OT: The Pittsburgher Thread: Off Season We dont need a QB Edition

[JTG]

This is the one aspect of Dart that I think may win out regardless of his skill deficiencies.
Kiffin's system helps him a lot, but I do think Dart has good poise as a QB. If we were KC or a team that could develop, I'd take him and not think twice, but I don't think we have what is necessary to get him where he'd need to be.

 

[pistolpete11]

View attachment 1008610

I know these top 30 visits aren't sacred but from this list Dart, Stewart, Golden, and Emmanwori are the ones projected closest to our pick 21. Trey Amos expected draft position is 39. Still missing I think 9 guys.

2025 Pittsburgh Steelers Pre-Draft Visit Tracker (Updating)

As we do every year, we’re keeping track of the NFL prospects the Pittsburgh Steelers host for visits ahead of this year’s draft. Teams are allotted up to 30 visitors plus local prospects who won’t count against that total. Pittsburgh consistently drafts a handful of names from each year’s list...

steelersdepot.com

Not seeing any of the DL I wanted in R1 is a bit concerning. I guess they like the depth and think they can get one of these guys later in the draft.

One guy at a few different positions around where they are picking makes it tough to get a read on what they are thinking with #21.

 

[pistolpete11]

This is the one aspect of Dart that I think may win out regardless of his skill deficiencies.
Kiffin's system helps him a lot, but I do think Dart has good poise as a QB. If we were KC or a team that could develop, I'd take him and not think twice, but I don't think we have what is necessary to get him where he'd need to be.

View attachment 1008814

It's a valid point, but he needs to beat out Maholms, Allen, Burrow, etc., not Cam Ward.

To do that, yes, you need poise, but you also need talent.

 

[Andy99]

This is the one aspect of Dart that I think may win out regardless of his skill deficiencies.
Kiffin's system helps him a lot, but I do think Dart has good poise as a QB. If we were KC or a team that could develop, I'd take him and not think twice, but I don't think we have what is necessary to get him where he'd need to be.

View attachment 1008814

Nonetheless, according to Tomlin’s friend Pete Prisco, again he has the Steelers taking Dart with their #1 pick lol…

Pete Prisco 2025 NFL mock draft 2.0: Team trades into top five for Ashton Jeanty; three QBs taken in Round 1

The Giants, however, pass on a signal-caller

www.cbssports.com

 

[JTG]

It's a valid point, but he needs to beat out Maholms, Allen, Burrow, etc., not Cam Ward.

To do that, yes, you need poise, but you also need talent.

He has talent. He has pedigree. I'm not going to take that away from him. I think he's a much better QB than Kenny coming out and that's who people like to compare him to. Dart in the pocket makes Kenny look like Dan Orlovsky.

I think Dart needs a ton of work and he won't have the support here. We need to just run with Mason and take a QB in the 4-7

 

[Pens1566]

There's too much smoke around that pick now to just ignore it. He's not KP bad, but I still wouldn't do it.

 

[pistolpete11]

He has talent. He has pedigree. I'm not going to take that away from him. I think he's a much better QB than Kenny coming out and that's who people like to compare him to. Dart in the pocket makes Kenny look like Dan Orlovsky.

I think Dart needs a ton of work and he won't have the support here. We need to just run with Mason and take a QB in the 4-7

The bar is much higher than Kenny Pickett, too.

I'm not going to pretend I'm scouted him or anything, but everything I've read on him sounds like he has a low ceiling. No argument from me on the Steelers not being the team to get the most out of him, but even if a team does, I think there are still questions whether its enough.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I don't think Dart is quite as good of a prospect as McCarthy and Nix, but I'm not seeing a lot that makes me think he's a big step down from those two either.

If you want to compare their final years in college:

-Dart: 69.3% completion%, 10.8 Y/A, 11.53 AY/A, 180.7 passer rating
-McCarthy: 72.3% completion%, 9.0 Y/A, 9.79 AY/A, 167.4 passer rating
-Nix: 77.4% completion%, 9.6 Y/A, 11.22 AY/A, 188.3 passer rating

I think Dart is a Bo Nix-lite caliber prospect, one that probably should be going in the early 2nd but probably ends up in the mid/late 1st due to a positional need. I understand the argument about the 2026 QBs seeming to be better, but what if they're not? Or what if you're not in a position to get one of the 2026 QBs?

