Tinordi hit was clean and there was no elbow there

[LePoche69]

Tinordi & Beaulieu should make the team, otherwise the Bouillon option becomes our fate, no thank you please.

I wouldn't have any broblem to have Bouillon one more year if he's CLEARLY the 7th d-man and doesn't play more than 20 games this season, AND if there is no other vet in tne league to sign for one year and who's better than Bouillon.

I don't want to see Tinordi as the #7. The guy would play nervously when called to play, and he showed in training camp that he could really use another year of important minutes in the AHL. Habs would be winners in the long run. Tinordi is not ready.

 

[Saundies]

Such a catch-22 situation because if Tinner doesn't make the hit, he goes back to the bench and gets blasted for it. If he does make the hit, well... we all saw the results.

I didn't like that penalty one bit. It sends the wrong message entirely; the NHL is looking to get rid of dirty hits, not hits like this. The result was unfortunate (you never want to see a player get hurt) but if the guy pops right back up, there's no penalty on the play IMO. I think we're starting to head down a slippery slope where open-ice body contact is eliminated entirely, which would be terrible.

 

[Draft]

This is a clean hit. No one likes to see a player injured but that's how the game is played right now. Didn't deserve the match penalty and shouldn't be suspended.

I think this one is obvious.

 

[Hannibal]

Dunno if it's been posted, but the NHL deleted the match penalty from
The boxscore.

So they admit it was an error!

 

[RealityBytes]

Such a catch-22 situation because if Tinner doesn't make the hit, he goes back to the bench and gets blasted for it. If he does make the hit, well... we all saw the results.

I didn't like that penalty one bit. It sends the wrong message entirely; the NHL is looking to get rid of dirty hits, not hits like this. The result was unfortunate (you never want to see a player get hurt) but if the guy pops right back up, there's no penalty on the play IMO. I think we're starting to head down a slippery slope where open-ice body contact is eliminated entirely, which would be terrible.

The NHL is caught in a bind, not only do they want to get rid of dirty and illegal hits, but they also want to reduce injuries as well, that is also high on their agenda.

They also really can't determine the penalty as a result of damage done (if a player pops up there is no penalty) since it creates double standards. A light tap could create injury whereas a blast may cause none. All would be under a referees personal judgement versus a hard rule, and would be very confusing for the players. After the fact just does not work to make things safer. Since the future and the results of a hit are not known beforehand, all hits that could cause injury have to be eliminated beforehand to stop any from occurring.

Reducing injuries is something that is happening with all sports and the NHL is just following suit. The NFL for example has outlawed many type hits that were legal but are no more. The NBA has added more responsibility to the player to stop the situation from occurring in the first place. FIFA has automatic cards for spikes to an opponents leg. All whether intentional or not.

Changes have already started in the lower levels in hockey and I think more will come with the NHL. A lot of what is legal now, may not be in the future. As an example, maybe only shoulder to shoulder hits will be legal. It is a difficult problem for NHL since they have to find that balance of making it safer to play but not change and ruin the game as we know it.

 

[habs88]

The NHL is caught in a bind, not only do they want to get rid of dirty and illegal hits, but they also want to reduce injuries as well, that is also high on their agenda.

They also really can't determine the penalty as a result of damage done (if a player pops up there is no penalty) since it creates double standards. A light tap could create injury whereas a blast may cause none. All would be under a referees personal judgement versus a hard rule, and would be very confusing for the players. After the fact just does not work to make things safer. Since the future and the results of a hit are not known beforehand, all hits that could cause injury have to be eliminated beforehand to stop any from occurring.

Reducing injuries is something that is happening with all sports and the NHL is just following suit. The NFL for example has outlawed many type hits that were legal but are no more. The NBA has added more responsibility to the player to stop the situation from occurring in the first place. FIFA has automatic cards for spikes to an opponents leg. All whether intentional or not.

Changes have already started in the lower levels in hockey and I think more will come with the NHL. A lot of what s legal now, may not be in the future. As an example, maybe only shoulder to shoulder hits will be legal. It is a difficult problem for NHL since they have to find that balance of making it safer to play but not change and ruin the game as we know it.

Shouldn't be to hard to counteract that as a player...just skate everywhere with your head down and you can't get hit. How can you make shoulder contact is someone is skating crouched over starring at the puck? There is no other legal way to hit besides what tinordi did, the only other thing he could have done was let him skate right by...if thats what the nhl comes to then that will be a disaster

 

[Sorinth]

Shouldn't be to hard to counteract that as a player...just skate everywhere with your head down and you can't get hit. How can you make shoulder contact is someone is skating crouched over starring at the puck? There is no other legal way to hit besides what tinordi did, the only other thing he could have done was let him skate right by...if thats what the nhl comes to then that will be a disaster

Not at all true. Tinordi could easily have thrown a hip check, and if he had different gap so that he was more even in stead of in front he could have taken him from the side. Plenty of leagues have rules against hits to the head, they don't make players untouchable when keeping their head down.

I don't have much of a problem with the hit or even the penalty though it's not suspension worthy.

 

[RealityBytes]

Shouldn't be to hard to counteract that as a player...just skate everywhere with your head down and you can't get hit. How can you make shoulder contact is someone is skating crouched over starring at the puck? There is no other legal way to hit besides what tinordi did, the only other thing he could have done was let him skate right by...if thats what the nhl comes to then that will be a disaster

I was not talking about the Tinordi hit ... I am talking about what the NHL is looking at in general and their regard to player safety, as well as some of what other sports have put in place. The shoulder to shoulder hit just was used as an example of what other people could decide will happen, please don't go on a tangent to disprove its use to me. Maybe instead, as a different example of possible change, he would only be allowed to ride a player to the boards instead of hit him. It's also not just about whether hits are legal or illegal hits. What I am saying is that what is legal now may not be anymore in the future, changes to protect players have happened in other sports and junior hockey as well, and teams adjust.

