OT: The Pittsburgher Thread: 5 and 2 Justin who? Hand the Fields to Wilson

[Empoleon8771]

My conclusion from watching this QB School video: this team has dogshit fundamentals and their WRs and TEs do not know how to run Smith's playbook well.

Some of these plays are set up very well, but are just completely botched because Freiermuth doesn't block the right guy, Anderson completely whiffs on his block, Pickens doesn't run the right route, Harris doesn't pick up his blocker and a bunch of other constant mistakes after mistakes. Frankly, Fields seems like the only person in this offense that isn't making a mistake, outside of that terrible decision to throw the ball on that interception.

Also these videos make me feel like Jones had a very good game last week, really nice bounceback from his horrid week 2.

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

Eh that is the grey area of those videos though. Is Pickens running a funky route for that play call or is Smith calling a version of that play call with a funky route.

JT alludes to that limitation of his analysis quite a bit.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Eh that is the grey area of those videos though. Is Pickens running a funky route for that play call or is Smith calling a version of that play call with a funky route.

JT alludes to that limitation of his analysis quite a bit.

Yeah that's entirely possible as well, especially with that game situation. A 5 yard out-route takes it to a 57 yard field goal, where what Pickens did (more like a 15 yard out route) gets it to a much more manageable field goal. Could easily attribute that both to Fields not pacing himself well and the playcall not being optimal for that play either.

I think the missed blocks that seem really constant are the bigger example of them not having the correct attention to detail.

Throughout the video, the biggest criticism of Fields given is that he left more on the table and made overly conservative decisions rather than trying to push for more. The checkdown to Harris (when he thinks he should have let it rip deep to Pickens) and the endzone throw to Austin (which was more "thrown away" than a legit shot to Austin) were both examples of that.

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

Yeah that's entirely possible as well, especially with that game situation. A 5 yard out-route takes it to a 57 yard field goal, where what Pickens did (more like a 15 yard out route) gets it to a much more manageable field goal. Could easily attribute that both to Fields not pacing himself well and the playcall not being optimal for that play either.

I think the missed blocks that seem really constant are the bigger example of them not having the correct attention to detail.

Yeah the beauty of blocking being the issue is that it’s the easy one to be like “player f***ed up”. Because no coach is coaching an OL to lose reps

I think it gets tougher to tell from where we sit with the routes, play design, how they’re telling the QB to go through his reads, etc.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

The QB Coach videos are so descriptive and good, he's doing a terrific job at explaining things here.

Another few notes that he made:

1. In his opinion, that drop Pickens had was both bad route running by Pickens and also a drop by Pickens. Pickens was "lollygagging" off the line and he made it far too easy for the CB to stick with him as he cut towards the middle.
2. He also mentioned that he felt the Steelers WRs had poor attention to detail, with mentioning that completion to Miller (one where the Chargers guy missed the tackle) had both WRs on that side of the field a good 2 yards before the 1st down marker on their routes. If not for the missed tackle, that's likely a 2 yard pass that ends up a 4th and 2.
3. The QB coach says some iteration of "this is a bizarre play call" or "I have no clue what they're running" about once every 2 minutes

He was very complementary of Fields' performance but also taking some shots at the WRs and play designs.

I said the exact same thing to my buddy. If that DB makes the tackle we're all pissed he's short of the 1st down

Since the dawn of fantasy football and analytics, stats have become the be all, end all with football analysis. Well based off of stats last season, Miami looked like the best team in the AFC heading into November. Their coach is the perfect coach for the stat geek generation. But look at his team, look at how it is constructed and look how their weaknesses get exposed year after year after year.

I think you're missing the overall message that Mia is going through right now.
The fact is ANY team having it's starting QB is going to look like a mess. I mean look at the 2019 Steelers after Ben went down. It was ugly AF

 

[Empoleon8771]

Yeah the beauty of blocking being the issue is that it’s the easy one to be like “player f***ed up”. Because no coach is coaching an OL to lose reps

I think it gets tougher to tell from where we sit with the routes, play design, how they’re telling the QB to go through his reads, etc.

Yeah I think that play-action play where Fields got immediately blown up was a great example of that and how he describes it makes sense. It was both that Jones probably didn't take the right guy (both he and Daniels tried blocking the game guy) and also Harris should have evacuated the fake hand-off and just gone to block the unblocked guy. Especially considering Harris had such a clear view that he easily saw the safety come up and go unblocked.

 

[Peat]

This is a classic @Peat post lol. One sentence acknowledging the positive, followed by four paragraphs explaining why we should pump the brakes. You're not wrong, you just have a very pragmatic and sobering view of things.

There's no question the defense has led the way and will continue to be the primary reason we win or lose games this year. That's just how this team is currently constructed.

What does inspire a little bit of hope in Fields right now is that this felt like the first game he was asked to do more than just not lose the game, and he responded well. But in terms of statistical improvements, the short + intermediate accuracy and sack prevention are drastically better through 3 games.