 

[WickedWrister]

Bo Nix lite
Repeating myself here but taking a guy that would go day 2 in a normal QB draft class … stop me if you’ve seen this movie before.

I encourage people to go watch some Ole Miss film. They’re honestly a really fun and exciting offense to watch, but it is drastically different than what Arthur Smith wants to do. So. Many. Screen. Passes. And just wide open reads that Kiffin schemes up.

Exposing my bias here but Dart plays like a point guard in basketball. I prefer the raw, toolsy, gunslinger archetype.

Qb school:

 

[Empoleon8771]

Bo Nix lite
Repeating myself here but taking a guy that would go day 2 in a normal QB draft class … stop me if you’ve seen this movie before.

I encourage people to go watch some Ole Miss film. They’re honestly a really fun and exciting offense to watch, but it is drastically different than what Arthur Smith wants to do. So. Many. Screen. Passes. And just wide open reads that Kiffin schemes up.

Exposing my bias here but Dart plays like a point guard in basketball. I prefer the raw, toolsy, gunslinger archetype.

Qb school:

View attachment 1008879

Do you want to be drafting a QB based on what Arthur Smith wants to do when it seems pretty likely that Smith will leave for a better job in the near future? Especially when Dart would almost definitely be getting a redshirt year this year.

Don't disagree with your analysis there, just commenting on that one part.

 

[bigdaddyk88]

There's too much smoke around that pick now to just ignore it. He's not KP bad, but I still wouldn't do it.

What smoke? Its more likely they are trying to build trade value at 21 hoping someone trades back in to the 1st round for Dart.

 

[Shaftception]

I'd disagree heavily with a Dart selection, in the 3rd as a project at the earliest maybe, but I have no confidence anything but a sure bet will ever develop here.

Anyone trying to convince themselves of a Dart future needs to factor in the reality of Tomlin putting handcuffs on any QB brought in to this team barring a veteran he respects (Ben, Wilson, Rodgers, etc.) and he won't be taking them off for years. That's not conducive to developing a modern QB talent. And Tomlin isn't going anywhere anytime soon.

So whatever QB they do take next they purport to be the future of the team, I personally won't have any confidence in the pick barring the player being a sure thing consensus talent with at least one if not multiple "can't teach" attributes about them that are Tomlin proof.

For example, Ben's height/build and arm strength.

No more 24 year old Kenny Pickett "most NFL ready" cope projects with noodle arms. This coaching staff will never develop a project, there's no modern offensive intelligence in this organization.

 

[pistolpete11]

I don't think Dart is quite as good of a prospect as McCarthy and Nix, but I'm not seeing a lot that makes me think he's a big step down from those two either.

If you want to compare their final years in college:

-Dart: 69.3% completion%, 10.8 Y/A, 11.53 AY/A, 180.7 passer rating
-McCarthy: 72.3% completion%, 9.0 Y/A, 9.79 AY/A, 167.4 passer rating
-Nix: 77.4% completion%, 9.6 Y/A, 11.22 AY/A, 188.3 passer rating

I think Dart is a Bo Nix-lite caliber prospect, one that probably should be going in the early 2nd but probably ends up in the mid/late 1st due to a positional need. I understand the argument about the 2026 QBs seeming to be better, but what if they're not? Or what if you're not in a position to get one of the 2026 QBs?

I think "If not him then who?" is the wrong question to be asking. The question that needs to be answered is "Is he good enough to eventually win a championship with?"

That becomes less and less critical the deeper into the draft you go, but 1st round picks are important. You need to find difference makers. Naturally, you aren't going to hit on every one, but you need to do your best. I don't think Bo Nix-lite is worth a 1st round pick, but YMMV.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I think "If not him then who?" is the wrong question to be asking. The question that needs to be answered is "Is he good enough to eventually win a championship with?"

