The Vancouver Media Thread | Part VIII

[F A N]

So the public would love to know why ppl like Arthur c Clarke and s Kubrick were on the appollo 11 mission team but no one will ever allow them to know that. Similar to why they're trying to stop Tiktok. It's all part of a be stupid agenda. So if you want to know why the media starts and does up these melodramas, it's because there's an industry out there that wants to make all that stuff up. It's why wizard of Oz is considered by some to be a documentary. Among other such things.... Like "They Live" .... get them shades but put Newman and the Hansens in there also ...

In answer to: where do you get info. ?
My reply is, by just asking that question, you've taken an important step towards your much better future. So keep asking.

I don't believe journalism integrity is completely lost. I do think many have lost it. There is a poster here who thinks someone in the media would never make stuff up (e.g. Sekeres saying Hughes on IV) but I think blind belief in someone from the media is just stupid.

But I think the nature of sports talk provides less incentives to make things up because you can simply discuss the issue. Petey doesn't need to be available for trade in order for a show to discuss trade possibilities for an hour or two. There is no need say there's a rift as if it is fact when you can simply discuss what to do IF there is a rift.

This is different from news media where there is a race to break the story first and where there's some obvious political agenda going on.

 

[F A N]

The media here got that rep when they ran Gillis and Torts out of town and put the owners through the wringer.
Since then and starting under Benning the media has been neutered. The monopoly controlled by the team, the NHL and Rogers have eliminated ALL other radio stations and essentially control ALL access to the team there has been a media person that had his credentials revoked due to saying what they didn't approve of and even Donni and Dhali have said on the air, "we don't want go to get in trouble again", they used to have agents as guest commonly, Rutherford some other team officials now they don't. I don't think ever do with few exceptions. They may be the last independent media show and at that they still have to be "careful" and IMO they still do follow some vague instructions. The problem is NO show in Canada will criticize unless they have independent sponsors or ownership. Look at what happened at TSN.

Actually, it was under Linden/Benning that nonprint media gained access. Canucks Army for example was not given access under Gillis. Linden/Benning gave them access. It is current management who didn't allow JPat to attend Rutherford's presser. Press access appears something that management does control.

 

[Raistlin]

IMO They are just beating a dead horse to get engagement. Yes, there is two guys that don't really like each other. Has been for ages though. So their relationship is not the issue, EP's issue is confidence. Miller's issue is mental, my guess is anger management possibly? So when the media spotlight kept focusing on a likely phantom issue, or a micro facet of a much larger issue, one that has no solution but only serves as a detriment to the involved players and the team? I'd rather they stop "reporting" incessantly on these useless clickbait stories.

After a while the media maelstrom itself 100% becomes the source of the player's and team's struggles.

I believe the local media knows it, but is on a feeding frenzy and enjoying the ride because they are being interviewed by out of town radio stations, giving their "expert" opinion, getting clicks, getting paid.

 

[F A N]

IMO They are just beating a dead horse to get engagement. Yes, there is two guys that don't really like each other. Has been for ages though. So their relationship is not the issue, EP's issue is confidence. Miller's issue is mental, my guess is anger management possibly? So when the media spotlight kept focusing on a likely phantom issue, or a micro facet of a much larger issue, one that has no solution but only serves as a detriment to the involved players and the team? I'd rather they stop "reporting" incessantly on these useless clickbait stories.

After a while the media maelstrom itself 100% becomes the source of the player's and team's struggles.

I believe the local media knows it, but is on a feeding frenzy and enjoying the ride because they are being interviewed by out of town radio stations, giving their "expert" opinion, getting clicks, getting paid.

I don't have an issue with the media reporting what is the truth. I suppose it is news because we rarely hear about hockey players not liking each other but winning together unlike say basketball.

As for blaming the media for player performance and team struggles, on the surface I would agree that the media has an impact but on closer inspection I wonder why that is the case. It's not like the most scrutinized teams in baseball and basketball haven't won championships. But there is this narrative that Canadian teams haven't won a Cup because of the media compared to Florida based teams where players can live a normal life.

