Proposal: TML & Canucks

[Cogburn]

I guess I'm somehow missing the suggested alternative returns for Miller. The common theme I see from Canucks fans is Schneider... and the common response I see from rangers fans is an emphatic no. I don't think I've seen a realistic proposal from a Canucks fan not from NYR/TOR.

With respect to the prior comparisons to Stone & Pacioretty, while I'd agree that Suzuki & Brannstrom at the time were likely viewed as marginally better prospects than Robertson is today, neither of those deals included a 1st round pick for the Habs/Sens.

No disrespect intended for Miller at all.... maybe Mark Stone is the best comparable (although I think Stone had more desirability than Miller does) and somebody is willing to send a prospect at the top of their list at the deadline for him; but I don't think it's going to include a 1st as well, and that prospect is likely going to be a year further away from contributing than one that you get at this deadline.... and that's assuming that Miller's play continues.

They were considered top tier prospects. Robertson is simply not there.

If we fall backwards into a prospect like they were considered though, I agree a first is not being included, barring other dimensions to the trade.

 

[seanlinden]

They were considered top tier prospects. Robertson is simply not there.

If we fall backwards into a prospect like they were considered though, I agree a first is not being included, barring other dimensions to the trade.

Like I said, those guys were a step above where Robertson is today....hence why the pick is a 1st, and there's likely additional pieces on the deal as well.

But... go look at the top 20 prospects in the league.

https://thehockeywriters.com/nhl-top-100-prospects-ranking/

How many of them belong to teams that are in a position to buy? Take the top 20; and I count 4 (Robertson, Lapierre, Rossi, and Byram) that belong to real "buyers" at this point. Rossi & Byram are too good to trade for Miller. I don't see Washington being all that interested, but maybe.

That being said, if you believe there's another prospect out there who's better than Robertson, that another team is likely to trade for Miller, I'd love to hear it.

 

[Ita]

I suggest you go through past trades.

Miller isn't fetching what you think he is.

Muzzin was probably more valuable then than Miller is now.

You are trolling right?

 

[Cogburn]

You are trolling right?

He's not. Like at all.

 

[Peter Griffin]

Like I said, those guys were a step above where Robertson is today....hence why the pick is a 1st, and there's likely additional pieces on the deal as well.

But... go look at the top 20 prospects in the league.

https://thehockeywriters.com/nhl-top-100-prospects-ranking/

How many of them belong to teams that are in a position to buy? Take the top 20; and I count 4 (Robertson, Lapierre, Rossi, and Byram) that belong to real "buyers" at this point. Rossi & Byram are too good to trade for Miller. I don't see Washington being all that interested, but maybe.

That being said, if you believe there's another prospect out there who's better than Robertson, that another team is likely to trade for Miller, I'd love to hear it.

Would you be more open to moving Knies?

 

[Cogburn]

Like I said, those guys were a step above where Robertson is today....hence why the pick is a 1st, and there's likely additional pieces on the deal as well.

But... go look at the top 20 prospects in the league.

https://thehockeywriters.com/nhl-top-100-prospects-ranking/

How many of them belong to teams that are in a position to buy? Take the top 20; and I count 4 (Robertson, Lapierre, Rossi, and Byram) that belong to real "buyers" at this point. Rossi & Byram are too good to trade for Miller. I don't see Washington being all that interested, but maybe.

That being said, if you believe there's another prospect out there who's better than Robertson, that another team is likely to trade for Miller, I'd love to hear it.

There are a lot of inconsistencies in that article, not to mention the writer is the hockeywriters.com's Leafs guy. Not to mention some glaring omissions, probably due to using the Pronman criteria for prospects, but still, guys drafted in the top 20 last year aren't even mentioned. Thomas, Lucius, Foerster, and Pinto all seem pushed down due to their injuries, and Robertson and a few other guys having serious injuries brushed off (not just Leafs guys to be clear). This seems like an opinion piece from someone much more familiar with certain teams and prospects then others.

Also, if that list is exactly how everything is set, why wouldn't we take some of the offers most Canucks cringed at from Colorado (Barron/Olausson as a throw in to Newhook/Girardi) or even the Rangers (Othmann as a main piece, for instance)?

 

[Donuts]

keep it simple

leafs 1st for dickinson + poolman

 

[seanlinden]

There are a lot of inconsistencies in that article, not to mention the writer is the hockeywriters.com's Leafs guy. Not to mention some glaring omissions, probably due to using the Pronman criteria for prospects, but still, guys drafted in the top 20 last year aren't even mentioned. Thomas, Lucius, Foerster, and Pinto all seem pushed down due to their injuries, and Robertson and a few other guys having serious injuries brushed off (not just Leafs guys to be clear). This seems like an opinion piece from someone much more familiar with certain teams and prospects then others.

Also, if that list is exactly how everything is set, why wouldn't we take some of the offers most Canucks cringed at from Colorado (Barron/Olausson as a throw in to Newhook/Girardi) or even the Rangers (Othmann as a main piece, for instance)?

I'm simply going by the only recent prospect rankings I could find. Obviously, that ranking is one opinion, and no ranking of that nature is going to be unanimous... but it does give somewhat of a starting point.

As for your alternative suggestions, I do not believe Alex Newhook would be on the table for the Avs. Barron/Olausson certainly on the table in my view, but I do believe Robertson is a substantially better prospect than either; while the Leafs have a 2022 first to trade that the Avs don't. I also believe their primary target will be Giroux.

With respect to Othmann, possibly on the table.. maybe the right deal is Othmann & The Rangers first... not sure they go that far... but likely a more attainable target than one of the young NHL defencemen from the Rangers.

 

[Cogburn]

I'm simply going by the only recent prospect rankings I could find.

As for your alternative suggestions, I do not believe Alex Newhook would be on the table for the Avs. Barron/Olausson certainly on the table in my view, but I do believe Robertson is a substantially better prospect than either; while the Leafs have a 2022 first to trade that the Avs don't. I also believe their primary target will be Giroux.

With respect to Othmann, possibly on the table.. maybe the right deal is Othmann & The Rangers first... not sure they go that far... but likely a more attainable target.

Fair enough, I couldn't find a lot either so I'm not faulting you there. That's more of a "why would they publish this under their brand" kind of comment.

He was before many Canucks fans, myself included, greeted negative energy and comments with negative energy and comments, and well, you see how these threads go. 2022 or 2023 makes no difference to me, I might even prefer next years if it's a dealbreaker. Giroux would be a good fit, but I think he is much more of a rental, and with the Avalanche's cap situation and Kadri being UFA, I feel a case for a retained Miller could be made. They also have the assets and drive to do both, should Sakic get that cup-lust.

A lower-rated prosect, according to Baracchini anyway, and a higher pick is a neutral move, but versus Amirov and a first, I guess it depends on what ever else is offered.

 

[seanlinden]

Would you be more open to moving Knies?

Not at all. I think he's likely to be grossly overvalued by the Leafs organization right now, and not somebody they're going to consider moving.

If one was to rank the top 4 prospects for the Leafs in terms of quality of prospect, it would probably be Robertson, Amirov, Niemla, Knies as best to worst.

If one was to rank the Leafs willingness to move these guys, I think it would probably be Niemla, Knies, Amirov & Robertson, in order of least willing to most willing... simply because Robertson needs to play in the NHL, and it's hard for the Leafs with having the big 4 to integrate a guy like that on a contending team.

 

[Heffyhoof]

	EV Points
Alexander "Cap Dump" Kerfoot	28​
J.T. "Worth 15 First Round Picks" Miller	24​

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Why bother even trading for Miller then?