The NHL asked... should Roman Josi be in the HOF ?

tarheelhockey

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I read that a lot and don’t get it. Here’s some inductees from a random 10 years span (1985-94).

Gerry Cheevers, Bernie Federko, Bill Barber, Steve Shutt, Leo Boivin, Buddy O’Connor, Herbie Lewis, Fern Flaman, Bob Pulford, Lanny McDonald, Edgar Laprade and Harry Watson.

Roman Josi arguably have a case ahead of every single one of those. People have a lot of nostalgia about players of the past. I think it creates a misconception that the requirements to make the HoF were higher back then that they are now. The list of inductees don’t support that.

You have to remember there was 40 years less history at that time. Guys like Federko and McDonald were better candidates in the mid 80s than if they came up today. They were the 22nd and 23rd players, respectively, to cross the 1000 point mark. Whereas today there are 98. They also seemed more historically relevant at the time, Federko being at that time the player that really defined the St Louis Blues, and McDonald having one of the great “finishing his career on top” stories (which has since been overshadowed by Bourque and others). Would we induct these guys in 2024, hopefully not, but they were a bigger deal at the time.

But a lot of the guys you mention fall into a special category — the selections of the Veterans Category which lasted about a decade. It was an ill-advised attempt to induct underrated players, and ended up making some of the worst selections in the entire HHOF (Laprade being arguably the weakest player in the Hall). It would be like if we decided to go back and add Mike Peca because you know, he was a pretty big deal for a few years there.

The HHOF’s main problem is that they refuse to take a breather and let some smaller classes go in, or perhaps dip into European history rather than NHL’ers, to allow a list of legit candidates to build up. There are nearly twice as many players on a baseball team as on a hockey team, and that HOF feels no compulsion to induct even a single player unless the candidate is legitimately worthy. Meanwhile the HHOF will pull fans out of the stands to ensure they get 4 guys in there every year. There flat-out aren’t that many legit HOF’ers in a typical draft class, so they consistently induct head-scratcher candidates. You’re right, it’s been that way for a long time now, largely the doing of the Veteran’s Category but mainly a matter of just allowing too many inductees per year.
 
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tarheelhockey

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Idk man you tell me, assuming you’re a Preds fan. Has Josi really been a better defenseman than Weber? You would know better than me so I’m not going to argue with Preds fans here but from what I’ve seen I think scoring is up and OFD are getting overly rewarded in Norris voting the last 8 or so years.

Weber always seemed like far and away the better defenseman overall. The guy could very easily have 2 Norris trophies to his name and was a prototype defenseman for a decade or so. Josi is a great asset but he’s not quite the same player if you know what I mean. Not just physically, but overall impact and recognition.

One thing that will help Josi, it appears he will age a lot better than Weber who never quite got over his injuries from 2017. He was already on the decline a little by that time, and was not really the type of defenseman that thrives in the more recent NHL, but it feels like we kind of missed a chapter with Weber in Montreal with his struggles and early retirement. Josi hasn’t really experienced that decline in the first place, and knock on wood he should be healthier as well. Some players really benefit from late-career heroics, especially if they stay on one team and have that “face of the franchise” aura.
 

BruinLVGA

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Two completely different defensemen, both can be and are HHOF worthy.

909 GP 686 points vs 786 GP and 434 Points; 181 vs 96 goals.

Except nearly every Norris winner is in the Hall, plus Josi has two seasons better than his Norris winning season and if he hadn't been totally left out of one reporters top 5 he would have two Norrises.


What are your arguments against?

Why shouldn't Weber be in?
Not comparing Streit and Josi. Just saying that for sure Streit was the first non-goalie high profile Swiss player.
 
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BruinLVGA

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If he retired today, better odds than not he gets in.

Gotta judge a player on how he does in his era.

Taking away the fact his award numbers scream he's getting in, since he entered the league he ranks 2nd for goals and 3rd in points for dmen while being an all situations workhorse and good defensively.

How the hell can you leave him out?
A round of applause for this post. Well said.
 

JPT

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Jul 4, 2024
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No.

It's the hall of fame not hall of good.

Teemu Selänne should have never made into HOF too. Just makes the HOF a bad joke.
I agree. We should be textualists about this. It's the Hall of Fame, not the Hall of Good or even the Hall of Great. Only the most well-known names should be inducted, regardless of on-ice achievements.
 

HolyGhost

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What's he missing to you? He's got a Norris and a 82 and 95 point season in addition to that.
1 Norris and 2 real good season do not add up to the hall. One or two more Norris', a cup ring and gets to the 300 goals scored level than he will be considered
 

JPT

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1 Norris and 2 real good season do not add up to the hall. One or two more Norris', a cup ring and gets to the 300 goals scored level than he will be considered
He has had more than just two really good seasons. Those two seasons were elite seasons, and I would even include his season with 65pts in 69 games as being elite. He's been, at the least, really good for a decade.
 

Toby91ca

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I'm trying to think of a D-Men with five Top-5 Norris finishes who isn't in, or won't be in, or who isn't Jean-Claude Tremblay (politics), and I can't think of any. Josi getting it would absolutely not lower any bar. Larry Murphy, who is probably somewhat comparable albeit a bit worse, is already in the HHOF, and exactly no one thinks he's the worst or second worst or fifth worst D-Men in the HHOF.

Meanwhile, the totally different but also totally comparable Shea Weber just got in with exactly that, five Norris Top-5. Weber got a bit more international accolades (I reckon he had an easier road to that than Josi) and I'd probably take his career before Josi's if Josi had to retire today, but really, all I'm saying is Josi is not quite as good as an average HHOF D-Men.
Sergei Gonchar might be a good comparison, but he doesn't have a Norris win...he has 4 top 5 + a 6th, 7th and three 9 places finishes.
 
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Soundgarden

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1 Norris and 2 real good season do not add up to the hall. One or two more Norris', a cup ring and gets to the 300 goals scored level than he will be considered
Every other Norris winner in the hall says otherwise.
He's most likely going to hit 200 goals this season, which will make him around 20 in goals scored for Defensemen, he's 30th all time in points, another 80 season gets him to 22.
 
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Run the Gauntlet

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May 12, 2022
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He's got Steve Duchesne numbers with a Norris trophy but Duchesne has way better playoff numbers. Not a HOF in my opinion.
 

Habsrule

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He is 30th on the all time list for most points by a detenfeman. He is only 34 years old. If he gets another 150 career points it would put him at #16 all time. 200 career points would put him at #14.

Easily he is HOF worthy.
 

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