 

[rypper]

The local media isn't the big bad meanie here. Outside of Dhaliwal, no one was reporting on it until the national guys made it a story and then of course they'll talk about it because fans are talking about it. As a whole the local media have been respectful of the teams issues.

Tocchet and Hughes address it pre game, so they request Miller and Pettersson after the game. Why wouldn't they?

 

[theguardianII]

The local media isn't the big bad meanie here. Outside of Dhaliwal, no one was reporting on it until the national guys made it a story and then of course they'll talk about it because fans are talking about it. As a whole the local media have been respectful of the teams issues.

Tocchet and Hughes address it pre game, so they request Miller and Pettersson after the game. Why wouldn't they?

Those interviews, all of them really muddied the waters even more. The two antagonists saying nothing wrong the other two, the Captain and Coach saying these things can be solved.

Two saying it is all made up and two saying it can be fixed. In one day.

 

[geebster]

Not sure if it's been brought up but Patrick Johnston getting his panties in a twist and writing that super personal article in the Province calling Petey petulant was really immature. Took the low road on that one for sure and was clearly in his own feelies about Petey not liking him repeating the same question 3 times and telling him to read the room on his way out.

There's definitely childishness on both sides but the media's job is to report the team objectively and not be personal about it. Cry on twitter about it (which he did), but don't put it in a newspaper. Also my sense of it all is that it's been overblown by the media. Clearly there was some personal sniping but it isn't to the extent they are making it out to be (that it's torn the team apart and you have to trade one etc). But I'm biased in that I saw Dhaliwal say this nonsense about Miller 2 years in a row (him and Horvat dividing the room, Miller asking out last year etc). So I take it with a massive grain of salt.

Also the media is absolutely softer than they were before. There is no Gallagher ripping into the team everyday, but part of that is we haven't been a great team and traditional media has been dying If we were a top team it'd ramp up.

 

[rypper]

Not sure if it's been brought up but Jeff Patterson getting his panties in a twist and writing that super personal article in the Province calling Petey petulant was really immature. Took the low road on that one for sure and was clearly in his own feelies about Petey not liking him repeating the same question 3 times and telling him to read the room on his way out.

There's definitely childishness on both sides but the media's job is to report the team objectively and not be personal about it. Cry on twitter about it (which he did), but don't put it in a newspaper. Also my sense of it all is that it's been overblown by the media. Clearly there was some personal sniping but it isn't to the extent they are making it out to be (that it's torn the team apart and you have to trade one etc). But I'm biased in that I saw Dhaliwal say this nonsense about Miller 2 years in a row (him and Horvat dividing the room, Miller asking out last year etc). So I take it with a massive grain of salt.

Also the media is absolutely softer than they were before. There is no Gallagher ripping into the team everyday, but part of that is we haven't been a great team and traditional media has been dying If we were a top team it'd ramp up.

Patrick Johnston, not Jeff Paterson and his non existent shoulders.

 

[geebster]

Patrick Johnston, not Jeff Paterson and his non existent shoulders.

Ah good call wrote that while half paying attention. What a whiny article that was tho

 

[beachcomber]

The media should just lay off these guys and let them play. It’s disgusting how they are propping up this feud bs for clicks. They have no idea what is going on in the room. The players have nothing but disdain for them and don’t trust them with good reason. There are a few decent media guys but they are few and far between.

 

[Nona Di Giuseppe]

IMO They are just beating a dead horse to get engagement. Yes, there is two guys that don't really like each other. Has been for ages though. So their relationship is not the issue, EP's issue is confidence. Miller's issue is mental, my guess is anger management possibly? So when the media spotlight kept focusing on a likely phantom issue, or a micro facet of a much larger issue, one that has no solution but only serves as a detriment to the involved players and the team? I'd rather they stop "reporting" incessantly on these useless clickbait stories.

After a while the media maelstrom itself 100% becomes the source of the player's and team's struggles.

I believe the local media knows it, but is on a feeding frenzy and enjoying the ride because they are being interviewed by out of town radio stations, giving their "expert" opinion, getting clicks, getting paid.

