The state of the Habs Rebuild - The Next step

[OnTheRun]

Then these p***yes need to move over for someone with balls. Vegas built a perrenial contender and cup winner on futures alone.

Enough of the bar-lowering. The Habs can be contenders.

We are not at the same stage as the Knights were when they started their string of super aggressive moves. You're smart enough to realize that, in fact you are probably over frustrated because you realize we are not there yet.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

I agree but my point was that even in the middle of a rebuild, you may need to acquire pivotal players to help prospects reaching their ceiling. i personally think it's as important as the quality of prospects you draft.

It’s tough to develop in an environment where everyone is green. The D’s vets are Matheson and Savrd…. Not great.

Remember when we got an older Hamrlik here? That’s the kind of move I’m talking about. A brudge to help us for now as these players find their game.

 

[Mrb1p]

We are not at the same stage as the Knights were when they started their string of super aggressive moves. You're smart enough to realize that, in fact you are probably over frustrated because you realize we are not there yet.

What do you mean? What did they have when they did that we don't? They didn't even have a roster when they did .

Were not there yet BECAUSE we chose to sit on our hands. It's fine to wait on kids, but the kids need to come in to something. The point of ELCs is to have cheap talent that allows you to spend big elsewhere. We can't "wait" for Demidov to become elite and then pay him 10ms and then compete, we have to have him be elite in the last year, or two years of his ELC and compete then. Same goes for any prospect they choose to keep.

 

[Benstheman]

It’s tough to develop in an environment where everyone is green. The D’s vets are Matheson and Savrd…. Not great.

Remember when we got an older Hamrlik here? That’s the kind of move I’m talking about. A brudge to help us for now as these players find their game.

Thank you. i'm happy i'm not the only one thinking that.

I like Savard a lot as a veteran but he just can't take a big enough part of the cake anymore. He just can't. And Matheson ain't it. He will never be the guy to say : That's it. That's enough. I'm gonna show those kids what it takes to win games. Follow me guys. He's just not.

The only guys right now who's showing signs of leadership right now are Gallagher and Hutson. That's really concerning.

 

[Andy]

folks have unreasonable expectations of a rebuild timeline.

Two of the teams three lottery picks are still not in the nhl.

They've drafted 30 players in the last three drafts, only two are with the club,

For some perspective, no other player drafted between 2022-2024 is really burning up the league. Nemec just sent to the AHL. Michkov was a healthy scratch. Leo Carlsson is producing under .5ppg. Bedard hasnt made an impact in Chicago. Fantilli isnt producing great.

The team gets better through the draft. We need time for these picks to cook. Everyone is incredibly impatient.

 

[teamfirst]

are you not excited by the prospect pool we have? What were your feelings on the team we had before HUGO?

I'm excited by some yes, doesn't change the fact that they are mishandle by the coaching staff we have, i said it before and i'll say it again, biggest issue is the way they play in their own end, that's on the coaching staff.

As for my feelings on the team we had before, well i really liked the Scotty Bowman era, also had some good years under Lemaire-Burns-Perron-Demers.....was pretty hard after that alltho we made the SCF in 2021 it was pretty cool.

What about you.

 

[Tyson]

folks have unreasonable expectations of a rebuild timeline.

Two of the teams three lottery picks are still not in the nhl.

They've drafted 30 players in the last three drafts, only two are with the club,

For some perspective, no other player drafted between 2022-2024 is really burning up the league. Nemec just sent to the AHL. Michkov was a healthy scratch. Leo Carlsson is producing under .5ppg. Bedard hasnt made an impact in Chicago. Fantilli isnt producing great.

The team gets better through the draft. We need time for these picks to cook. Everyone is incredibly impatient.

Shouldn't we expect some progress?

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Thank you. i'm happy i'm not the only one thinking that.

I like Savard a lot as a veteran but he just can't take a big enough part of the cake anymore. He just can't. And Matheson ain't it. He will never be the guy to say : That's it. That's enough. I'm gonna show those kids what it takes to win games. Follow me guys. He's just not.

The only guys right now who's showing signs of leadership right now are Gallagher and Hutson. That's really concerning.

Matheson has real value. I’d look to exploit it now. He can be a top four on a contender that needs an offensive producing blueliner. Ghule and Hutson can be our top two on the left side and then you’ve got Struble/x for depth.

