Post-Game Talk: Tipped Off | Oilers lose series 3-1

[CantHaveTkachev]

And I mean I didn't say you are.

There has to be some changes to the roster though, with at least one big change on defense.

I also can't see Smith being re-signed whether that's Holland's choice, Smith's or mutually so he's goalie shopping. Hopefully Lehner, but the way he's moved around lately from Ottawa to Buffalo to LI to Chicago to LV, he'll be looking for some stability/term.

-we need a goaltender to push Koskinen
-we need at least 2 puck moving defenseman (1 if Bouchard emerges)
-need a top 6 winger
-3rd line center

 

[McJadeddog]

I don't think I would even be upset if we went D with our first rounder after watching this garbage

Well, to be fair, we have gone with D for the last 2 drafts with our 1st rounder (both top-10 picks even, so high 1st rounders). They are just too young still to be of any value. And to be honest, with dmen, its such a crap-shoot that they might NEVER be good players, you just don't know for a few years.

The issue with the Oilers comes down to drafting "backwards". We drafted our good forwards before dmen, so by the time we *might* have defensive help, we'll be near the ends of the 97/29 contracts, and only have 2-3 years to try and win. Ideally, if luck is on your franchise's side, you draft dmen first, and once they are good, you draft good forwards, who contribute on their ELCs (when dmen almost never are any good during their ELCs). Oh well, that ship has sailed.

 

[McJadeddog]

If we win we have to count the blessings we have a winger for McDavid. Taking RNH off of Draisaitl’s line hurt. Plus if we suddenly have McDavid’s winger we can focus assets on a trade solely for a real number #1 D. Offer Klefbom + 2021 1st and Broberg and get a legit guy

This is actually the type of trade I would be 100% open to making. It's SUPER risky, as maybe Broberg eventually turns into a legit guy himself, but we can't wait for that with the clock already ticking on the 29/97 contracts. I wonder what Broberg + 1st rounder would land you? It wouldn't give you a legit top pairing guy, but *might* get a good #2 from a team.

 

[McJadeddog]

As some others have said, we don’t need to “blow it up” (and frankly, we can’t, given the contracts already in place), but a few large pieces are missing - #1D (not sure we can get this in the short-term, really just have to hope that Broberg can be something close to that), another top 6 winger, a 3C (for f***s sake, we haven’t had a good one since...Jarret Stoll?), and probably a goalie that can challenge Koskinen.

It is kind of alarming that defensively, most of this team’s players seem fairly inept. Klefbom and Nurse, both of whom I think are reasonably decent players, kind of seem to me like their physical talent is about 90% of the package, and their ability to make reads and decisions is seriously lagging behind that. Like, they strike me as raw physical talents that play pro hockey mostly because they’re strong/fast/fit enough to.

If you could combine Bear's head and calmness with Nurse physical abilities, you'd have one hell of a player.

 

[McOilers97]

Well, to be fair, we have gone with D for the last 2 drafts with our 1st rounder (both top-10 picks even, so high 1st rounders). They are just too young still to be of any value. And to be honest, with dmen, its such a crap-shoot that they might NEVER be good players, you just don't know for a few years.

The issue with the Oilers comes down to drafting "backwards". We drafted our good forwards before dmen, so by the time we *might* have defensive help, we'll be near the ends of the 97/29 contracts, and only have 2-3 years to try and win. Ideally, if luck is on your franchise's side, you draft dmen first, and once they are good, you draft good forwards, who contribute on their ELCs (when dmen almost never are any good during their ELCs). Oh well, that ship has sailed.

Ya, looking at the Blackhawks as one example, they drafted Keith and Seabrook in 02 and 03, followed by Toews and Kane in 06 and 07.

Honestly, looking back at the moves the Oilers have made this decade, letting Petry go for basically shit all is unforgivable. I didn’t like it at the time and it looks worse and worse as time goes on. This roster with him still on it would be so much better off.

