Rumor: Tony DeAngelo being traded back to Carolina next month but he also could not be.

[ponder719]

NO. We gave up far more for Risto, then paid to get rid of Ghost, then signed Risto to that awful contract. No, that was a much larger cluster.

I see no reason to separate out individual elements of Chuckles' mismanagement of our blue line. It's all one gigantic omnisuck.

 

[Lord Defect]

At the risk of knowingly not knowing the ins and out of buyouts, and having a new, slightly larger phone so I’m prone to typos…
We’re not competing for a few years so who cares if we retain? Buying out gets us nothing. Retaining gets us something.
Something for “nothing” is always better than the inverse.

 

[GKJ]

At the risk of knowingly not knowing the ins and out of buyouts, and having a new, slightly larger phone so I’m prone to typos…
We’re not competing for a few years so who cares if we retain? Buying out gets us nothing. Retaining gets us something.
Something for “nothing” is always better than the inverse.

The problem is they’re not retaining maximum flexibility. They will retain salary on DeAngelo and Hayes, so they will only be able to do it with one more player until next July 1.

If they actually like the prospect, then ok. If they’re just throwing us a scrap, then it’s not worth it.

 

[deadhead]

The problem is they’re not retaining maximum flexibility. They will retain salary on DeAngelo and Hayes, so they will only be able to do it with one more player until next July 1.

If they actually like the prospect, then ok. If they’re just throwing us a scrap, then it’s not worth it.

They don't have other players that they'll be retaining salary.
TK and Laughton are underpaid, so no issue there, might take back a "Lehtera" contract to fit them under a cap.
Who else is likely to be moved this summer?

They're freeing up cap room and roster spots, moving out players who are bad fits due to age and/or playing style.

 

[GKJ]

They don't have other players that they'll be retaining salary.
TK and Laughton are underpaid, so no issue there, might take back a "Lehtera" contract to fit them under a cap.
Who else is likely to be moved this summer?

They're freeing up cap room and roster spots, moving out players who are bad fits due to age and/or playing style.

You don’t know that. They still have Walker, they could do it with Hart, they could broker trades. They have an entire roster of players. They need to maintain maximum flexibility because the money is irrelevant.

 

[Lord Defect]

The problem is they’re not retaining maximum flexibility. They will retain salary on DeAngelo and Hayes, so they will only be able to do it with one more player until next July 1.

If they actually like the prospect, then ok. If they’re just throwing us a scrap, then it’s not worth it.

We’re not competing for a few years so if the return has less term, that’s still a win

While I’m here and out of the loop why didn’t briere jump on a first and second for Jesus i blanked on his name.

 

[Redpath]

You don’t know that. They still have Walker, they could do it with Hart, they could broker trades. They have an entire roster of players. They need to maintain maximum flexibility because the money is irrelevant.

Shedding $2.5 million in salary is what is creating flexibility here.

 

[Lord Defect]

We’re not competing for a few years so if the return has less term, that’s still a win

While I’m here and out of the loop why didn’t briere jump on a first and second for Jesus i blanked on his name.

Laughton

 

[wankstifier]

Laughton

That was the trade Fletcher turned down, I think?

 

[GKJ]

Shedding $2.5 million in salary is what is creating flexibility here.

Not without an actual return. The buyout penalty is $1.66m this year and next. The RS slot is more important.

 

[Lord Defect]

That was the trade Fletcher turned down, I think?

Thought it was briere, but why? Thats a hell of a return for a habitual third line player.

 

[deadhead]

You don’t know that. They still have Walker, they could do it with Hart, they could broker trades. They have an entire roster of players. They need to maintain maximum flexibility because the money is irrelevant.

They'll still have one retention slot, they'll regain the TDA slot next summer.
Walker at $2.65M shouldn't be that hard to fit for most teams at the TDL.
Hart's $4M is pretty reasonable for a top ten goalie.
Right now they have almost $29M next year (plus Ellis' $6M on LTIR), $36M if they move Hayes.

I don't think retaining on both Hayes and TDA will tie Briere's hands, but it does clear out two bad fits.

 

[wankstifier]

Thought it was briere, but why? Thats a hell of a return for a habitual third line player.

Beats me... I'd jump at that offer

 

[Redpath]

Not without an actual return. The buyout penalty is $1.66m this year and next. The RS slot is more important.

Perhaps. Or saving money next year and having a RS slot beyond 2024 is more important.

 

[GKJ]

They'll still have one retention slot, they'll regain the TDA slot next summer.
Walker at $2.65M shouldn't be that hard to fit for most teams at the TDL.
Hart's $4M is pretty reasonable for a top ten goalie.
Right now they have almost $29M next year (plus Ellis' $6M on LTIR), $36M if they move Hayes.

I don't think retaining on both Hayes and TDA will tie Briere's hands, but it does clear out two bad fits.

The numbers don’t matter, it’s maintaining maximum flexibility. Every single dollar counts to teams who operate at the cap, use your dollars to extract as much value as possible.

 

[GKJ]

Perhaps. Or saving money next year and having a RS slot beyond 2024 is more important.

They would have that slot anyways. That money only matters next year if they intend on spending to the cap.