100% Circular causation.

The 'fans' don't help either.

 

[theguardianII]

Two Stories, Two Players and ?

Looking around I found there is no active JT Miller thread.
This post is not just about Miller but about how media is not sharing public information.
I totally understand the massive effort to bury the Miller/Pettersson stuff, it is mostly localized media.

But I found this relatable to events similar to here. It is in relationship to Laine.
There is no foundation to say the two incidents are the same, just similar but just how they get served up.

Laine entered NHLPA player assistance program, Miller DID NOT. But...

Laine's as a Columbus player statement;

"Dear fans and supporters,

I wanted to take a moment to address my need to step away from the game for a while. After careful consideration and discussions with my support network and the team, I have recognized the importance of prioritizing my mental health and well-being. Hockey has been my passion and my life, but I have come to realize that in order to perform at my best, I need to take this time to focus on myself.

I am grateful for the understanding and support of my team, the league, and our fans during this time. I look forward to returning to the ice with a clear mind and renewed energy. Thank you for respecting my privacy during this time and for your continued support.

With love,
Patty"

The Canucks statement, now this hasn't been addressed by Miller in any way;

By Canucks Communications @Canucks Vancouver Canucks

November 19, 2024

Vancouver, B.C. – Vancouver Canucks General Manager Patrik Allvin announced today that Forward J.T. Miller will be taking an indefinite leave of absence from the team for personal reasons.
“Right now, our sole focus is making sure that J.T. knows the entire organization is here to support him,” said Allvin. “Out of respect to J.T., we will have no further comment at this time.”

Two different statements but similar messages especially when Dhali speculated Miller's leave was for the same reason as Laine's. The connection was made by mainstream media not social media. Columbus and most of the NHL went silent for the most part.

But Laine later stated and reported on Sportsnet;

“Obviously, things happened, and that was kind of it for me," Laine said to The Athletic's Aaron Portzline earlier Monday. “I feel like we were just doing the same thing year after year. I was tired of losing and just giving up when it’s December to start focusing on next year. I’m not going to do that. That’s frustrating as a player when you’re trying to win and some people are, you know, not like that.

“They’re a little too satisfied and too comfortable where they’re at. It wasn’t really a fit for me anymore. But here (in Montreal), it doesn’t matter if we’re winning or losing, we’re always trying our best. That’s what I felt about it (in Columbus).”

Quite different from a sanitized first statement while still with the CBJ's, while with that team was he going to make this sentiment public?

Laine, like a lots of passionate players wants to win and that passion may be as strong with Miller. This year, after last year's big step forward, is a big step back. Last year the entire group was making the playoffs easily, they were often mentioned as now being true contenders.
This year the players will know it is going to be a struggle, they play the game and know how hard they have to be this season, they cannot let their foot off the throttle, the pressure is much higher to no make a single costly mistake.
For Laine too long was 4 years. Miller has endured 5 of 6 years and just when it looked like a turn around, they lost players, the cap situation is about to become much more a problem with buyouts and he is 32 yrs old in a few months, his time is very limited for another realistic chance at a cup.

The other thing is that Miller is well known for his desire to win and his intensity,

This statement by Laine might be a small window looking into a player's physique. What is for the fans and the team paying him what is needed to be said. Although even then it was "rumored" that the it wasn't there anymore.

Due to all the shit happening now is something like this possible? That behind the curtain there is a player so disheartened that he won't even agree with the team's statement? Instead just stays silent about whatever.

This is this market, this is the fan's team, I am sure most want to see a Stanley Cup in their lifetimes, why should if be different for player's? The most "inside" people in the game.

Hey this forum is for entertainment, something to read to pass time and shill out opinions.

This thread is not saying they are the same but it happens so rarely that just maybe it can be comparable. All public via mainstream media with quotes so in the public domain and not made up.

Whatever it isn't going away, other media, eastern media are hot on these things because they are rare and usually precipitate changes. Other team's media, eastern and US run stories.

I think in the past information like this would been more noted, people like Davidson, McRae, Gallagher, Botchford and somewhat at time Drance would make these, obvious to me, connections and wrote a story. There are no media challenges TO the team anymore.