That becomes less and less critical the deeper into the draft you go, but 1st round picks are important. You need to find difference makers. Naturally, you aren't going to hit on every one, but you need to do your best. I don't think Bo Nix-lite is worth a 1st round pick, but YMMV.

I think this is a mistaken thought to have, because if you're going to require any QB you draft to be a Mahomes caliber guy, you're never going to end up drafting a QB.

I have zero issues passing on Dart, but continuously passing on QBs because you don't feel they're "championship upside" is how you end up just not drafting a QB IMO.

 

[cookthebooks]

if jaxon dart is a hall of fame qb id be happy with the steelers drafting him

 

[xlm34]

I feel like the Dart round one thing is more media driven than anything, but I also felt that way about Nix and Penix and they ended up going in the top half of a significantly better first round so who knows.

I’m just hoping the Steelers stay away. He’s a worse prospect than Pickett imo. Dart is a raw prospect with not good enough upside.

 

[pistolpete11]

I think this is a mistaken thought to have, because if you're going to require any QB you draft to be a Mahomes caliber guy, you're never going to end up drafting a QB.

I have zero issues passing on Dart, but continuously passing on QBs because you don't feel they're "championship upside" is how you end up just not drafting a QB IMO.

Is that not the goal here?

Continuously overdrafting the Pickett's of the world hoping they magically find some untapped talent is a road to nowhere.

A lot needs to go right to find a Mahomes, but you need to find a guy that is at least talented enough where that is a possibility. Bite the bullet and pay the price to land a QB when a worthy one is available like the Chiefs did with Mahomes or the Bills did with Allen. They are setup to do that in 2026. Maybe the 2026 QB Class will go belly up before we get there, but to jump the gun for Jaxson Dart? Hard pass.

 

[Peat]

I think this is a mistaken thought to have, because if you're going to require any QB you draft to be a Mahomes caliber guy, you're never going to end up drafting a QB.

I have zero issues passing on Dart, but continuously passing on QBs because you don't feel they're "championship upside" is how you end up just not drafting a QB IMO.

I think it's more you find yourself taking high reward high risk gambles than never taking a QB. Pretty much not taking a QB unless you've traded up to the top 10-ish, or taking raw toolsy guys later on. I don't know that Jordan Love is going to quite pan out once he's settled into the league, but him. Which I guess maybe says Milroe, but I think he's far too raw. Like that ain't a steak, that's a cow.

It's about asking yourself is they hit their reasonable ceiling, who are they? Since peeps have been mentioning last year, I think JJ McCarthy is a very interesting comp for Dart because

a) College system makes the evaluation hard
b) moxie and winning record a big part of the draw
c) Athletic but not overwhelmingly so

I could talk myself into McCarthy having the possible traits for high reward because it sounded like he was that bit more athletic, and because his college system did still put the ball in his hands with non-open WRs and he'd perform - he performed really well on money downs. Plus a lot of praise for his ability to play out of structure.

Dart... I think if Dart reaches his reasonable ceiling, he's something like Baker Mayfield and Jalen Hurts. Respectable starter who'll get you wins if the rest of the team is good enough. Loved by those around him. But unmistakably not in the elite QB conversation. Interesting player to pick up on a discount when you've got a QB but don't believe in him enough to rest it all on him. Not so interesting as a bet on a franchise QB.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Is that not the goal here?

Continuously overdrafting the Pickett's of the world hoping they magically find some untapped talent is a road to nowhere.

A lot needs to go right to find a Mahomes, but you need to find a guy that is at least talented enough where that is a possibility. Bite the bullet and pay the price to land a QB when a worthy one is available like the Chiefs did with Mahomes or the Bills did with Allen. They are setup to do that in 2026. Maybe the 2026 QB Class will go belly up before we get there, but to jump the gun for Jaxson Dart? Hard pass.

But who is advocating for drafting the Picketts of the world? I just think the mindset of "we're only drafting a QB if they're top-10 caliber" is misguided.

If you view anyone who isn't Mahomes as "overdrafting Picketts of the world", there won't be a QB that fits your criteria for drafting.

