The Sabres GM and Front Office Thread

[Ace]

Even if KA moves to another title and Karmanos goes to GM, it's just a Maaco paint job on a beater. Same shit FO people, same shit culture.

It’s actually much, much worse.

The clock for pressure just resets to 0. Adams isn’t the GM, right? Gotta give Karmanos time. We’d be three to five years away from the next time a meaningful change could happen.

At least if Adams is still GM it could go badly enough, and enough contracts could run out, for new management. With this they can draft 8th for another three years before the next chance for change even opens.

 

[Sabresfansince1980]

It’s actually much, much worse.

The clock for pressure just resets to 0. Adams isn’t the GM, right? Gotta give Karmanos time. We’d be three to five years away from the next time a meaningful change could happen.

At least if Adams is still GM it could go badly enough, and enough contracts could run out, for new management. With this they can draft 8th for another three years before the next chance for change even opens.

Pretty much. It would age as well as a Maaco paint job.

 

[Der Jaeger]

Its unquestionably harder to win in the NFL than the NHL.

First off, its a roster of 53 not 23. Your coaching staff is massive. Position coaches. The Sabres have 8 coaches. The Bills have 28.

You can have a good QB and good coach and not win. Look at Cincinatti last year. A top 5 QB and a top 10 coach....failed miserably. You can't just be good at one thing. 14 out of 32 (used to be 12) teams make the playoffs vs 16 out of 32.

The only thing I'd argue is easier in the NFL is that you don't really have to worry about player costs because the massive TV contracts make every NFL team profitable before anyone steps in the door.

In the NHL, if you assembled an average team and a good coach, you would make the playoffs reasonably consistently. Nashville was the king of this, OK team, good coaching, playoffs most years.

I would much rather start a NHL team from scratch than a NFL team.

So I agree with you and disagree with you.

In the NFL, everything you said makes it difficult to win a Super Bowl. Making the playoffs is owner-GM-Head Coach-Franchise QB. I don't know a franchise which had those and struggled to make the playoffs. Cincinnati is an aberration.

Houston sucked in a lot of ways and still made it. Denver added a good rookie QB and made it. Aside from Cincinnati, I can't another franchise QB that sat home January.

Putting all the pieces together around those four is much harder to do than assemble a championship caliber hockey team, so agree.

 

[Beerz]

I don't even know how they could sell Karmanos or Forton as GM ... They have been a part of the failure.

No new voices.

You might as well keep Adams as GM. You're not buying any grace with a move like that.

Either Adams stays as GM or he is moved up with an outside GM is my guess.

 

[Ace]

So I agree with you and disagree with you.

In the NFL, everything you said makes it difficult to win a Super Bowl. Making the playoffs is owner-GM-Head Coach-Franchise QB. I don't know a franchise which had those and struggled to make the playoffs. Cincinnati is an aberration.

Houston sucked in a lot of ways and still made it. Denver added a good rookie QB and made it. Aside from Cincinnati, I can't another franchise QB that sat home January.

Putting all the pieces together around those four is much harder to do than assemble a championship caliber hockey team, so agree.

Cinci has a terrible owner and most predicted that they would screw up having an elite QB as soon as people needed to be paid.

 

[Ehran]

I don't even know how they could sell Karmanos or Forton as GM ... They have been a part of the failure.

No new voices.

You might as well keep Adams as GM. You're not buying any grace with a move like that.

Either Adams stays as GM or he is moved up with an outside GM is my guess.

I don't think Pegula would have any qualms about "selling" that sort of promotion. He doesn't seem to be too concerned with fan reactions.

 

[SundherDome]

I don't even know how they could sell Karmanos or Forton as GM ... They have been a part of the failure.

No new voices.

You might as well keep Adams as GM. You're not buying any grace with a move like that.

Either Adams stays as GM or he is moved up with an outside GM is my guess.

