Thoughts on San Diego?

[SImpelton]

There is no winter sports team in SD right now. In fact the only franchise San Diego has is I believe the Padres.

Seems like a lucrative market if good ownership can be found. Not a lot of competition and a lot of money floating around thanks to the extensive military presence in the SD metro area.

I wonder if the owners of the Padres would consider a winter sports team. Perhaps with military sponsorship? San Diego Sentinnels anyone?

Does anyone know if there's an appropriate venue anywhere around San Diego that could become a temporary facility?

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[Melrose Munch]

Probably better than Phoenix to be honest. At least it's closer to the border to reach Mexican fans.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

Not a big hockey market + you have Anaheim and LA not too far away.

 

[SImpelton]

Not a hockey market

This argument makes less and less sense given that for 2 years in a row, non hockey markets won the Stanley. If you count the Lightning as a non hockey market, and you probably should to be consistent, it's more like 4 years in a row.

+ you have Anaheim and LA not too far away.

LA and Anaheim are to San Diego as Boston is to New York, in terms of both distance and culture. They're not the same market at all. if they were, there would have been no reason to relocate the Rams to LA because San Diego would have had that market covered.

The fact that the move was made gives the lie to the notion that the overlap is even all that significant between the two markets.

This argument would be akin to denying a team to Columbus because the Blackhawks exist.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

LA and Anaheim are to San Diego as Boston is to New York, in terms of both distance and culture. They're not the same market at all. if they were, there would have been no reason to relocate the Rams to LA because San Diego would have had that market covered.

The fact that the move was made gives the lie to the notion that the overlap is even all that significant between the two markets.

What....

Easy 1:30 drive up insterstate 5 from SD to Anaheim, same state.

4:30 from NYC to BOS.

SLC, Houston etc. have way more potential than SD for hockey.

 

[Section 104]

It’s something like 8th in population by city and 18th in metropolitan area (Phoenix is 10th in the latter and we all know what a smashing success it was for hockey). It didn’t work for the WHA (few cities did) and the NBA team moved to Houston in 1971 after four seasons. NBA has never gone back.

I wouldn’t say it’s doomed to failure but you need an arena and good ownership that is competent in the front office that will invest and promote the team.

 

[ponder719]

San Diego is probably a credible 4th on the list of the NHL's preferred expansion targets, behind Houston, Atlanta, and Phoenix in whatever order they prefer those three, as the only other MSA larger is Inland Empire, which doesn't exactly have an anchor city the way San Diego MSA does, and the only truly logical Canadian option doesn't happen without a massive falling out between Rogers and Bell.

 

[PCSPounder]

What....

Easy 1:30 drive up insterstate 5 from SD to Anaheim, same state.

4:30 from NYC to BOS.

SLC, Houston etc. have way more potential than SD for hockey.

Just a correction… it’s an easy 1:30 to Anaheim at 1 am. In that corridor, traffic most emphatically happens.

I’m not convinced the proposed arena is sufficient.

 

[Bixby Snyder]

SLC, Houston etc. have way more potential than SD for hockey.

San Diego is Thatcher Demko's hometown and there are several other SoCal natives in the NHL, what has Houston or SLC produced?

 

[Brodeur]

They've been talking about renovating the Sports Arena area for awhile but I think that's still in conjecture mode at this point. As it stands, the current arena isn't suitable for an NHL club. I'd worry that SoCal is already inundated with the Kings/Ducks and that SD is properly slotted as an AHL city.

But if the new arena gets built, we'll see if some billionaire pops up out of the weeds wanting a team. Joe Tsai owns our lacrosse team and apparently is partners with Vegas' lacrosse team along with Wayne Gretzky and others.

Took a few years to get through the red tape to get the old football stadium demolished and turned into an MLS conducive stadium. The new stadium opened in 2022 and the expansion MLS team is going to start play in 2025.

 

[Static]

San Diego is too close to Anaheim in my opinion, especially with their AHL team playing there. I live in San Diego county and am able to watch ducks regional broadcasting, so that would be a big fight with the samuelis.

 

[tucker3434]

I think the NHL wants Houston, Atlanta and Phoenix in that order. So a decade from now, after people have had a chance to forget the AM mess, Phoenix will need a partner. Portland, Austin and San Diego all make sense to me. I could see any happening depending on what the arena and ownership options are at that point. Still a little too far down the line to make a guess on that though.

 

[Sgt Schultz]

San Diego is Thatcher Demko's hometown and there are several other SoCal natives in the NHL, what has Houston or SLC produced?

Good question, so I got curious. Houston produced Tyler Myers, who is Demko's teammate and has also played for the Sabres and Jets. As for Salt Lake City, Steve Konowalchuk is from there, as is Trevor Lewis.

So, the day is not a total loss......I learned something.

Next up, NHL players born in Bermuda! I guess my learning for the day is over.

 

[Melrose Munch]

I think the NHL wants Houston, Atlanta and Phoenix in that order. So a decade from now, after people have had a chance to forget the AM mess, Phoenix will need a partner. Portland, Austin and San Diego all make sense to me. I could see any happening depending on what the arena and ownership options are at that point. Still a little too far down the line to make a guess on that though.

San Diego is probably a credible 4th on the list of the NHL's preferred expansion targets, behind Houston, Atlanta, and Phoenix in whatever order they prefer those three, as the only other MSA larger is Inland Empire, which doesn't exactly have an anchor city the way San Diego MSA does, and the only truly logical Canadian option doesn't happen without a massive falling out between Rogers and Bell.

