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Player Discussion Tony DeAngelo - Part II

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Previous thread recap:

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I get the arguments FOR playing ADA. Our D sucks and most of it has no future with the team while ADA is talented and has played at least as well as everyone else plus he's young and a rebuilding year is the best time to give him an extended look.

What are the arguments AGAINST playing ADA? It seems to boil down to an assumption that the coach knows best and something is happening in practice or behind the scenes that we don't know about, the notion that we are (or need to be) showcasing other players, or the belief that ADA is not good enough to even be arguing about, in other words a general disregard for the importance of icing your best lineup and big league player development.

Is there another angle I am missing?
 
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Elite talent really has nothing to do with this so I'm not sure why that is being brought up. Winning a draft lottery is not an organization skill. Developing players is.

We're going to need to decide what to do with Pionk and ADA moving forward. Be it a contract or moving on. I would rather see both play in every game, to give us the largest sample to go off of. It doesn't really matter to me if people think one or both suck - we suck. The defense is horrible, and if they play over a 30 yr old that we're stuck with cause of their contract, so be it. There's never a better time than now to let them play and make mistakes.
 
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This place is acting like the rebuild is 380 games in as opposed to 80 games in, and ADA has been scratched for years as opposed to 15 games. His last 10 games played have been ass. You can argue everyone else has been ass too so why does he sit? He's young! Except that's NOT giving out ice time via merit. We hate that when its a vet who gets it for experience and room presence but it's okay if someone is under 24 bc YOOTH?!?

You might as well put faith in the coach with this one dudes. He's not getting fired for at least another 2 years anyway.
 
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If the team doesn't like him for whatever reason(s) they should trade him. Not sure how much value he would have at this point, but it's better than whatever we're doing with him now.
 
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nyr2k2 said:
If the team doesn't like him for whatever reason(s) they should trade him. Not sure how much value he would have at this point, but it's better than whatever we're doing with him now.
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Alone i cant imagine him having much value,but maybe attached to Hayes or Zuc in a trade gets us another pick or maybe middle of the road prospect.
 
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East Coast Bias said:
Elite talent really has nothing to do with this so I'm not sure why that is being brought up. Winning a draft lottery is not an organization skill. Developing players is.

We're going to need to decide what to do with Pionk and ADA moving forward. Be it a contract or moving on. I would rather see both play in every game, to give us the largest sample to go off of. It doesn't really matter to me if people think one or both suck - we suck. The defense is horrible, and if they play over a 30 yr old that we're stuck with cause of their contract, so be it. There's never a better time than now to let them play and make mistakes.
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McQuaid gets traded, they both play every game. They both get bridge deals.
 
I think ADA demonstrated both the good and the bad in his game that still exists.

I'm in the camp of playing him to see what he becomes. But I will also admit that it's frustrating that at age 23, and with three years of pro experience he's still at that point as player
 
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Edge said:
I think ADA demonstrated both the good and the bad in his game that still exists.

I'm in the camp of playing him to see what he becomes. But I will also admit that it's frustrating that at age 23, and with three years of pro experience he's still at that point as player
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Not that I entirely disagree, but I will state that if you are a player whose game relies on playing on the limit of the rulebook - getting scratched all the time isn't very conducive to finding the right balance. This applies to ADA and Smith BTW.

E: I will add that both the minors were pretty ticky-tacky calls in my book.
 
Edge said:
I think ADA demonstrated both the good and the bad in his game that still exists.

I'm in the camp of playing him to see what he becomes. But I will also admit that it's frustrating that at age 23, and with three years of pro experience he's still at that point as player
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3 years where hes only gotten on the ice for 97 games.. My argument is we should let him play out the year and then decide what his future is with the rangers.
 
Vinny DeAngelo said:
3 years where hes only gotten on the ice for 97 games.. My argument is we should let him play out the year and then decide what his future is with the rangers.
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For the record, I agree about playing him to see what we've got.

But this kid has also played 220 professional games at this point. I don't think it's unfair to be a little frustrated that some of these things are still occurring. So it's not just limited to the NHL either.
 
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Dijock94 said:
McQuaid gets traded, they both play every game. They both get bridge deals.
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This seems very obvious. Even after giving him every reason to staple his ass to the bench Quinn gave ADA almost 8 minutse in the 3rd and a lot of the crunch time push.
 
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effen said:
This seems very obvious. Even after giving him every reason to staple his ass to the bench Quinn gave ADA almost 8 minutse in the 3rd and a lot of the crunch time push.
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Watching from the press box sometimes isn’t the worst thing for ADA. When he plays he gets good ice time. Probably should get more time on the PP though.
 
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Blue Blooded said:
BTW, not playing Tony on the PP is still incredibly poor use of personnel:

*snip*
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From the 10,000 ft. view I don't think its unfair for the coach to use PP time as a reward generally, and especially with this particular player. And he hasn't deserved it in quite a while.

I also don't think having an extra 3 (?) PP goals ADA could have given them changes anyones situation either. In a macro sense.
 
Edge said:
For the record, I agree about playing him to see what we've got.

But this kid has also played 220 professional games at this point. I don't think it's unfair to be a little frustrated that some of these things are still occurring. So it's not just limited to the NHL either.
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I doubt they are ever going to completely stop, the best you can hope is with experience they become less frequent. But that wont happen with him sitting for extended periods.

ADA is your pretty typical non-elite offensive defenseman; he is going to get caught pinching and make bad passes and a few things that are noticeable and memorable. And people are still going to value him less than the guy who spends the entire shift in his zone and then chips the puck back to the other team, because that guy didn't do anything obviously stupid.
 
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Edge said:
For the record, I agree about playing him to see what we've got.

But this kid has also played 220 professional games at this point. I don't think it's unfair to be a little frustrated that some of these things are still occurring. So it's not just limited to the NHL either.
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To be fair those 220 Professional game are mainly AHL games. And hes had 6 Coaches for those 220 games assuming the AHL teams didn't change coaches while he was there.(36 games per coach) Imagine trying to learn to play defense professionally and half way throw every season they change the system

Syracuse
Arizona
Tucson
NYR-AV
Hartford
NYR-Quinn
 
McRanger said:
I doubt they are ever going to completely stop, the best you can hope is with experience they become less frequent. But that wont happen with him sitting for extended periods.

ADA is your pretty typical non-elite offensive defenseman; he is going to get caught pinching and make bad passes and a few things that are noticeable and memorable. And people are still going to value him less than the guy who spends the entire shift in his zone and then chips the puck back to the other team, because that guy didn't do anything obviously stupid.
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Nothing wrong with this at all... Mike Green has carved out a solid career doing that.
 
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