Aside from that though, one of the other issues that the NHL is most likely concerned about is not whether Tinordi's hit was legal or not but rather that the hit happened the way it did in the first place. A hard hit, legal or not that causes injury also causes retaliation or a defensive mechanism by other teams. By that I mean, if a team sees that they turn to self protection. Take the Grybas hit on Eller in the 2013 playoffs for example, it was officially declared legal but what Montreal did was to go out and get George Parros as protection. Understandable, teams want to protect themselves from stuff like that. Watching the Tinordi hit, other teams see it and may decide they need and go get a protector like Parros or John Scott. Toronto for example most likely will dress Colton Orr or Frazer McLaren when Tinordi is playing for protection. It is only one incident but unfortunately it all ultimately leads to this needing and keeping a goon player as protection, something that the NHL is trying to get away from not have it re-enforced. I think that the NHL is going to put in place measures to stop these kind of injuries and changing what is allowed and not allowed for hits will most likely be coming.

 

[Brainiac]

Aside from that though, one of the other issues that the NHL is most likely concerned about is not whether Tinordi's hit was legal or not but rather that the hit happened the way it did in the first place.

Dude, that hit happened because Schmidt skated head down right into Tinordi's shoulder.

What can you do against that? Hand out a penalty each time a guy skates with his head down?

 

[RealityBytes]

Dude, that hit happened because Schmidt skated head down right into Tinordi's shoulder.

What can you do against that? Hand out a penalty each time a guy skates with his head down?

You don't need to justify the hit to me, or why it happened, the point is that a high impact hit did happen regardless of whether it was legal or not or whether the receiving player was looking or not. All I am getting at is that high impact hits that can cause injuries are something the NHL wants to get rid of.

If the NHL does want to get rid of high impact hits like that to reduce injuries, they will make rule changes accordingly. Who knows what it will be exactly, maybe it will be like the NBA to put some onus on the defensive player to not make a hit but only ride the player off, maybe only allow shoulder hits, maybe this, maybe that, no one knows for sure what at this point. However, the point remains, that if the NHL wants to get rid of those hits they will, and players will just have to adapt. Hits are a part of hockey and make it what it is, but if there are going to be hits above and beyond normal type hits that splatter somebody's brains, then they will be gone.

... and don't call me dude as if I don't understand, it's impolite. I understand the scenario and this whole situation quite clearly.

 

[ninjagaiden]

it was a hit to the head

not an elbow by any means but the point of contact was his head

 

[Monctonscout]

it was a hit to the head

not an elbow by any means but the point of contact was his head

By the NHL's definition, the main point of contact was the body, that's why Tinordi got no fine or suspension.

 

[Ghetto Sangria]

it was a hit to the head

not an elbow by any means but the point of contact was his head

Think about it this way... Tinordi hit him from the front, elbows tucked in and stood him up. He didn't come in from a blind side or from behind, he literally just got in his way and his head ran into Tinordi's body.

That's why it is still considered a legal hit even though his head was the principle point of contact. Let's say Tinordi was just standing there and Schmidt ran directly into him head first... would Tinordi get a penalty on that? Because it didn't come from the blind side or from behind and with his elbows tucked in, Schmidt had enough time to look up and go shoulder to shoulder or evade the clean hit.

 

[LaP]

It was not clean as the head can't be the first point of impact. The rules have changed.

The referee took the right decision.

 

[groovejuice]

It was not clean as the head can't be the first point of impact. The rules have changed.

The referee took the right decision.

The NHL disagrees.

 

[LaP]

By the NHL's definition, the main point of contact was the body, that's why Tinordi got no fine or suspension.

He was not suspended because it was not blind side, there was no elbow, his skates was on the ice when the contact occurred and there was no clear upward movement right before the hit.

Doesn't mean the league think it was a 100% legal hit and that the referee was wrong.

The hit was illegal just not dirty enough to be suspended for it.

 

[LaP]

The NHL disagrees.

Then post me a link where the NHL says the referee decision was wrong. No suspension != legal. A hit from behind is an illegal hit yet most of the time there's no suspension for them.

 

[Jigger77]

Dunno if it's been posted, but the NHL deleted the match penalty from
The boxscore.

So they admit it was an error!

Happy to hear that. NHL got it right and hopefully they addressed this with the referee that night too. Terrible call.

 

[RealityBytes]

Dunno if it's been posted, but the NHL deleted the match penalty from
The boxscore.

So they admit it was an error!

What exactly did they delete what and where?

They still show the 5 min elbowing penalty, the 5 min fighting major, and the game misconduct on the boxscore in NHL.com. That's the same box score that was there from the end of the game.

Are there different box scores that are official? If there are, I'd like to know where they are for future.

 

[groovejuice]

Then post me a link where the NHL says the referee decision was wrong. No suspension != legal. A hit from behind is an illegal hit yet most of the time there's no suspension for them.

The NHL doesn't comment on whether a major penalty was really a minor penalty. This was a straight up legal hit that the zebras overreacted to.

Not every contact with the head is illegal. I'm all for punishing predatory contact severely. IMO, that simply doesn't apply here.

 

[Varlan]

He was not suspended because it was not blind side, there was no elbow, his skates was on the ice when the contact occurred and there was no clear upward movement right before the hit.

Doesn't mean the league think it was a 100% legal hit and that the referee was wrong.

The hit was illegal just not dirty enough to be suspended for it.

No,he was not suspended because he lined the body up for a body check, making the body the principal point of contact. As much as people complain about inconsistency about league disciplinary actions, I believe they have been very consistent on this one subject. Simply line the body up for a body check.