Thank you, I think

I guess my point here is that what was said about this part of the schedule being QB proof has a lot of truth to it. We can acknowledge that while also acknowledging that, yes, Fields has improved drastically. They're both true He's doing the necessary things I and others really doubted he could do. Next step is seeing if he can sustain it. I think that is his spot now for the foreseeable.

I am curious where this leaves Wilson though, he may put on a good face but I absolutely think he'll be fuming if he's relegated to backup for the entire year. It's only a 1 year deal so who really cares, but I hope he doesn't make a big shitshow about it. He had to have known this was a possibility when they brought in another guy who was a QB1 for the past few years.

So I've been thinking about this after someone asked on reddit why there was Wilson trade talk and I think it's possible he asks for a trade. It's possible he sees this year as his last chance to stick as an NFL starter and wants to go somewhere to play.

It's possible he thinks nothing of the sort and is okay with riding this year out. But to me, that's the key here. Not whether Wilson can hack being back-up for a year, but what he thinks it means for his future.

I think you can say that the Chargers game, even with the Herbert injury, was the best execution of the type of win we’ve been led to believe Tomlin wants this season. One of the best overall since Ben retired (maybe could run the ball better).

And all 3 wins have been in that way.

I think the concern would be that it’s unclear (at best) if that makes us any closer to winning other type of games, being competitive in all circumstances, and truly contending.

I hear both of those things.

I guess wait and see. And wait and see on the latter is less about a belief that Tomlin will finally take the shackles off and let the team be a normal NFL team, but that we might be about to see an evolutionary swing in the NFL where more teams are trying to be like Tomlin teams.

 

[Empoleon8771]

So I've been thinking about this after someone asked on reddit why there was Wilson trade talk and I think it's possible he asks for a trade. It's possible he sees this year as his last chance to stick as an NFL starter and wants to go somewhere to play.

It's possible he thinks nothing of the sort and is okay with riding this year out. But to me, that's the key here. Not whether Wilson can hack being back-up for a year, but what he thinks it means for his future.

Yeah I think it makes a lot of sense for him to ask for a trade if he's not going to play, I wouldn't blame him for that one bit. He came to Pittsburgh to get a chance to show what he could do and get another starter's job, Fields playing like he has really complicates that.

They wouldn't get much for him probably, at least based on what other backup QBs go for in-season, but I'd be curious to see if they could swap him for a decent WR.

Thank you, I think

I guess my point here is that what was said about this part of the schedule being QB proof has a lot of truth to it. We can acknowledge that while also acknowledging that, yes, Fields has improved drastically. They're both true He's doing the necessary things I and others really doubted he could do. Next step is seeing if he can sustain it. I think that is his spot now for the foreseeable.

I think it's both this plus showing he can do more than game manage. The QB school video gave 2 really good examples of him having chances to really make a statement on the game that he didn't take, mostly due to him playing super cautious with the football. The difference between him being a decent game manager carried by his defense and a legitimate long-term QB1 option is stuff like him hitting Austin in the back corner for a TD rather than throwing it 5 feet out of bounds to be safe.

They're keeping the training wheels on him right now for sure, so it's not just purely Fields playing scared, but the next step in his evolution is going from "making smart reads and playing safe with the ball" to "doing that plus executing on aggressive plays when the moment calls for it".

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

Also these videos make me feel like Jones had a very good game last week, really nice bounceback from his horrid week 2.

He played very well in the two games he practiced all week and started and shit the bed when he was benched but forced to rotate in. Imagine that, coaches f***ing with a young guy produces bad results.

But Jones also needs to prep like he's going to start.

 

[WickedWrister]

Just watched the QB school video too, mostly positive of the QB while still critical of some of the play calling, execution, blocking, and a few decisions by Fields and ball placement issues.

He acknowledges Fields looks like he's playing faster, seeing the field, and being more decisive. On schedule more often than not. One of the best things that he does is driving the ball down the field and we saw a couple instances of that in the game yesterday.

Fairly points out that there were some big plays we missed out on and that the Chargers defense made mistakes throughout the game.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Just watched the QB school video too, mostly positive of the QB while still critical of some of the play calling, execution, blocking, and a few decisions by Fields and ball placement issues.

He acknowledges Fields looks like he's playing faster, seeing the field, and being more decisive. On schedule more often than not. One of the best things that he does is driving the ball down the field and we saw a couple instances of that in the game yesterday.

Fairly points out that there were some big plays we missed out on and that the Chargers defense made mistakes throughout the game.

Yeah I think it was a fair write-up, and those big plays are the difference between him being a "solid game manager" and "legitimate QB1".