Hate giving up on Baron as I think he could be a really good blueliner. But does he reach that potential here under these circumstances? I don’t know. We could just keep him as our third pairing for now and see if have can leapfrog Savard.

If you get a vet RD you now have the ability to move Guhle back to the left and you’ve got Savard who can stay until younger players can step in. Mailloux and RB are on the way, that would be a decent enough bridge for now.

 

[dinodebino]

Please stop telling other posters what they can think or what they can expect. I was ready since the start of the rebuild for this season to be a lost one likely between 8-12th last. Montreal is competing for bottom 3 again. You having zero expectations doesn't negate other people's real ones.

Blabla. Cry. I’m telling it as it is. My opinion ya think? No, it’s reality. Face it.

This forum has turned into X with rage. I seldom come anymore because of posts like this. Stop being entitled, people! This team is young and lacks vet depth! Face it and deal with it, and your life will be much better. Mine is. Yours?

My expectations? 82 points. Are we going to achieve it? I still believe the team will. Man, they win three games and they’re back in the ‘race for 82’.

Kids!!!! We have a bunch of kids!!! No team wins with so many kids! None.
Mtl Media got y’all inflated.

I won’t change your opinion. I don’t give a f***. Actually, I’m a bit disappointed at myself for getting entangled in this puerile and infantile debate.

Now, I’ll leave you with this final word while I go whip myself on the buttocks for falling into this trap! f*** me.

 

[Andy]

Shouldn't we expect some progress?

In theory yes, but the team needed so many pieces.

Guhle, Arber, Struble, Hutson, Barron....none of these defenders have two full seasons worth of nhl experience.

The habs were so thin on offense that half of the top 6 is comprised of players the team has traded for (Laine, Dach, Newhook). That's how bare the offense is.

4/6 players of the bottom 6 are comprised of declining, overpaid vets.

Folks are really underestimating how much work there needs to be done to this team.

Progress will happen through Hutson, Slaf, Demidov, Reinbacher. They are just not there yet.

I don't want this management team making a panic move like Sergachev for Drouin (which I was for at the time) just to try and win an extra 5-6 games.

Even if the habs get top4 and bottom6 help, they still have a LONG way to go.

 

[OnTheRun]

What do you mean? What did they have when they did that we don't? They didn't even have a roster when they did .

Were not there yet BECAUSE we chose to sit on our hands. It's fine to wait on kids, but the kids need to come in to something. The point of ELCs is to have cheap talent that allows you to spend big elsewhere. We can't "wait" for Demidov to become elite and then pay him 10ms and then compete, we have to have him be elite in the last year, or two years of his ELC and compete then. Same goes for any prospect they choose to keep.

Damn... How did you jump from Vegas to... that. You know they had no one overly relevant on ELC when they won right? Same with the Cats, Avs or the Bolts...

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

I'm excited by some yes, doesn't change the fact that they are mishandle by the coaching staff we have, i said it before and i'll say it again, biggest issue is the way they play in their own end, that's on the coaching staff.

They played well last year. They’re playing poorly this year. Nobody disagrees that we need to do something to help fix it. Maybe it’s a system change or a vet…

That doesn’t mean people want another tank year or that rebuilding was the wrong path.

As for my feelings on the team we had before, well i really liked the Scotty Bowman era, also had some good years under Lemaire-Burns-Perron-Demers.....was pretty hard after that alltho we made the SCF in 2021 it was pretty cool.

Loved the Scotty Bowman era. He traded for picks and prospects that formed the base of a team that won several cups. Lafleur, Robinson, Dryden… all acquired as prospects/picks via trade.

We applied the same philosophy. Traded for a whack of picks/peospects. That’s how we got Hutson.

What about you.

I think the team finally learned its lesson that avoiding rebuilding doesn’t work. Our first true superstar in 25 years came from a one time lotto pick in the top five.

Going twenty five years between top five picks (not including one time lottos) did absolutely nothing for us. No scorer in the top ten since 1986. No 50 goal scorer since 1990.

The definition of insanity is doing the same things over and over.

Us having a bad year? Oh well. No biggie in the grand scheme of things. We continue to develop and might wind up with another high pick. Is it what I wanted for this year? No. But it doesn’t matter a whole lot in the grand scheme of things.