It would be a new voice and Karmanos seems to have done well with Rochester

 

[Archie Lee]

It would be a new voice and Karmanos seems to have done well with Rochester

Karmanos has been considered for other GM roles, both before and after he joined the Sabres. Other teams do these sort of promotions (GM to POHO and Asst. GM to GM). Vegas, Colorado, Washington, and Seattle, have recently done this. I have no idea if Karmanos would be good (none of us have any idea if any person who is likely to be interested, would be any good). But I have no reason to think he would not be his own man.

 

[jc17]

I don't even know how they could sell Karmanos or Forton as GM ... They have been a part of the failure.

No new voices.

You might as well keep Adams as GM. You're not buying any grace with a move like that.

Either Adams stays as GM or he is moved up with an outside GM is my guess.

For that reason I really can't see it happening. There's more to the story of kevyn moves to a new title.

The only scenario I see that making sense is if they wanted to bring in a former player who they think will garner respect, while retaining Adams and JK. Like if they wanted Chris pronger. He's not going to be GM, assistant GM is currently taken, but shuffle around and then insert the new person. Still don't think it's likely but that would be the scenario

 

[ValJamesDuex]

Is today the day ?

 

[Der Jaeger]

Cinci has a terrible owner and most predicted that they would screw up having an elite QB as soon as people needed to be paid.

I agree. But my point is that those four are all it takes in the NFL to make the playoffs. You can do it with 3. But if you get all four, it’s a lock.

I’m not sure if such a formula exists for the NHL.

Getting from playoffs to championship is another story. For the Sabres I’d just be ok with losing a first round series at this point.

 

[May Day 10]

I agree. But my point is that those four are all it takes in the NFL to make the playoffs. You can do it with 3. But if you get all four, it’s a lock.

I’m not sure if such a formula exists for the NHL.

Getting from playoffs to championship is another story. For the Sabres I’d just be ok with losing a first round series at this point.

NHL is way more intricate to sustain success than the NFL.

NFL you need a good QB and a semi-competent coach. You hit on enough picks and you can keep sustaining the roster enough with entry-level players. If everything is broke, it takes 2 years to cleanse the cap. You can find immediate starters throughout the NFL draft.

NHL, you have to scout teenagers for years around the globe in apples-to-oranges leagues. You have to draft 18 year olds and forecast where they will be as adults both physically and mentally, and as a hockey player. Then you have to develop them and choose the right path.
An NHL team is much more sensitive to chemistry than an NFL team. You need a stratified team with players who may look the similar but they have different strengths, personalities, and fill different roles.

The cap in the NHL is also very unforgiving. You also have a generally stronger player's association with guaranteed contracts and perks like trade protection.


*Im not saying it is easy to build an NFL team. But I think if you have a good coach and QB, it is hard to mess it up completely. NHL you can't just have 1 or 2 pieces as it takes a village. Coaches are also throw away at the bottom of the food chain.

 

[Der Jaeger]

NHL is way more intricate to sustain success than the NFL.

NFL you need a good QB and a semi-competent coach. You hit on enough picks and you can keep sustaining the roster enough with entry-level players. If everything is broke, it takes 2 years to cleanse the cap. You can find immediate starters throughout the NFL draft.

NHL, you have to scout teenagers for years around the globe in apples-to-oranges leagues. You have to draft 18 year olds and forecast where they will be as adults both physically and mentally, and as a hockey player. Then you have to develop them and choose the right path.
An NHL team is much more sensitive to chemistry than an NFL team. You need a stratified team with players who may look the similar but they have different strengths, personalities, and fill different roles.

The cap in the NHL is also very unforgiving. You also have a generally stronger player's association with guaranteed contracts and perks like trade protection.


*Im not saying it is easy to build an NFL team. But I think if you have a good coach and QB, it is hard to mess it up completely. NHL you can't just have 1 or 2 pieces as it takes a village. Coaches are also throw away at the bottom of the food chain.

I agree with most of this. For the NFL, you can basically lock in playoffs if you've got a good owner, GM, HC, and QB. I don't know if there is a similar formula in the NHL.