 

[Samus44]

I like Tippet but he was out coached. Not putting the NHL’s best line together until 8 minutes left in the third period of the last game? And Starting Smith in game one put us behind from the beginning.
The other factor is that as good as our top players are, we won’t win until they are + players (mcdavid and draisaitl).
We need another mobile dman or two who can find a pass outlet, maybe Bouchard next year... if I’m holland I cut my loses from both AA and Kassian (horrible and unnecessary extension given- good luck getting rid of that) and prioritize defensive upgrades.

I don't agree 100% with you but I think you're rational. I had little issue with Draisaitl's defensive game tbh, but it was an issue at times in the regular season, but McDavid definitely needs to improve. The D could really use another strong outlet pass, 100% agree. I think Kassian has value in a 3rd line role and same with AA, I'd be interested in seeing what they could do together with a bigger two way C. Kharia is the obvious option for what they have in house but I'd like to see an upgrade there for sure. If they had a guy who could control the middle of the ice defensively and chip in offensively I think AA could drive offense and Kassian could be strong on the cycle and be a physical presence. With Kassian I think his game is that of a 2-2.5 million dollar player because consistency is an issue, that's also why for me he's a bottom 6er. I do think one can justify the overpay based on his ability to be an enforcer, as GM's and coaches value it and often overpay for it. An issue for this team though is it leaves one wondering where Neal and Chiasson fit in, and at 8 million dollars that's a pretty big f***ing question. They also outplayed the two of Kassian and AA this playoffs. It's going to be interesting to see what happens, that's for sure.

 

[Ritchie Valens]

-we need a goaltender to push Koskinen
-we need at least 2 puck moving defenseman (1 if Bouchard emerges)
-need a top 6 winger
-3rd line center

I don't know if Leavins was referring to coaching changes in that tweet (which is how I took it) but as bad as Tippett outcoached himself, he's not going anywhere. He's a good coach, but he just f***ed up with his decisions in these qualifiers.

Hypothetically...lets say Holland dumped him.

Mclelland
Hitchcock
Tippett
New guy

All before McDavid has started his 6th year. That list is longer for guys like RNH.

The entire coaching staff is safe, the roster is not.

 

[YakDavid]

Some people need to take a break. The difference between the regular season and the play ins was huge. We didn't play well but it was almost preseason hockey. Tippett had to be way better then he was.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

If Bouchard doesn't make the team next year I'm going to get highly upset. He's already in my top 3 of favourite Oilers. His skillset is SORELY needed, and he won't attempt to block a shot and score on himself.

Tell Nurse or Klef to be his defensive conscience while he uses his skill set.

It’s not bias. RNH was nothing special at all. Guy still can’t make a play on his own. Touching the puck just before McDavid turns on the speed, or banging in the garbage left behind by his betters doesn’t impress me. He was particularly unimpressive on the PP. But you know this board, Nuge is the equivalent of a made man. People will even flip out on McDavid and Draisaitl before they’ll have a cross word to say about 93.

Yet miraculously whoever doesnt play with him in the top 6 gets the short end of the straw.

Doesn't have to throw anyone under the bus. He could have easily communicated that they weren't prepared, didn't take the series seriously enough, or played poorly in his vanilla, dull but friendly way.

And then get run out of town? Why should he have to apologize for his performance? Let duds like Kassian do that.

exposed? AA? He was the most dangerous Oiler outside of the big three the last two games. And Bear didn’t play his best, sure, but he was still better than the rest of our D.

Yeah he didnt score but he had chances on a team that lacks them big time. I qualify him and sign him to a cheapish 3 year deal if I can.

Oh I know. It's just whether AA will sign it. He's definitely not getting qualified IMO.
The problem with AA, and Wings fans have warned us before, is the guy is only good when his linemates play his way. As in he gets free reign. It's no wonder the Wings sucked yet he got 30 goals.

Stauffer and Spector had a segment 2 weeks ago [or maybe it was even last week] where they said he's basically poor man's Hall without the passing ability or ability to make his line mates better.

IMO this player is getting a lot of undeserved heat. He was easily one of our best forwards in this series. Also good on him for taking that run at the end of the series. It shows that he gives a shit unless most of this garbage roster.

