Pre-Game Talk: Toronto @ Boston -- game 5.

[MilkofthePoppy]

The whole Leafs formula to winning is overwhelming offense spearheading the way with mediocre, unpredictable budget goaltending supplying just good enough netminding. Similar to Colorado with Georgiev. So putting the blame on Samsonov for this and that going wrong is technically correct but also misses the point that other, more key parts didn’t deliver.

The unpredictable budget goaltending of Georgiev is doing significantly better than the 8 million dollar perennial Vezina candidate in Winnipeg. All the goalies I have seen in these playoffs have let in soft goals; however, they often get goal scoring support. Our team cannot score to save their lives.

 

[thewave]

I am beyond beating a dead horse, I am grinding it into a fine mush, but I wish I could see an alternate reality of what happened if the Leafs traded Marner after the Habs series. For most teams having a guy wearing a letter crying in the penalty box from the pressure is where you cannot have them dress again.

Obviously.

Shanahan was essentially a con-man. He hired a yes man and person similar in Dubas.

I was horrified when they hired Dubas. Its all on record. He was every single negative thing I said he would be.

That isnt me wearing it as a badge of honor btw. I am just not shocked is all.

 

[ACC1224]

I am beyond beating a dead horse, I am grinding it into a fine mush, but I wish I could see an alternate reality of what happened if the Leafs traded Marner after the Habs series. For most teams having a guy wearing a letter crying in the penalty box from the pressure is where you cannot have them dress again.

Which has absolutely nothing to do with tomorrow nights game.

 

[Rare Jewel]

I am beyond beating a dead horse, I am grinding it into a fine mush, but I wish I could see an alternate reality of what happened if the Leafs traded Marner after the Habs series. For most teams having a guy wearing a letter crying in the penalty box from the pressure is where you cannot have them dress again.

If we're talking about alternate realities or sliding doors moments, there are a few others I'd like to investigate as well.

 

[BraveCanadian]

At this point they might as well just go out there and have fun. Abandon the system and keep Boston guessing and play pond hockey. Can't be worse lol

Abandon what system?

 

[Fogelhund]

The whole Leafs formula to winning is overwhelming offense spearheading the way with mediocre, unpredictable budget goaltending supplying just good enough netminding. Similar to Colorado with Georgiev. So putting the blame on Samsonov for this and that going wrong is technically correct but also misses the point that other, more key parts didn’t deliver.

I mean.. what have we scored, something like 17 goals in our last nine playoff games?

You aren't going to win many series averaging less than 2 goals per game. We can talk about Samsonov all we want, but these players, who can produce offensively at an elite level in the regular season, just don't in the playoffs.

 

[Stephen]

I am beyond beating a dead horse, I am grinding it into a fine mush, but I wish I could see an alternate reality of what happened if the Leafs traded Marner after the Habs series. For most teams having a guy wearing a letter crying in the penalty box from the pressure is where you cannot have them dress again.

There were a couple of high profile Marner off ramps that could have been entertained at the time.

First was the injured Jack Eichel. Same draft, had the neck issue, surgery controversy with Buffalo.

Second was Matthew Tkachuk. Could Toronto have sold Canada as a destination and done the Marner for Tkachuk swap then and there?

Of course it could have also been something absolutely terrible. But we’ll never know.

 

[IPS]

The unpredictable budget goaltending of Georgiev is doing significantly better than the 8 million dollar perennial Vezina candidate in Winnipeg. All the goalies I have seen in these playoffs have let in soft goals; however, they often get goal scoring support. Our team cannot score to save their lives.

Forget scoring goals in a vacuum.

We don't exit the zone like actual playoff teams do. We can't execute an effective dump and chase like effective playoff teams do when they neutral zone gets inevitability choked off. We can't generate any sustained pressure whatsoever when we do get the puck in the zone, zero cycle game at all to speak of.

The problems literally start 200 feet down the other way of the ice if you wanna talk about why we can't score goals in the playoffs. The star players dictate it all, they have no interest in doing the hard and tough things above and they just straight up give up in the postseason. End this f***ing core 4 immediately after losing game 5, after this series I am officially over this team.

 

[The Masters]

Hakstol sacked

 

[Stephen]

I mean.. what have we scored, something like 17 goals in our last nine playoff games?

You aren't going to win many series averaging less than 2 goals per game. We can talk about Samsonov all we want, but these players, who can produce offensively at an elite level in the regular season, just don't in the playoffs.

