlinden]

Vegas had no leverage when they traded Fleury.

Fleury submits his 10 team no trade which reduces the number of potential trade partners to 21.

Conservatively, another 10 teams have solid goaltending and no need for Fleury (Gibson, Markstrom, Anderson, Bobrovsky/Knight, Saros, Shesterkin, Bennington, Vasikevsky, Demko, Hellebuyck), now you are down to 11 potential trade partners.

Of those 11 teams, how many would have the $7m in cap space to eat the full hit of Fleury’s contract that Vegas desperately needed in order to be cap compliant?

That is why the Hawks were able to get him basically for free, it had nothing to do about his abilities. As for Fleury’s play this year, he has had some bad games but overall he has been extremely good, especially considering the team in front of him.

Chicago still doesn't have much "leverage".

Almost half of the league is practically eliminated from the playoffs already; so have no need or desire to add Fleury.

Of the teams in playoff spots / contention for them...
- Carolina, Rangers, Pittsburgh are all very happy with their goaltending.
- Washington has had really good results from Vanecek, and have minimal cap space to add a 3rd goalie (even if double-retained at $1.75m)

- Florida, Tampa & Boston are really happy with their goaltending.
- Toronto could be a buyer.

In the west...
- Dallas, Nashville, satisfied with their goaltending.
- Colorado should be satisfied with their goaltending, and don't really have space to carry a 3rd goalie at $1.75m
- St. Louis may not be thrilled what they're getting form Binnington, but are also likely hesitant to trade him and end up with 0 goalies for next year.
- Minnesota should maybe looking for an upgrade, but I just can't see them abandoning Talbot to do so.

- Calgary satisfied with their goaltending, as is Anaheim & Vancouver.
- LA maybe should be looking for an upgrade, but they're not really into "contender status" yet.
- Suspect the bridge has been burned in Vegas.
- Edmonton could be a buyer.


So who's the real market for Fleury??

Toronto, Edmonton, and maybe Minnesota if the price is right?

 

[seanlinden]

As you said yourself, the Hawks won’t be a playoff team for a few years so they don’t need a star in net. Having said that, there will be a ton of free agents looking for deals after the season:

Kuemper, Koskinen, Greiss, Halak, Korpisalo, Francouz, Holtby, Forsberg, Husso, Fleury…

Hell, with the way Jack Campbell has played since Christmas, they may be able to sign him for less than Mrazek’s $3.8m.

And realizing that Chicago's a pretty bad team... they're going to be fairly close to the bottom of the list for the better guys on that list.

Which one of those do you realistically expect to sign for a better deal than Mrazek at $3.8m x 2 years?

 

[ChiHawk21]

A Chicago fan already said he doesn’t want Robertson….so, to late.

i already said boom done

 

[Just a Fan]

i already said boom done

But he said “you can keep little Robertson “ long before your post…..so, sorry.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

should really simplify this

Leafs get
fleury 50%

Hawks get
2022 1st round pick toronto
Mrazek
Robertson
Conditional 2nd 2023 that becomes a third if the leafs dont win a round this year

the first round pick is roughly the value of fleury with retention. The cost for dumping Mrazek is Robertosn and the conditional pick which might be a bit light tbh due to mrazek's term but overall this deal is a lot closer imo

I don't think Robertson is the prospect in that deal.

also the 2023 3rd is not eligible to be traded

 

[FerrisRox]

Funny to see how valuable Hagel is yet Kerfoot is out producing him, is better defensively and can play Center/wing yet is somehow considered a cap dump lol.

I don't think Kerfoot is better than Hagel defensively. Hagel is a very solid two-way forward and does a great job killing penalties and brings a lot more grit to the table than Kerfoot for a much lower price tag.

I'm not saying Kerfoot is a cap dump - that's dumb - but I think Hagel is better defensively, grinds it out on the ice and plays a chippy style and a more valuable asset than Kerfoot.

 

[goldenbladz1]

The difference in salary doesn't make one worth a first+ and the other a cap dump. Look, I agree that Kerfoot does nothing in this trade but it gets tiring hearing people say how bad his contract is. He's a 40 point middle six forward making 3.5m...

I'm not saying Kerfoot is bad as I actually like him and think he doesn't get much credit but he is not the type player a rebuilding team needs. The Hawks need prospects and picks also I'm more defending the Hagel talk with people mentioning the 20% shooting. Yes it will come back down but still incredible value at $1.5 mill for the type of 200 ft player that produces.

 

[Ziggdiezan]

I don't think Kerfoot is better than Hagel defensively. Hagel is a very solid two-way forward and does a great job killing penalties and brings a lot more grit to the table than Kerfoot for a much lower price tag.