 

[ZJuice]

I don't know if Leavins was referring to coaching changes in that tweet (which is how I took it) but as bad as Tippett outcoached himself, he's not going anywhere. He's a good coach, but he just f***ed up with his decisions in these qualifiers.

Hypothetically...lets say Holland dumped him.

Mclelland
Hitchcock
Tippett
New guy

All before McDavid has started his 6th year. That list is longer for guys like RNH.

The entire coaching staff is safe, the roster is not.

You bring up a good point. If we make the playoffs with Tippett next season though hopefully a player steps up to bring the energy his coach should be bringing

 

[LMFAO]

Who else is praying for a Vegas and Hawks matchup to watch Reaves and McNabb beat up those dirty little f***ers?

 

[Shaquille Oatmeal]

Who else is praying for a Vegas and Hawks matchup to watch Reaves and McNabb beat up those dirty little f***ers?

My new favorite team is whoever Calgary plays.

 

[McGoMcD]

My new favorite team is whoever Calgary plays.

Same here, and by a mile. Well, whoever plays the leafs if they win too.

 

[rec28]

A sprinkling of several 7s and 8s throughout the lineup is much better than 2 10s, a 6.5 and a bunch of 4s. Unless the #1 drops in our lap, we should seriously consider cashing in a 10 and FINALLY move past this chronic lineup imbalance.

 

[frag2]

IMO this player is getting a lot of undeserved heat. He was easily one of our best forwards in this series. Also good on him for taking that run at the end of the series. It shows that he gives a shit unless most of this garbage roster.

Oh I'm not questioning his effort at all. He atleast tried, more than a huge chunk of our roster. That said, just dunno what the $ would be for a player that appears to be difficult to play with and not exactly coming in with stellar numbers. We're already cash strapped as it is.

 

[ZJuice]

Who else is praying for a Vegas and Hawks matchup to watch Reaves and McNabb beat up those dirty little f***ers?

Hawks are a veteran team, hopefully the refs dont think too heavily about that

 

[Drivesaitl]

Tell Nurse or Klef to be his defensive conscience while he uses his skill set.



Yet miraculously whoever doesnt play with him in the top 6 gets the short end of the straw.



And then get run out of town? Why should he have to apologize for his performance? Let duds like Kassian do that.



Yeah he didnt score but he had chances on a team that lacks them big time. I qualify him and sign him to a cheapish 3 year deal if I can.



IMO this player is getting a lot of undeserved heat. He was easily one of our best forwards in this series. Also good on him for taking that run at the end of the series. It shows that he gives a shit unless most of this garbage roster.

Just to respond whoever plays with Nuge gets the lionshare of help not because Nuge is any spectacular catalyst, its because we don't even have a Hall, Eberle, Perron, even a Pouliot still lying around. Its that on this bare bones forward roster the drop off from Nuge to next is Huge. Thats why nuge features so prominently here, which means we should try to keep him, but also means we need to build out our depth of useful players. Hoffman could have been here, Toffoli could have been here. As per usual we went with a lot of nothng adds and Holland went with volume adds rather than quality. Several of the Holland adds didn't even play in the series. Thats an asterisk all on its own.

Nuge is a quality player, but he's accepted just being complimentary. he doesn't drive much of the play and the vanilla comments will always be around because he's such a rote, and less imaginative player. I mean almost every up high winger in the league knows now how much Nuge passes back to Klefbom. its gotten to the point of being embarrassing, and its resulted in so many clean picks from people reading that. I mean its not passing back to Klef EVER accomplished much of anything. Its only killing the pk clock. opponents only jumping that when they feel they want a breakaway.

I will say this always but I would remove Nuge from 1st unit PP. His skill is redundant there. Use him more on 2nd unit, and in 5 on 5 where his play is more valuable. With all the skill we put out on first PP him having the puck as much as he does just keeps it off McD and Drai's stick. One last problem is that both of the latter pass it more to Nuge than he ver passes it back. Which wouldn't be a problem if Nuge was a PP gunslinger, but he really isn't he gets wide open free looks on man advantage where he gets to walk right in with time, and pick his shot. Even with that his shooting percentage on PP, even playing with the two best players in the world, is pretty ordinary. A guy like Hoffman here would be automatic 30 goal scorer.