Yep. It all comes down to this. Why do we pay Matthews, Marner, Tavares, Nylander and Rielly all that cap when their offensive output is that of a low talent, low seed team? At this rate we may as well just get a Vezina level goalie and surround him with a bunch of knuckle draggers if the starry offense doesn’t ever show up.

 

[thewave]

Which has absolutely nothing to do with tomorrow nights game.

Tomorrow nights game is rather immaterial to this teams future at the moment. They are off the rails and even if they squirm out of defeat, what does it matter?

This team bailed Keefe out during the slide around the ASG. If they went a few more games he probably would have been canned. Now you have an idiot that cant coach, who many of us have been saying for years now. The majority of fans have clued in and boo'd the team off the ice. Totally frustrated the crap out of MM and ruined that relationship most likely. Can you possibly as a manager mess this up any further? I don't think you can.

So yeah just live it up and pay 480+ for a ticket to a team that doesn't even show up in what is essentially an elimination game. Just wave the flag. Or do what they do in MTL, shit post them to hell. Make tiktoks of tossing out merch etc. Ridicule them and financially cripple them. Cancel Rogers and Bell services. Blame the parent companies for the failures publicly and then... Maybe you will get a team worthy of the logo.

End

 

[Stephen]

Forget scoring goals in a vacuum.

We don't exit the zone like actual playoff teams do. We can't execute an effective dump and chase like effective playoff teams do when they neutral zone gets inevitability choked off. We can't generate any sustained pressure whatsoever when we do get the puck in the zone, zero cycle game at all to speak of.

The problems literally start 200 feet down the other way of the ice if you wanna talk about why we can't score goals in the playoffs. The star players dictate it all, they have no interest in doing the hard and tough things above and they just straight up give up in the postseason. End this f***ing core 4 immediately after losing game 5, after this series I am officially over this team.

This team looks like it’s always scared to go north like they might encounter some problems and retreat to safety. They want to possess the puck but they don’t want to do anything with the puck. And they don’t want to retrieve a puck. They don’t attack a blueline with speed and they just create a neutral zone traffic jam. They get through the traffic jam and they find a park the bus defense. It’s so incompetent.

 

[HockeyVirus]

There were a couple of high profile Marner off ramps that could have been entertained at the time.

First was the injured Jack Eichel. Same draft, had the neck issue, surgery controversy with Buffalo.

Second was Matthew Tkachuk. Could Toronto have sold Canada as a destination and done the Marner for Tkachuk swap then and there?

Of course it could have also been something absolutely terrible. But we’ll never know.

I wonder how serious of a contender they would have been to Pietrengelo and Doughty in free agency where both apparently were open to the idea. If we had dealt Marner for futures and used the cap space to add a piece like that.

As soon as the cap went flat and we realized what the kids wanted to be paid it should have changed the plan. I don't get it.

Which has absolutely nothing to do with tomorrow nights game.

Marner won't be able to play another game in this market without this conversation or similar ones. He needs to go

 

[Racer88]

Yep. It all comes down to this. Why do we pay Matthews, Marner, Tavares, Nylander and Rielly all that cap when their offensive output is that of a low talent, low seed team? At this rate we may as well just get a Vezina level goalie and surround him with a bunch of knuckle draggers if the starry offense doesn’t ever show up.

This is exactly the question, multiple teams with way cheaper players routinely beat us in the playoffs. It’s a total discrace the structure of this team and yet some still defends the structure of our teams and the price we pay these 5 guys

 

[ToneDog]

There were a couple of high profile Marner off ramps that could have been entertained at the time.

First was the injured Jack Eichel. Same draft, had the neck issue, surgery controversy with Buffalo.

Second was Matthew Tkachuk. Could Toronto have sold Canada as a destination and done the Marner for Tkachuk swap then and there?

Of course it could have also been something absolutely terrible. But we’ll never know.

Clearly Eichel, Tkachuk and Bennett are glad Dubas was too dumb to trade for them. Imagine Jack winning cup #2 before McDavid wins one or we win another round. Who'd have thought?

 

[Gallagbi]

I wonder how serious of a contender they would have been to Pietrengelo and Doughty in free agency where both apparently were open to the idea. If we had dealt Marner for futures and used the cap space to add a piece like that.

As soon as the cap went flat and we realized what the kids wanted to be paid it should have changed the plan. I don't get it.

Pretty sure Doughty signed he second he could in LA and made comments about his interest being not very serious.