 

[JABEE]

This seems really dumb as currently described. Wasting a salary retention slot they could use now or at the deadline to unload a legitimately awful contract.

 

[Redpath]

They would have that slot anyways. That money only matters next year if they intend on spending to the cap.

If we saved DeAngelo's retention slot for a different trade later this season, there is a decent chance that whoever that is used on would go beyond 2024. By using a slot on DeAngelo now, we get the benefit of ridding his salary without the long-term hindrance of him holding one of our retention slots for multiple seasons. Any trade that we theoretically can't broker this upcoming season because we are out of retention slots likely won't be unique, and I imagine there will be similar opportunities beyond 2024.

We don't need to be spending to the cap. We can just be preparing cap space for brokering future cap dumps. Every dollar matters after all.

 

[Magua]

Knowing it’s a not so good prospect & the Flyers MO I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s Bryce Montgomery or Cade Weber.

I circled Montgomery too.

I just looked at every Canes prospect that was big, had underwhelming production, and was in college. I know what Brent Flahr is recommending.

 

[deadhead]

The numbers don’t matter, it’s maintaining maximum flexibility. Every single dollar counts to teams who operate at the cap, use your dollars to extract as much value as possible.

You don't have to retain on every deal, most deals are driven by taking bad contracts, Hayes and TDA are just grossly overpaid.
The other players the Flyers might move are not.

If a contract is reasonable, teams often just want to clear out cap room for a year or two b/c they don't mind slotting a market level contract, they just don't want to have to make room for a bloated contract. While you can shuffle out a bad contract for short-term relief, it can be difficult to match contracts and term.

 

[GKJ]

If we saved DeAngelo's retention slot for a different trade later this season, there is a decent chance that whoever that is used on would go beyond 2024. By using a slot on DeAngelo now, we get the benefit of ridding his salary without the long-term hindrance of him holding one of our retention slots for multiple seasons. Any trade that we theoretically can't broker this upcoming season because we are out of retention slots likely won't be unique, and I imagine there will be similar opportunities beyond 2024.

We don't need to be spending to the cap. We can just be preparing cap space for brokering future cap dumps. Every dollar matters after all.

I don’t get your case here, using it on TDA preemptively stops them from doing so with other guys beyond next year? That’s only a problem if the trades aren’t worth it. There’s expiring contracts next year currently on the roster that we can use them on, not to mention any player we still may acquire.

 

[Lord Defect]

If we saved DeAngelo's retention slot for a different trade later this season, there is a decent chance that whoever that is used on would go beyond 2024. By using a slot on DeAngelo now, we get the benefit of ridding his salary without the long-term hindrance of him holding one of our retention slots for multiple seasons. Any trade that we theoretically can't broker this upcoming season because we are out of retention slots likely won't be unique, and I imagine there will be similar opportunities beyond 2024.

We don't need to be spending to the cap. We can just be preparing cap space for brokering future cap dumps. Every dollar matters after all.

For who? Beyond Hayes and TDA who else do we NEED to retain on?

 

[Flyerfan4life]

On one hand, Carolina operates in the modern NHL and they understand what has value, so a prospect of theirs is unlikely to be complete shit.

HOWEVER

On the other hand, this is a prospect they think has even less value than DeAngelo, which means they’re likely right, sooooooooo………….

sooooo send him to Philly.

they love garbagepail players there...

 

[Redpath]

I don’t get your case here, using it on TDA preemptively stops them from doing so with other guys beyond next year? That’s only a problem if the trades aren’t worth it. There’s expiring contracts next year currently on the roster that we can use them on, not to mention any player we still may acquire.

Saving a RS slot for a different trade (i.e, brokering a player like what LA just did with Provorov) means that a RS slot could possibly be tied up for multiple years.

Using one on DeAngelo's short term contract right now gives us the benefit of saving money this year (And also next year if you'd favor the buyout method) without tying Briere's hands for multiple seasons by using one of his retention slots in a theoretical brokering trade. In the meantime this season, we can still use the saved cap space to take on a bad contract without us having to be the one retaining.

Who are the expiring contracts next year currently on the roster that a retention slot could be used for? Tippett? Allison?

For who? Beyond Hayes and TDA who else do we NEED to retain on?

That goes with my point. There is not a clear NEED for any retainments this season currently on our roster after those two. Perhaps an opportunity does come along where we could broker via retainment, but there also a chance where we can broker via cap space (Which is why saving cap space through retaining on TDA is a good thing)

 

[GKJ]

You don't have to retain on every deal, most deals are driven by taking bad contracts, Hayes and TDA are just grossly overpaid.
The other players the Flyers might move are not.

If a contract is reasonable, teams often just want to clear out cap room for a year or two b/c they don't mind slotting a market level contract, they just don't want to have to make room for a bloated contract. While you can shuffle out a bad contract for short-term relief, it can be difficult to match contracts and term.

This doesn’t answer literally any issue brought up. ‘You don’t have to retain on every deal,’ no shit, you can only do 3 no matter what.

‘You shouldn’t have to on players X, Y, and Z,’ it doesn’t matter, I want to be able to on whoever I think I have to. Retaining half on Carter Hart makes him valuable asset. Reasonable contracts don’t matter at the deadline, cap flexibility does.