I think it's more you find yourself taking high reward high risk gambles than never taking a QB. Pretty much not taking a QB unless you've traded up to the top 10-ish, or taking raw toolsy guys later on. I don't know that Jordan Love is going to quite pan out once he's settled into the league, but him. Which I guess maybe says Milroe, but I think he's far too raw. Like that ain't a steak, that's a cow.

This is something I can get more behind, but I really get the impression that a ton of fans on here are basically "I'm not drafting a QB unless they're top-10 pick caliber". How many people here have said they are a flat out no on Milroe?

I think there is a big section here that views it as basically "I'm not drafting a QB unless I'm getting Mahomes", but if they're never in a position to get Mahomes, what exactly do you do? Just keep kicking the can down the road? I just don't think that's a good idea.

This isn't an argument for drafting Dart, it's more of a general argument about the plans for the Steelers to get a QB in the future. I think Steelers fans are being a bit too much of "choosing beggars" with the QB situation.

 

[pistolpete11]

I think it's more you find yourself taking high reward high risk gambles than never taking a QB. Pretty much not taking a QB unless you've traded up to the top 10-ish, or taking raw toolsy guys later on. I don't know that Jordan Love is going to quite pan out once he's settled into the league, but him. Which I guess maybe says Milroe, but I think he's far too raw. Like that ain't a steak, that's a cow.

It's about asking yourself is they hit their reasonable ceiling, who are they? Since peeps have been mentioning last year, I think JJ McCarthy is a very interesting comp for Dart because

a) College system makes the evaluation hard
b) moxie and winning record a big part of the draw
c) Athletic but not overwhelmingly so

I could talk myself into McCarthy having the possible traits for high reward because it sounded like he was that bit more athletic, and because his college system did still put the ball in his hands with non-open WRs and he'd perform - he performed really well on money downs. Plus a lot of praise for his ability to play out of structure.

Dart... I think if Dart reaches his reasonable ceiling, he's something like Baker Mayfield and Jalen Hurts. Respectable starter who'll get you wins if the rest of the team is good enough. Loved by those around him. But unmistakably not in the elite QB conversation. Interesting player to pick up on a discount when you've got a QB but don't believe in him enough to rest it all on him. Not so interesting as a bet on a franchise QB.

Well said.

 

[pistolpete11]

But who is advocating for drafting the Picketts of the world? I just think the mindset of "we're only drafting a QB if they're top-10 caliber" is misguided.

Anybody who is advocating for drafting Dart.

You can disagree, but it's very rare to win a Super Bowl without a top 10 QB, so I don' think it is misguided at all. Whether the guy develops into a top 10 QB is another story, but he needs to have the talent to be able to get there. Otherwise, what are we doing here? Hoping for the next Trent Dilfer or Nick Foles? If that's the hope, then you need to look somewhere else besides your 1st round pick to find him.

 

[pistolpete11]

I think there is a big section here that views it as basically "I'm not drafting a QB unless I'm getting Mahomes"

Holy strawman, Batman.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Holy strawman, Batman.

No that really seems to be what you're saying.

 

[pistolpete11]

No that really seems to be what you're saying.

A lot needs to go right to find a Mahomes, but you need to find a guy that is at least talented enough where that is a possibility.

You can disagree, but it's very rare to win a Super Bowl without a top 10 QB, so I don' think it is misguided at all. Whether the guy develops into a top 10 QB is another story, but he needs to have the talent to be able to get there.

OK.

 

[Empoleon8771]

OK.

I read your posts, they all look like "he needs to have Mahomes type of upside for me to want to draft him".

The impression I'm getting from your posts is that you only want to draft a QB that has upside like Lamar, Allen, Mahomes and a few select guys like that. The problem with that mindset is that this team will almost definitely not be bad enough to get in a position to draft someone with that kind of upside. So what do they do in the meantime, just keep kicking the can down the road?

I can understand not wanting to use a 1st on Dart, I'm not sitting here pounding on the table for him. But this whole strategy of "I'm not drafting a QB unless he has championship upside" just seems like a way to not end up drafting a QB. With how high QBs are going at this point, it really seems like the Steelers will never be in a position to draft a QB based on your criteria.