I don't even think Phoenix is on the radar right now. No ownership and no arena. I think honestly another US City will come before then.

 

[ponder719]

I don't even think Phoenix is on the radar right now. No ownership and no arena. I think honestly another US City will come before then.

If the NHL had plans in place to announce a new prospective ownership group for Phoenix less than 24 hours after news broke that Meruelo was walking away, I'd be too shocked to speak. Beyond that, we know Atlanta is reasonably far down the runway, all things considered. While it's not impossible for Phoenix to catch up, the most likely scenario is Atlanta is #33, and Houston and Phoenix are #34 and #35 in some order. I don't think the league looks to any location other than those three until they're addressed, unless they have to. The real question that remains is which city will be #36.

The one scenario where Phoenix isn't #34 or #35 for me is if Houston is #34, and #35 and #36 are announced together, with Phoenix being given an extra year's run time before hitting the ice.

 

[Melrose Munch]

If the NHL had plans in place to announce a new prospective ownership group for Phoenix less than 24 hours after news broke that Meruelo was walking away, I'd be too shocked to speak. Beyond that, we know Atlanta is reasonably far down the runway, all things considered. While it's not impossible for Phoenix to catch up, the most likely scenario is Atlanta is #33, and Houston and Phoenix are #34 and #35 in some order. I don't think the league looks to any location other than those three until they're addressed, unless they have to. The real question that remains is which city will be #36.

The one scenario where Phoenix isn't #34 or #35 for me is if Houston is #34, and #35 and #36 are announced together, with Phoenix being given an extra year's run time before hitting the ice.

Another problem with Phoenix vs the other two is proximity. Phoenix has Salt Lake, Las Vegas, Los Angeles, Los Angeles (Orange County), and San Jose. Atlanta just has Carolina and Dallas is over 3 hours from Houston. I understand Southern California has two teams, but San Diego would be a fresh break, it's the same size once Tijuana is included and they support minor league hockey very well. Phoenix just needs more time, and there's a lot in the area.

Another thing is, I just don't think Phoenix is a big sports town. At all. Which is a huge factor is this. I'm not seeing many people clamouring for a team outside the diehards.

 

[Voight]

This argument makes less and less sense given that for 2 years in a row, non hockey markets won the Stanley. If you count the Lightning as a non hockey market, and you probably should to be consistent, it's more like 4 years in a row.


LA and Anaheim are to San Diego as Boston is to New York, in terms of both distance and culture. They're not the same market at all. if they were, there would have been no reason to relocate the Rams to LA because San Diego would have had that market covered.

The fact that the move was made gives the lie to the notion that the overlap is even all that significant between the two markets.

This argument would be akin to denying a team to Columbus because the Blackhawks exist.

Colorado...

 

[Mike Jones]

Here's some interesting reading on San Diego's efforts in the old WHA:

San Diego Mariners - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[BigBadBruins7708]

Southern California doesn't need a 3rd team

 

[GKJ]

What....

Easy 1:30 drive up insterstate 5 from SD to Anaheim, same state.

4:30 from NYC to BOS.

SLC, Houston etc. have way more potential than SD for hockey.

San Diego and LA are not the same market. On it's own it's like the 8th biggest market on the continent.

 

[Mike Jones]

Southern California doesn't need a 3rd team

Bettman can't help himself. He seems to believe that any place with dunes is perfect for ice hockey.

 

[StreetHawk]

San Diego is probably a credible 4th on the list of the NHL's preferred expansion targets, behind Houston, Atlanta, and Phoenix in whatever order they prefer those three, as the only other MSA larger is Inland Empire, which doesn't exactly have an anchor city the way San Diego MSA does, and the only truly logical Canadian option doesn't happen without a massive falling out between Rogers and Bell.

The main Pro for SD is that it's in the PST time zone. Assuming Hou, ATL, and AZ are locks to get a team, without another one in the MST or PST, it means to do a 6x6 setup, one of the CST cities like Min/Win/STL would need to play in a division with all other MST/PST clubs.

Van, Sea, SJ, LA, Ana, SD
LV, AZ, Utah, Col, Edm, Cal

or Van, Sea, Edm, Cal, Col, Utah
and SJ, LA, Ana, SD, LV, AZ

If not, can see that it gets tricky to add another team to that group.

 

[BigBadBruins7708]

Bettman can't help himself. He seems to believe that any place with dunes is perfect for ice hockey.

True. I loved having hockey here when I moved out from New England, but unfortunately the success in Vegas only reinforces this thoughts

 

[Yukon Joe]

If Salt Lake City could get a franchise, then San Diego absolutely could.

But in order to look at potential NHL markets, you need to look at three things:
1. Ownership
2. Arena
3. market itself

and in that order. A city could be nearly perfect for the NHL but if there's no ownership and no arena then it just won't work. Just look at Houston.

So ownership - I mean with California's economy it has more billionaire than most place. But you need someone who wants to own a hockey team, and wants to own one in San Diego. Can anyone think of some names?

Arena. This is where we run into problems. San Diego is home to the Pechanga Arena, home of the AHL Gulls. Built in 1966 it's probably not good enough for the NHL - but look! The ownership is renovating! But here's the problem - that ownership group is led by Stan Kroenke, who already owns the Avalanche.

So Kroenke is getting his multi-0use development project without having to buy an NHL franchise (which he wouldn't be allowed to own two anyways), but that probably locks out any other potential owner.

Market - eh - I'm sure it would be fine. But how do you get past the other two?

 

[famicommander]

San Diego is not a good sports market.