 

[Benstheman]

Matheson has real value. I’d look to exploit it now. He can be a top four on a contender that needs an offensive producing blueliner. Ghule and Hutson can be our top two on the left side and then you’ve got Struble/x for depth.

Hate giving up on Baron as I think he could be a really good blueliner. But does he reach that potential here under these circumstances? I don’t know. We could just keep him as our third pairing for now and see if have can leapfrog Savard.

If you get a vet RD you now have the ability to move Guhle back to the left and you’ve got Savard who can stay until younger players can step in. Mailloux and RB are on the way, that would be a decent enough bridge for now.

Yep. and i will add this. If the plan is to wait for Reinbacher to be top pair guy and Mailloux top be 2nd pair guy and be a contender with it, the odds are it'll never happen. And if does happen, it will take 4-5 years.

 

[Kobe Armstrong]

What do you mean? What did they have when they did that we don't? They didn't even have a roster when they did .

Were not there yet BECAUSE we chose to sit on our hands. It's fine to wait on kids, but the kids need to come in to something. The point of ELCs is to have cheap talent that allows you to spend big elsewhere. We can't "wait" for Demidov to become elite and then pay him 10ms and then compete, we have to have him be elite in the last year, or two years of his ELC and compete then. Same goes for any prospect they choose to keep.

Bingo - bringing in Demidov to an already decent team would’ve been epic.

But now we have to expect him to struggle his first few year because of how bad the team is

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Bingo - bringing in Demidov to an already decent team would’ve been epic.

But now we have to expect him to struggle his first few year because of how bad the team is

I still think this team’s better than it’s shown. Especially the forwards. I knew we’d have challenges but were analytically the worst team in the league. Our roster isn’t THAT bad.

 

[OnTheRun]

I still think this team’s better than it’s shown. Especially the forwards. I knew we’d have challenges but were analytically the worst team in the league. Our roster isn’t THAT bad.

On paper, yes. But we definitely have guys in key roles playing like dog shit, it does make the roster THAT bad, at least temporally.

 

[Andy]

On paper, yes. But we definitely have guys in key roles playing like dog shit, it does make the roster THAT bad, at least temporally.

Dach being absolutely awful does not help.

Also, we've not seen any progress from Xhekaj and Barron, while Savard regressed. That has hurt a lot as well.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

On paper, yes. But we definitely have guys in key roles playing like dog shit, it does make the roster THAT bad, at least temporally.

Nick and CC’s numbers are way down from where they usually are. It’s been a really weird year.

 

[Kobe Armstrong]

I still think this team’s better than it’s shown. Especially the forwards. I knew we’d have challenges but were analytically the worst team in the league. Our roster isn’t THAT bad.

It’s pretty bad but the coaching is making us look worse than we are - other bum teams like Philly and Chicago at least have hardcore defensive coaches that make their analytics look better

Dach being absolutely awful does not help.

Also, we've not seen any progress from Xhekaj and Barron, while Savard regressed. That has hurt a lot as well.

Xhekaj makes me sad

 

[Mrb1p]

Damn... How did you jump from Vegas to... that. You know they had no one overly relevant on ELC when they won right? Same with the Cats, Avs or the Bolts...

Good, imagine how good this team could be if we did.

 

[Habby4Life]

Very poor D core and poor coaching is not a good mix.

 

[Tyson]

Very poor D core and poor coaching is not a good mix.

 

[OnTheRun]

Nick and CC’s numbers are way down from where they usually are. It’s been a really weird year.

Well that's actually a good picture of what the team is going through. Early on CC/Suz/Slaf line was generating like ~2 goals per game but the Newhook/Dach line was on the ice for 3~5 goals against, you can't really look good as a team when that happen.

Newhook had a good game last night, hopefully he can build on that. I also refuse to believe Dach will be that bad for 82 games. Once those two are out of their slump we can hope to be able to balance the top6 a bit.

 

[417]

Players are never easy to find and maybe none are available. But I hope they’re looking. Lots of teams are looking for young talent/picks.

At the cost of moving stabilizing, more veteran players?

I don't know. That's a hard sell if you're a team looking to compete right now.

But hope you're right.

 

[Benstheman]

I just thought hard about it and i found the solution :

Sign Shesterkin as UFA this summer...