IMac has to be careful, he is a Rogers employee so the story of how the bare win over the second worst team on a back to back is sensationalized as more than it was. The Nux were lucky that coaches challenge failed, if successful that is a to goal difference in SJ favor. I mention this because of the reality of the competition.

 

[rypper]

Local media doesn't have the same access they used to. Covid put stricter protocols in place and they never went back to pre pandemic ways.

A guy like Drance used to be able to walk around the locker room and have informal chats with players and get insight to stuff on and off the record.

Now they have to formally request players and it's all very controlled. It's hard to get an original story from a scrum when there's a handful of others hearing the same thing at the same time.

 

[Coffee]

At this point I’m starting to think iMac is a troll

 

[PuckMunchkin]

I don't believe journalism integrity is completely lost. I do think many have lost it. There is a poster here who thinks someone in the media would never make stuff up (e.g. Sekeres saying Hughes on IV) but I think blind belief in someone from the media is just stupid.

But I think the nature of sports talk provides less incentives to make things up because you can simply discuss the issue. Petey doesn't need to be available for trade in order for a show to discuss trade possibilities for an hour or two. There is no need say there's a rift as if it is fact when you can simply discuss what to do IF there is a rift.

This is different from news media where there is a race to break the story first and where there's some obvious political agenda going on.

Fabricating sources can lead to legal ramifications, including defamation lawsuits. Journalists can face serious legal consequences if they publish false information.

Some might not be critical enough of their sources but I can bet you Sekeres didnt just wake up and decided, today I'll make some shit about Hughes being on an IV. He probably heard a rumour and didnt do his due diligence verifying the story. I would also pay close attention to the wording being used. Eliot Friedman is a master at this. You can decipher how reliable the story is from how he words it on his podcast / article.


Also someone being on an IV for fluids isnt something that dramatic to begin with, just sounds so.

 

[F A N]

Fabricating sources can lead to legal ramifications, including defamation lawsuits. Journalists can face serious legal consequences if they publish false information.

Sure but it is very difficult to successfully sue for defamation. Sekeres would just say he was reporting on what he heard and there was no damage to Hughes' reputation. It would be difficult for Hughes to prove that Sekeres' comment about him having a rough go with COVID and being on IV and losing weight as having damaged his reputation that resulted in him suffering a loss.

Some might not be critical enough of their sources but I can bet you Sekeres didnt just wake up and decided, today I'll make some shit about Hughes being on an IV. He probably heard a rumour and didnt do his due diligence verifying the story. I would also pay close attention to the wording being used. Eliot Friedman is a master at this. You can decipher how reliable the story is from how he words it on his podcast / article.


Also someone being on an IV for fluids isnt something that dramatic to begin with, just sounds so.

So you're saying he didn't make shit up but he was just an irresponsible "journalist?" Or are you simply trying to argue semantics here?

Sekeres made the statement about Hughes couched in terms like "my understanding" and "there are reports." Essentially, a "journalist" is free to "make shit up" by simply using terms like that and if sued he can simply say he was simply making a fair comment.

I don't understand why you would defend him here if he "probably... didn't do his due diligence verifying the story" and didn't bother representing it that way. Journalists who reports on the truth should be credited and praised. At the same time, "journalists" who reports on fake stories without doing their own diligence in verifying the story should be called out and discredited.

Both Ferraro and Boudreau has called Sekeres out for making things up.

If I had a platform like Sekeres, I can simply report on the rumours I read on HFBoards. For example, I can say that it is "my understanding" that Canucks management is exploring the possibly of trading Pettersson possibly to Colorado for Rantanen. There are reports that Canucks management isn't entirely happy with Pettersson's performance this year and Colorado might not be able to afford Rantanen's contract and they have always liked Pettersson. Did I make this up? I sure did. Can anyone win by suing me for defamation? Not if I never said I made this up.

 

[rypper]

Vancouver radio was clowning on the Oilers and McDavid this morning. I hope that was the same across Canada.