 

[Mav3rick07]

My new favorite team is whoever Calgary plays.

Canucks too.

 

[Louis Cypher]

A lot of players were bad, but Holland and Tippett shoulders most of the blame imo. Terrible trade deadline. Terrible game management. Terrible lines. Terrible goalie choice for game 1. Terrible everything.

I dont blame Holland at all. Green gets hurt and then bows out. Really could have used him in this series! Ennis was a good pickup but got hurt. AA, there is player there, coach Mac-T'd him, should have played him higher in the line up to begin with.

I like Tippet but he f***ed up with the lines.

 

[Behind Enemy Lines]

Theme Song for the 2020 Oiler PlayIn Wanna Bes:

This is a low hockey IQ team that was exposed in all areas by a champion led rebuilding team. With the Oilers core now in peak years performance the question must be asked if this team will ever learn from its mistakes; are they just needing to improve their discipline and commitment; or are they skilled low hockey IQ players who just won't overcome the deficiency to think the game well enough to win.

Forwards - all of this team's elites, McDavid, Draisaitl and Nugent-Hopkins showed deficiencies at points of the series in own zone plays that leaked goals and arguably cost games. Stuff happens but we did see how Toews plays and this points to continue refinement and commitment to more discipline in the Oil elite's own zone play as a growth priority. Offensive virtuosos but lots of improvement required in defending their own zone.

Biggest disappointments - Kassian (who I enthusiastically supported) showed exceptionally bad judgement off-ice as a recovering addict with his choice of friends as widely reported and his on-ice play-in effort was massively substandard for an organization that has invested heavily in him. He was an empty sweater and non-factor. Today's non-contact NHL and ticky tack refereeed series is a death knell for this player and it looks like the contract extension will be a boondoggle.

AA did not find his groove in Edmonton. He didn't bring any offensive to the series and looked tentative in his play dishing off passing in scoring zones and not asserting his skating and shooting abilities at all. I thought he had a very good final game and was snake bit. In the covid choked Cap, resigning is a tightrope with precious dollars at stake and weighed against the acquisition cost of two second round picks.

Yamamoto's inexperience was exposed in this series with aggressive, dumb penalties 200 feet from his own net. I can forgive the sins of the youth and believe this is a young player with the hockey smarts to process and learn from the responsibilities to contribute to top six and team success.

Other forwards were pretty meh revealing the limitations of this roster's deficiencies. That said the PK forwards were very good. But the support talent of this team is deficient as the struggle for timely goals outside the top elites is a persistent issue. I thought playoff hardened James Neal should have been given top line minutes when Kassian faded into nothingness. And the winger's own zone play was an issue with missing assignments not getting into the lanes of Hawk d-men to block shots or picking up open players.

Defense - Klefbom, Nurse, and Larssen are now veteran, peak year performers and I think what you see is what you get. The Hawks aggressive forecheck exposed average at best hockey IQ in these biggest minute defenders. They are second pairing d-men forced into two many minutes by a botched decade of poor drafting and management. I think all three are warriors but they are limited in their abililities. Klefbom miscast on the PP and prone to d-zone breakdowns; Nurse is a decent quality shutdown guy whose physical play and nastiness disappeared in this series (not helped but also not excused by ticky tack refereeing) - he's now expensive for what he brings and still shows inconsistency as a defender. Larssen, who I like, simply doesn't bring enough in a modern no hitter game which has made dinosaurs out of this style of rugged, nasty defender. He was missed however in this series. Russell was generally good despite too many minutes but his salary and age will need to be sacrificed for youth.

Bear is the future and a contemporary d-man who can process the game quickly and move the puck quickly and efficiently with good decision making. His youth and abilities were exposed at some critical moments of this series but that is a reflection of this franchise's failure at building a blueline over more than a decade of failure. Bear will learn and grow with this experience and his skill set will continue to grow his contributions as a cornerstone on this team. Jones hopefully can continue his growth to give this team some hope of mobile, puck movers who can help limit extended fire drill defensive zone play that has been an ongoing deficiency of this team for years. Hope and prayers are for some young skill-based defenders including Broberg, maybe Bouchard and others can push up over time the hockey IQ, mobility and skills of the Oiler d-corp which is the Achilles Heel.