I think that game was one of the best executed QB games that the Steelers have had in years. Fields doesn't have worse arm talent than any of the QBs in the past 3 years while he also adds a legitimate running threat. Even if this is all Fields is, I think this is exactly the kind of QB that Tomlin wants in his system (aka a safe system QB that you won't win a super bowl with in today's NFL). Whether Fields can go from that to "undisputed QB1" territory is up to his play.

 

[WickedWrister]

Thank you, I think

I guess my point here is that what was said about this part of the schedule being QB proof has a lot of truth to it. We can acknowledge that while also acknowledging that, yes, Fields has improved drastically. They're both true He's doing the necessary things I and others really doubted he could do. Next step is seeing if he can sustain it. I think that is his spot now for the foreseeable.

I'll concede that the Bronco's game vs a rookie QB was a smash spot for the team and Fields despite only being 2.5 point favorites. And that the Chargers D was probably undeserving of being the #1 scoring defense, especially after losing Joey Bosa on like the second play of the game. But I don't know if there is such a thing as "QB proof games" for this team, we lost to Dorian Thompson-Robinson and Bailey Zappe last year lol. Not to mention the team we play next week beat us by 3 scores in 2023.

Falcons might be 1-2 but they beat Philly and were like 10 yards away from upsetting the Chiefs last night. Kept Mahomes in check pretty much too.

 

[WickedWrister]

Yeah I think it was a fair write-up, and those big plays are the difference between him being a "solid game manager" and "legitimate QB1".

I think that game was one of the best executed QB games that the Steelers have had in years. Fields doesn't have worse arm talent than any of the QBs in the past 3 years while he also adds a legitimate running threat. Even if this is all Fields is, I think this is exactly the kind of QB that Tomlin wants in his system (aka a safe system QB that you won't win a super bowl with in today's NFL). Whether Fields can go from that to "undisputed QB1" territory is up to his play.

Yeah, Fields is playing like how I hoped Russell Wilson would play. He's cosplaying as a savvy veteran QB.

I posted this graphic before but look at where Fields is now and look where Russell Wilson was in 2023.

2023:

 

[Peat]

I'll concede that the Bronco's game vs a rookie QB was a smash spot for the team and Fields despite only being 2.5 point favorites. And that the Chargers D was probably undeserving of being the #1 scoring defense, especially after losing Joey Bosa on like the second play of the game. But I don't know if there is such a thing as "QB proof games" for this team, we lost to Dorian Thompson-Robinson and Bailey Zappe last year lol. Not to mention the team we play next week beat us by 3 scores in 2023.

Falcons might be 1-2 but they beat Philly and were like 10 yards away from upsetting the Chiefs last night. Kept Mahomes in check pretty much too.

That's the thing with the Steelers though. Playing really bad teams? Dangerous.

But playing the NFL's middle class? It shouldn't be automatic, but it basically is with the Steelers' defence at the moment. About the only time it hasn't been is with Trubisky. So QB proof is maybe a bit strong as we saw it wasn't with Trubisky, but it's really close.

 

[MrBrightside]

 

[MrBrightside]

 

[WickedWrister]

That's the thing with the Steelers though. Playing really bad teams? Dangerous.

But playing the NFL's middle class? It shouldn't be automatic, but it basically is with the Steelers' defence at the moment. About the only time it hasn't been is with Trubisky. So QB proof is maybe a bit strong as we saw it wasn't with Trubisky, but it's really close.

How are you categorizing the Colts next week? Bad or middle class?

I lean middle class as they were competitive with Houston and Green Bay, and beat a bad Chicago team. Plus it's on the road and Indy has actual fans so it will be a hostile environment unlike Atlanta.

 

[MrBrightside]

How are you categorizing the Colts next week? Bad or middle class?

I lean middle class as they were competitive with Houston and Green Bay, and beat a bad Chicago team. Plus it's on the road and Indy has actual fans so it will be a hostile environment unlike Atlanta.

I mean, Indy was a playoff team last year that probably should have beaten Houston, so I think middle class is the lowest rung you could put them. They would probably be better with Minshew than Richardson, and I like this matchup for the Steelers, but the Colts aren't bad at all.

 

[Empoleon8771]

The Colts are a pretty decent team that has an insanely raw and undeveloped QB. I think the defense could absolutely terrorize Richardson and make the game another cakewalk, but the rest of the team seems halfway decent.

 

[xlm34]

Yeah I think Richardson either lights up the defense or turns the ball over 5 times. He just doesn’t seem to have any clue where a ball is going unless he throws it 60 yards.

 

[Peat]

Harris with his arm in a sling at the facility today.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Harris with his arm in a sling at the facility today.

"I want Warren to get more carries"

*Monkey's paw curls*

 

[WickedWrister]

Corresponding move with Fautanu on IR

 

[Ryder71]

Regarding Fields, something the majority here can agree on is he's been far more efficient and far less reckless with the Football than anticipated since the trade from the Bears.

 

[T1K]

Without knowing the extent of Najee’s injury, my guess is that he will miss no games, but he will get less work that requires him to pass block