I'm not saying Kerfoot is a cap dump - that's dumb - but I think Hagel is better defensively, grinds it out on the ice and plays a chippy style and a more valuable asset than Kerfoot.

Thats debatable I guess as Kerfoot is also a good two player who plays on a top PK. I agree, Hagel is a more valuable asset than Kerfoot mainly due to his contract. However he isn't worth 1st+Robertson+, especially if people in this thread are viewing Kerfoot as a dump.

 

[TML Dynasty]

If Fleury goes its to a contender.....Toronto really only one that is needing a goalie. (def see the irony of calling them a contender without a goalie...) And he's a UFA that'll cost a lot next year. I dont think he'll cost that much by himself.....itll be more of a favor from Chicago. Retention gets a small add for sure....maybe double retention needed if they aren't taking Mrazek back.

 

[u2wojo]

Mrazek may not have much of any value, but to suggest he's as problematic as the Marleau deal is extremely farfetched.

He's a tandem goalie of reasonable quality, signed at a reasonable price. Chicago has no goaltenders signed for next year, and the UFA market is pretty ugly. For a team like Chicago who doesn't have a goalie, Mrazek at 2 years at $3.8m might actually be one of their 2 best options.


Mrazek, maybe he's worth a 6th or 7th... maybe he should cost a 6th or 7th to get rid of. Ultimately, in the context for a Fleury deal for Chicago, you do it facilitate the trade.

Mrazek has 2 years left and has been awful...not so sure that is much different than one year of Marleau. If you want to sell Mrazek as some sort of "reasonable quality" "reasonable price" and the "UFA market is pretty ugly" then who are the Leafs replacing him with when he is gone seeing that they have no goalie under contract w/o Mrazek? Me thinks you might be trying to polish up a turd and sell him hoping the buyer won't notice it is a turd. No one is taking Mrazek without a significant sweetener much less actually giving a pick back.

 

[dj Mahoney]

Mrazek has 2 years left and has been awful...not so sure that is much different than one year of Marleau. If you want to sell Mrazek as some sort of "reasonable quality" "reasonable price" and the "UFA market is pretty ugly" then who are the Leafs replacing him with when he is gone seeing that they have no goalie under contract w/o Mrazek? Me thinks you might be trying to polish up a turd and sell him hoping the buyer won't notice it is a turd. No one is taking Mrazek without a significant sweetener much less actually giving a pick back.

Mrazek is garbage always has been. Blackhawks want your Mini Finn defenceman ( Topi Niemela) that has replaced Robertson and Bracco as a cant miss super star just for taking Mrazek contract. Now If you want Hagel and Fleury add 1st ,4th Roni Hirvonen ,Nick Abruzzese ,plus,,,

 

[AcerComputer]

should really simplify this

Leafs get
fleury 50%

Hawks get
2022 1st round pick toronto
Mrazek
Robertson
Conditional 2nd 2023 that becomes a third if the leafs dont win a round this year

the first round pick is roughly the value of fleury with retention. The cost for dumping Mrazek is Robertosn and the conditional pick which might be a bit light tbh due to mrazek's term but overall this deal is a lot closer imo

When was the last time a goalie with a .908 save% traded at the deadline for a package like this? Lucky to get a 2nd for Fluery. Rental goalies aren't worth that much. Especially one with a 7M caphit, even with retention, it will be hard for a playoff team to make that fit.

 

[seanlinden]

Mrazek has 2 years left and has been awful...not so sure that is much different than one year of Marleau. If you want to sell Mrazek as some sort of "reasonable quality" "reasonable price" and the "UFA market is pretty ugly" then who are the Leafs replacing him with when he is gone seeing that they have no goalie under contract w/o Mrazek? Me thinks you might be trying to polish up a turd and sell him hoping the buyer won't notice it is a turd. No one is taking Mrazek without a significant sweetener much less actually giving a pick back.

Mrazek had a rough start to the year, got hurt, and has obviously struggled to get going. This is still a guy that averaged over .910, and under 2.40 throughout his tenure in Carolina. Marleau was literally $6m in cap hit TO PLAY FOR ANOTHER TEAM. There is no comparable.

As for what the Leafs are doing, presumably, they're signing Campbell to a deal somewhere in the 4s or 5s; at which point they will need to go try and hit the bargain bin for a backup in the $1-2 range, or potentially trade for somebody that makes less than Mrazek does.

There are lots of teams that need help in goal, and if you're looking at the UFA class, once the desirable ones get scooped up by good teams, there will be teams that are more than happy to have Mrazek for 2 years than go for whats left.