Todd Mclellan needs go

[Vaasa]

I'm thinking Boyle, JT, Marleau, Pavs. But it would have to be off-season and he would have to get a stop gap trade or FA like Horton or he would suffer in the standings. I have no illusions about the team getting worse with any of those 4 being traded with no return. The Sharks just don't have the depth on the farm. They don't have a single prospect threatening Kennedy or Kearns for the scoring lead.

I also think it is a mistake to pin hopes on Couture as a #1 center. I could see Couture in a 1a/1b scenario, but not better than that. And Couture presents the issue of speed which means the GM has to work extra hard on a speedy wing to complement Couture.

Move Clowe and Murray now. If Handzus and Burish can be moved even for picks, do so. Then in the offseason move both JT and Boyle (hopefully JT waives and the Sharks can get a good deal for him from a contender, as I want JT to win a Cup at some point). If a good enough deal comes for Pavelski, move him too (but it would need to be a very good deal IMO). I'm OK with moving Galiardi and Niemi too, but will leave that to folks who know more.

Make Marleau the #1C, Couture centers the 2nd or possibly plays wing on Marleau's line. If Pavs is still around, he can play wing or center the 3rd (possibly).

?? - Marleau - Havlat
?? - Couture - Pavelski
?? - Sheppard - Wingels
Galiardi - Desi - ??

Vlasic - Burns
Stuart - Demers
Irwin - Braun

Hopefully between all the trades the Sharks get a few decent players for "now" who can fill in some of the holes above, as well as picks and/or prospects. Maybe a UFA like Stahlberg. Plus you have Hamilton, Abeltshauser, Viedensky, Tarasov, and a bunch of other young guys who might be ready to step into that bottom 6.

It's not a Cup-contending team, but with a few decent pieces it's probably going to make the playoffs (if maybe not go far) and I think it changes the team chemistry significantly.

Of course, I'm hoping that this is done by Doug Wilson's successor, shortly after he fire T-Mac and Sommer.

 

[Grave]

Kopitar is Joe Thornton level. Bergeron is closer to Thornton than Couture, I don't think you're giving him enough credit.



What makes you think that Andrew ****ing Ladd would be the right winger for Couture? Ladd is an incredibly overrated hockey player.

Because couture is a little *****? And he could never be surrounded by softer wingers?

 

[Juxtaposer]

Because couture is a little *****? And he could never be surrounded by softer wingers?

Couture needs linemates who will compliment his style and bring out the best of his talents. Not a goon to protect him. (Obviously I'm not implying that Ladd is a goon, but you get my point).

 

[Grave]

Couture needs linemates who will compliment his style and bring out the best of his talents. Not a goon to protect him. (Obviously I'm not implying that Ladd is a goon, but you get my point).

He's small and will get pushed around easily, I said someone like Ladd doesn't have to be him.

 

[Juxtaposer]

He's small and will get pushed around easily, I said someone like Ladd doesn't have to be him.

Couture doesn't get pushed around. He's not that small. And again, he doesn't need a ****ing babysitter. Pavelski's smaller, Havlat's softer, but you aren't calling for them to have protection on their lines.

 

[Grave]

Couture doesn't get pushed around. He's not that small. And again, he doesn't need a ****ing babysitter. Pavelski's smaller, Havlat's softer, but you aren't calling for them to have protection on their lines.

Couture gets pushed around all the ****ing time, thats why teams run him like he's their *****.

 

[Juxtaposer]

Couture gets pushed around all the ****ing time, thats why teams run him like he's their *****.

Are you sure you're not overreacting to a couple of specific incidents?

Does Seguin get beat up? Nope. Does Duchene? Nope. Does Patrick Kane? Nope. Neither does Couture. Couture is a big boy, he can handle himself.

 

[Gene Parmesan]

Because couture is a little *****? And he could never be surrounded by softer wingers?

How is Couture a little *****? he goes to net, wins board battles and blocks shots on top of scoring goals. Does he get run at? Sure but so do Giroux and Crosby and other first line forwards. Logan is a big boy and hes shown hes willing to stand his ground. If anyone in the top 6 needs protection its Havlat and Pavelski..just like Jux said.

 

[Grave]

Are you sure you're not overreacting to a couple of specific incidents?

Does Seguin get beat up? Nope. Does Duchene? Nope. Does Patrick Kane? Nope. Neither does Couture. Couture is a big boy, he can handle himself.

If you say so, it just wouldn't surprise me to see him get ran like Taylor Hall if he doesn't at least have someone on his line than isn't small.

How is Couture a little *****? he goes to net, wins board battles and blocks shots on top of scoring goals. Does he get run at? Sure but so do Giroux and Crosby and other first line forwards. Logan is a big boy and hes shown hes willing to stand his ground. If anyone in the top 6 needs protection its Havlat and Pavelski..just like Jux said.

Don't compare Couture to Giroux and Crosby.

 

[Juxtaposer]

If you say so, it just wouldn't surprise me to see him get ran like Taylor Hall if he doesn't at least have someone on his line than isn't small.

Yeah, because having a big guy on his line is really going to make a goon think twice about running Couture.

 

[Grave]

Yeah, because having a big guy on his line is really going to make a goon think twice about running Couture.

You honestly think Couture can be leaned on for 4 whole rounds?