Pietro could have signed here IMO

 

[Suntouchable13]

This is exactly the question, multiple teams with way cheaper players routinely beat us in the playoffs. It’s a total discrace the structure of this team and yet some still defends the structure of our teams and the price we pay these 5 guys

I have been told many times that once Boston loses Bergeron, Krejci, Chara, Rask due to age that we will surpass them and make a run. How are they still better? Shanahan needs to answer that.

 

[thewave]

I wonder how serious of a contender they would have been to Pietrengelo and Doughty in free agency where both apparently were open to the idea. If we had dealt Marner for futures and used the cap space to add a piece like that.

As soon as the cap went flat and we realized what the kids wanted to be paid it should have changed the plan. I don't get it.



Marner won't be able to play another game in this market without this conversation or similar ones. He needs to go

Keeping Keefe essentially cooked MM here. Think about it. If the team was well coached and had special teams they are tied or maybe up right now. Instead poor coaching sheds blame on soft guys like MM and he is in shambles.

Coaching can negatively impact players reputations and team morale. These dopes don't get it lol

 

[Evilhomer]

Clearly Eichel, Tkachuk and Bennett are glad Dubas was too dumb to trade for them. Imagine Jack winning cup #2 before McDavid wins one or we win another round. Who'd have thought?

I can't imagine Eichel or Tkachuk would have agreed to a trade to any Canadian team. They both clearly want to be in the US.

 

[Divine]

This reminds me of the Nylander situation. Keefe was pretending he was a game time decision and Liljegren was saying I hope he’s not out too long. Now Keefe is acting like Matthews will play but Tavares is saying we need our depth to step up without him.

 

[crump]

To add.

Claire Alexander was a Milkman who quit his job to become a Leaf defenseman and put his face in front of Denis Potvin slap shots for 15,000 a year.

Mario Lemieux came back from cancer, he couldn't even tie up his own skates. He wasn't even the most passionate hockey fan but he showed up like a man to battle with his teammates night in and out.

Gary Roberts came back from what should have been career ending neck injury in Calgary to be a dominant, physical take-no-prisoners playoff beast and almost single handedly drove the Leafs when Sundin went down. He won a Cup in Calgary.

Theo Fleury was 5 foot nothing and never avoided a check, a corner or a drive to the net when it presented itself. Another Cup winner.

Hell, Peter Statsny escaped communism, risking his families life to pursue his dream and he was one of the most dominant players of his era (those Nordiques teams were my favourite outside of T.O).

Tell me this team has the tangibles to get it done like these guys did. It's been April Fools Day every playoff year for the last eight. This team needs to get rid of the driftwood and any executive who continued to support that driftwood.

You can't change a mans DNA or life experiences that makes him the man he is.

Go Leafs Go...

 

[Tak7]

This reminds me of the Nylander situation. Keefe was pretending he was a game time decision and Liljegren was saying I hope he’s not out too long. Now Keefe is acting like Matthews will play but Tavares is saying we need our depth to step up without him.

He's talking like someone who knows Matthews isn't playing tomorrow.

 

[BrannigansLaw]

i hope they play Danny Boy for when the Leafs come out onto the ice. This game is going to be this core’s funeral.

 

[thewave]

This reminds me of the Nylander situation. Keefe was pretending he was a game time decision and Liljegren was saying I hope he’s not out too long. Now Keefe is acting like Matthews will play but Tavares is saying we need our depth to step up without him.

Probably because JT doesn't care about Keefe's stupid shit anymore. AM is shut down and they should shut down Nylander too and go out tbh

 

[TheGreenTBer]

I believe we all want the Leafs to win, it’s just being realistic about team’s chances.

I want to be wrong.

I want to be wrong SO FREAKING HARD. I want Mitch Marner to morph into a playoff God and rub my nose in it. I want Notsince67 to grandstand all over the place when it happens. I want Auston Matthews to be prime Matthews and carry the team on his back all the way to the Cup while snorting blow, pounding hookers and exposing himself to dairy cows. I want William Nylander to develop the world's all-time greatest haircut and to use it to distract opponents while crushing zone entries like a boss. I want Joseph Woll to mind meld Vulcan-style with Prime Hasek. I want all the homers and optimists and stuff to be completely right and for this team to climb all the way to the top of that playoff mountain and dump every bodily fluid all over the summit of that mountain. I want to travel to Toronto when that happens and pass out in the streets like a college student on a bender.

But I call it how I see it. I dream that I'm wrong, I truly do. I have no problem admitting when I'm wrong and in this case I want to be. But when it comes to these guys, and this team...I don't think I'm wrong. I don't think they have it, I'm pretty confident they don't, and I'm just tired of it.