Goaltending behind low IQ forwards and defense have to have the ability to cover for mistakes. The Oil battery of Kosko and Smith are average and just not good enough to make up for the prone to breakdowns in front of them. Will be interesting to see what, if anything, Holland might do this off-season with essentially no money to spend. Can they possibly bring Smith back???

Coaching that coaxed out elite PP and PK specialty teams, were goalie whisperers in managing two B tenders, and shaping a better team culture and belief in itself was just average in the short series against the Hawks. Tippett bet wrongly on his faith in Smith to start the series; he juggled first line RW but didn't land on playoff steeled Neal to slot in there which I feel was a mistake. He kept to his belief in a balanced top six with pairings of McDavid/RNH and Draisaitl/Yamamoto when it rightfully can be argued that RNH/Draisaitl/Yamamoto should have been reunited. That said, the stack used for regular season PP became unhinged against the Hawks and the personnel looked incredibly disorganized. I generally account for and credit players for about 80% of on-ice success or failure, so for me, I see the Chicago series as overwhelming failure of execution; lack of discipline; and system failure versus coaching.

I think at this point of organization development, it is now time to look at the hockey IQ of its roster and many of the group's core leadership group seem to be exposed in their limitations. Likely impossible and unlikely for wholesale changes this off season given the cap jail they're in (thanks again Chia!), but, I think there should be a clinical and cold, clear and honest assessment of this team's potential upside. Might be time to move one or more of the peak year's group. It's Hockey IQ above all in a no hit, ticky tack penalty and no-hitter contemporary world.

EDIT: Oops sorry, thought I'd make a separate thread to see what changes posters would make if they were Ken Holland.

 

[Aerchon]

While Klef and Nurse did play poorly, I highly agree that the fwds were absolutely to blame as well as far as the porous defensive play.

Connor picked up his overall play a bit after the first game but yes still not good enough. His overall play (not talkign about points), responsibility, controlling the game, consistent battle level and urgency etc has deteriorated in the last 3 years. While he's still a highlight reel machine and definitely the most talented player out there, he's just not consistently the same dominating player that controls the game in the o zone and d zone when he's on the ice.

To be completely honest i wasn't even all that excited about this playoff/playin run. I knew this team, judging by the reg season, overachieved and simply did not have the proper leadership and proper high standard of play and preparedness to piss a drop in these playoffs. Having the two best point getters in the league still did not leave me with much confidence because of their questionable 200ft game and urgency/battle consistency. We all know the playoffs are a different beast compared to the reg season where you can get away with loose play and going at 90% effort.

We really need to improve our leadership on this team which will improve our standard of play, professionalism and culture of this team. I would like to add some strong veteran leadership in the off season. I understand the talent depth could be better but what is so disappointing is the consistency in effort/battle level/sharpness and urgency by this group. To me it the bigger issue.

I agree. I felt this team overachieved a bit as well. Going in and knowing how well Chicago was playing prior to the break I figured our chances were 50/50 @ best.

Pure speculation but I can't imagine the double standard where to my eye it looks like McDrai are allowed to cheat and everyone else has to be perfect.

There have been games where we would lose 4 to 3 where McDavid was the primary reason we got every goal for but also almost every goal against as well. That just shouldn't happen with the supposedly best player in the world.

 

[RipsADrive]

Anyone think Kassian would still get 3.2 million on the open market after that series?

Couldn't have been more let down by him. On a team that's desperate for solid wingers and physically he did nothing to live up to his end of the deal.

 

[Mav3rick07]

Anyone think Kassian would still get 3.2 million on the open market after that series?

Couldn't have been more let down by him. On a team that's desperate for solid wingers and physically he did nothing to live up to his end of the deal.

I wonder if Holland could flip Kassian.

Would anyone want to take on that contract ? Anyone ? Bueller?

 

[McBeastMode]

 

[TopShelfGloveSide]

Losers. Literally.