 

[Gene Parmesan]

If you say so, it just wouldn't surprise me to see him get ran like Taylor Hall if he doesn't at least have someone on his line than isn't small.




Don't compare Couture to Giroux and Crosby.

I compared only the treatment they get as marquee players.

 

[Juxtaposer]

You honestly think Couture can be leaned on for 4 whole rounds?

No, and adding a babysitter won't change anything. You can't my question by asking a question. If someone's going to run Couture, there's nothing you can do about it. Having a tough guy on his line won't change a thing.

I don't know what I'm even arguing something so self-evident.

 

[Grave]

No, and adding a babysitter won't change anything. You can't my question by asking a question. If someone's going to run Couture, there's nothing you can do about it. Having a tough guy on his line won't change a thing.

I don't know what I'm even arguing something so self-evident.

Then couture should be traded as well. Also players don't hit as hard nor do they take runs when they know they are accountable especially when the target isn't soft.

 

[SJeasy]

You honestly think Couture can be leaned on for 4 whole rounds?

The gist of your argument is physicality. Repeatedly shown not to be the key to winning. (Check hitting stats on cup winners)

This question is ridiculous. No center in recent memory has carried a team for 4 rounds. It is a team effort. 4 rounds is pipedream even for Crosby. In the Pitt win, Malkin even got the CS trophy. That is why one of the 3 keys to winning it all is depth down the middle. That means more than one guy. On the opposite end, look at Boston. They went with three not so big guys and only one was running with protection.

 

[Dicdonya]

Then couture should be traded as well. Also players don't hit as hard nor do they take runs when they know they are accountable especially when the target isn't soft.

Are you really trying to imply that players like Thornton, marleau, pavs, Murray, Stuart etc don't ever have people taking runs at them? That somehow just being "big" stops goons from gooning? Just last game zues got nailed and he is not small by any stretch of the imagination.

If fighting players who take runs is how you deem someone not soft then cooch is certainly not the only "soft" player on this team. Just about everyone is.

Also if our team is full of guys who will take hits and make the other team pay for them by scoring I would much rather have that, and that's usually how this team deals with those type of players. I love fighting but it certainly is about the lowest importance of skill/trait I want players to have.

You can see just how much fighting every man who takes a run at your players pans out with muzzin a couple games ago.

 

[Grave]

Are you really trying to imply that players like Thornton, marleau, pavs, Murray, Stuart etc don't ever have people taking runs at them? That somehow just being "big" stops goons from gooning? Just last game zues got nailed and he is not small by any stretch of the imagination.

If fighting players who take runs is how you deem someone not soft then cooch is certainly not the only "soft" player on this team. Just about everyone is.

Also if our team is full of guys who will take hits and make the other team pay for them by scoring I would much rather have that, and that's usually how this team deals with those type of players. I love fighting but it certainly is about the lowest importance of skill/trait I want players to have.

You can see just how much fighting every man who takes a run at your players pans out with muzzin a couple games ago.

You don't have to fight to not be soft, there's a reason why Angry Thornton is the best Thornton. If Couture ran Corey Perry into the boards and got suspended for 3 games I'm sure it would open up a little more ice for him.

 

[Dicdonya]

You don't have to fight to not be soft, there's a reason why Angry Thornton is the best Thornton. If Couture ran Corey Perry into the boards and got suspended for 3 games I'm sure it would open up a little more ice for him.

So matt Cooke never gets run? You are now saying being dirty, or borderline dirty as in some of Thornton's hits, means your tough? What about players like perry who will do "tough" things like hack goalies and kick defenseless players but never fights. Is he tough enough for you?

Also how often does Thornton run someone? Or fight? He used to no doubt but he's far from that guy any more. So he's pretty soft by your standard too.

 

[Juxtaposer]

Didn't we discover that the Sharks are 2-6 in Joe Thornton's fights?

 

[hockeyball]

You don't have to fight to not be soft, there's a reason why Angry Thornton is the best Thornton. If Couture ran Corey Perry into the boards and got suspended for 3 games I'm sure it would open up a little more ice for him.

what? That doesn't even make sense...

 

[Coily]

Didn't we discover that the Sharks are 2-6 in Joe Thornton's fights?

He usually fights when they are getting wrecked by the other team.

 

[Juxtaposer]

He usually fights when they are getting wrecked by the other team.

I'm not trying to correlate Joe fighting with the Sharks not winning, I'm trying to say that Joe Thornton fighting has nothing to help the Sharks win.

 

[Gene Parmesan]

Angry Thornton usually commits dumb penalties and doesn't help the team at all. Now engaged Thornton when hes skating and aggressive helps the team.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

He's small and will get pushed around easily, I said someone like Ladd doesn't have to be him.

Ryane Clowe is about as tough as they come and he doesn't stop others from running Couture or getting pushed around easily as you say. That kind of thing is not something that can be prevented. Everyone, big or small, has runs taken at them. Happened to Handzus last night. You're overemphasizing the need for someone to be Couture's enforcer. He doesn't need it.

 

[OrrNumber4]

It is a different NHL nowadays.

Back in the 80s, guys knew that if you messed with Couture, you'd have to tousle with Clowe (or someone like Pelech). And many guys wouldn't want to do it. In today's game, coaches value players who ARE willing to do it.. if you aren't willing to do it, someone will take your job and do it. This has also contributed to the lack of skill amongst bottom-6 players...