 

[I Hart Conor Garland]

#oilstrong

 

[theguardianII]

I am sure there is a brigade of team marketers working on haw bad this Colorado, Chicago, Carolina trade is and that the fans here should be thankful.

 

[StreetHawk]

Sure but it is very difficult to successfully sue for defamation. Sekeres would just say he was reporting on what he heard and there was no damage to Hughes' reputation. It would be difficult for Hughes to prove that Sekeres' comment about him having a rough go with COVID and being on IV and losing weight as having damaged his reputation that resulted in him suffering a loss.



So you're saying he didn't make shit up but he was just an irresponsible "journalist?" Or are you simply trying to argue semantics here?

Sekeres made the statement about Hughes couched in terms like "my understanding" and "there are reports." Essentially, a "journalist" is free to "make shit up" by simply using terms like that and if sued he can simply say he was simply making a fair comment.

I don't understand why you would defend him here if he "probably... didn't do his due diligence verifying the story" and didn't bother representing it that way. Journalists who reports on the truth should be credited and praised. At the same time, "journalists" who reports on fake stories without doing their own diligence in verifying the story should be called out and discredited.

Both Ferraro and Boudreau has called Sekeres out for making things up.

If I had a platform like Sekeres, I can simply report on the rumours I read on HFBoards. For example, I can say that it is "my understanding" that Canucks management is exploring the possibly of trading Pettersson possibly to Colorado for Rantanen. There are reports that Canucks management isn't entirely happy with Pettersson's performance this year and Colorado might not be able to afford Rantanen's contract and they have always liked Pettersson. Did I make this up? I sure did. Can anyone win by suing me for defamation? Not if I never said I made this up.

I think the media people can always get off the hook when they Preference their "reports" with "I'm hearing" or "the word around the NHL is".

Almost no one these days, ever writes, my "source is telling me". At best they just use "sources close to the situation", but never tie their name to that source.

This allows them to talk about it as if it's true, but can later say, it was rumblings, not "facts" or their source.

So, always pay attention to whether they preference their comments/reports. almost all hearsay these days.

 

[rypper]

I am sure there is a brigade of team marketers working on haw bad this Colorado, Chicago, Carolina trade is and that the fans here should be thankful.

If you see them, point them out so the rest of us can avoid them. #doingthelordswork

 

[theguardianII]

If you see them, point them out so the rest of us can avoid them. #doingthelordswork

Too late for some to comment on yet but this is what I think you will hear, broad comments on;

Too old, too expensive, no cap space, trading futures, not enough for Pettersson and too expensive for Miller, just an exchange of older players and longer term. They wouldn't have enough to re-sign Boeser, ....

All things of immediate gratification and supposed imaginary possibilities and Riccio saying he wouldn't do that because they couldn't keep Boeser then. He is a true "do nothing keep it the way it is" guy. A believer of fanatical optimism. "One in a Million? So there is still a chance right?"

Just about any show that doesn't think this would have been a good deal for the Canucks for either player, EP or JTM.

 

[Bleach Clean]

Drance: "My fear is that this org spent 15 years to become a team whose ceiling was NOT an inner circle contender once"...

Absolutely cooked the Canucks.

 

[Jyrki21]

Drance: "My fear is that this org spent 15 years to become a team whose ceiling was NOT an inner circle contender once"...

Absolutely cooked the Canucks.

I mean, this is what we were saying about the Aquilini-Benning regime in real time. It was always the principal concern.

 

[F A N]

I think the media people can always get off the hook when they Preference their "reports" with "I'm hearing" or "the word around the NHL is".

Almost no one these days, ever writes, my "source is telling me". At best they just use "sources close to the situation", but never tie their name to that source.

This allows them to talk about it as if it's true, but can later say, it was rumblings, not "facts" or their source.

So, always pay attention to whether they preference their comments/reports. almost all hearsay these days.

I think it's only a matter of time. We've seen in the States more people (including public figures) suing for defamation and winning or obtaining a settlement. I think if one is a bit loose with reporting, one day somebody is going to say something and not quickly retract and will be sued and lose.

Personally I don't mind it. Let the facts come out.