The Martin St Louis Thread

[Yep]

Maybe we could have a #Firesomeonealready sticky thread to channel all that energy. I prefer discussions but we also obviously need to vent and rant. And being a habs fan won't get easier until we get much further in the rebuild process (2-3 years) and start to contend.

I find the tank thread helped in that sense.

 

[Kennerback]

I see the point of the thread, but it’s such an ancillary issue. There’s just so many holes everywhere.

 

[River Meadow]

Maybe we could have a #Firesomeonealready sticky thread to channel all that energy. I prefer discussions but we also obviously need to vent and rant. And being a habs fan won't get easier until we get much further in the rebuild process (2-3 years) and start to contend.

I find the tank thread helped in that sense,

We're not allowed to have tank thread for now tho.

So we have to #FireMSL instead.

 

[HabsAddict]

If a team can be competitive some games but not others, then it's coaching.

If it's never competitive, it's players.

The Rags game was not competitive compared to the Hens game. Meaning?

Honestly, Marty has to learn that if the team can't execute what he wants, he's the problem. His zone defense does not solve goals against and is a possession nightmare. So he needs to rethink and implement a different or more thought out system based on his players abilities.

 

[1909]

If a team can be competitive some games but not others, then it's coaching.

If it's never competitive, it's players.

The Rags game was not competitive compared to the Hens game. Meaning?

Honestly, Marty has to learn that if the team can't execute what he wants, he's the problem. His zone defense does not solve goals against and is a possession nightmare. So he needs to rethink and implement a different or more thought out system based on his players abilities.

Do you think he can ? I have huge doubts.

If Marty would be honest with himself, he would quit and go back to live with his wife and kids in the US. He’s got all the millions he needs in his bank account already.

 

[HabsAddict]

Loooong time ago....

Out of university, I went to work in the manufacturing division of a well known very large multinational. We had a lot of quality problems so my mirror told me I was the smartest guy in the room and going to solve the problem.

Spend 3 months and wrote quality procedure manual. My best work. Well, my only work till then. Put it on the field, implemented it, explained it. Re-explained it, dammit, nothing was changing. It turns out my mirror lied to me. It needed a 150 IQ and an engineering degree to implement. People could not follow the multisteps. i failed.

Marty is running into the same problem.

According to my eye test and then confirmed by podcasts, Marty is trying to implement a hybrid of man-to-man just below and above our blue line while also implementing a tight zone defense if we lose possession in our zone. Without going into an entire page why it's failing, suffice to say that to work, it needs 5 Guhles defensively and 5 Josi to break out. It's just too complicated and it doesn't take into account the skill level of our players. So we get trapped for long periods and we don't have Jesus Price in nets.

Hello mounting losses. Marty failed.

So now Marty has to go back to basics and focus on what's doable given the abilities of our players, X needs a forward on the wall to pass to, Hutson needs support on the low cycle and he'll never be a crease cleaner, Savard is not carrying the puck out, Hutson is not deking 3 forwards...and the limitations go on. He has put a less restrictive zone defense or a limited man-to-man were forwards play man-to-man and defenseman keep their position. Basically a 2-1-2 all the way to the net were the center supports his wingers while one or the other winger, depending where the puck is, goes to the slot.

Regardless, whatever system Marty comes up with has to be a hell of a lot simpler or we will have a disaster of a season.

Is Marty smart enough to see his mistakes and find a solution?

Stay tuned....

 

[River Meadow]

Do you think he can ? I have huge doubts.

If Marty would be honest with himself, he would quit and go back to live with his wife and kids in the US. He’s got all the millions he needs in his bank account already.

Oh boy.

MSL getting absolutely destroyed in this thread.

 

[HabbyGuy]

Oh boy.

MSL getting absolutely destroyed in this thread.

Posting is a serious problem.

 

[HuGort]

Lack of effort is what's concerning. Pitt, LA, Ranger game this team came out flat in all.

Marty likely lost dressing room

 

[BLONG7]

If a team can be competitive some games but not others, then it's coaching.

If it's never competitive, it's players.

The Rags game was not competitive compared to the Hens game. Meaning?

Honestly, Marty has to learn that if the team can't execute what he wants, he's the problem. His zone defense does not solve goals against and is a possession nightmare. So he needs to rethink and implement a different or more thought out system based on his players abilities.

Stop blaming the individual Dmen...................when the system sucks.
Again love MSL, to a point. He is lost some nights, like he was the last game vs the Rangers............the start of the game was attrocious, and so was his personal performance.
No timeout...........no goalie change..........no nothing from behind the bench.........blink and it was 4-0

If we can hold Suxuki to be better, Caufield to be better and so on, why not MSL to develop and evolve into something better?

Marty.........do better, be better.

 

[Tyson]

Stop blaming the individual Dmen...................when the system sucks.
Again love MSL, to a point. He is lost some nights, like he was the last game vs the Rangers............the start of the game was attrocious, and so was his personal performance.
No timeout...........no goalie change..........no nothing from behind the bench.........blink and it was 4-0

If we can hold Suxuki to be better, Caufield to be better and so on, why not MSL to develop and evolve into something better?

Marty.........do better, be better.

When I watch Mailloux a Dman chase a player all the way back to the blue line I shake my head and ask...why isn't the Dman near the net playing zone?

 

[sandviper]

If a team can be competitive some games but not others, then it's coaching.

If it's never competitive, it's players.

The Rags game was not competitive compared to the Hens game. Meaning?

Honestly, Marty has to learn that if the team can't execute what he wants, he's the problem. His zone defense does not solve goals against and is a possession nightmare. So he needs to rethink and implement a different or more thought out system based on his players abilities.

Breakdowns, lack of discipline, not being prepared is all on the coaches. Even veteran coaches can be guilty of it. Remember just recently with CJ… there would be games we’d give up like back to back goals within minutes all the time. It was frustrating.

I don’t think the issue is our players (effort that is). Obviously, we need some to be better, but I think everyone wants to play well for Marty and all.

The getting trapped in our zone, for MINUTES, and generally chaos in our end, that’s all coaching. I am aware and support the fact that we are maybe just over a third of the way through our rebuild, but we shouldn’t be getting throttled like that in our zone night after night.

Despite my earlier comment about veteran coaches also making mistakes, I do think we could use one behind the bench. Perhaps more of a strategist and someone who understands zone structure.

 

[Tyson]

Breakdowns, lack of discipline, not being prepared is all on the coaches. Even veteran coaches can be guilty of it. Remember just recently with CJ… there would be games we’d give up like back to back goals within minutes all the time. It was frustrating.

I don’t think the issue is our players (effort that is). Obviously, we need some to be better, but I think everyone wants to play well for Marty and all.

The getting trapped in our zone, for MINUTES, and generally chaos in our end, that’s all coaching. I am aware and support the fact that we are maybe just over a third of the way through our rebuild, but we shouldn’t be getting throttled like that in our zone night after night.

Despite my earlier comment about veteran coaches also making mistakes, I do think we could use one behind the bench. Perhaps more of a strategist and someone who understands zone structure.

 

[Rapala]

I thought Marty got one thing right against the Rangers and that was to use Evans as a shutdown guy against their top lines.
However I don't think Gallagher has the stamina to play that role any longer.
The first goal was scored by a player coming off the bench.
Kirby Dach had no chance of catching him because of Gallagher's slow change.

 

[Yoor]

At times, then he'd wonder off and there'd be a 5 foot barrier where no hab was in there.

If you're going to battle, that's fine, but someone should be making a veeline straight for the front

All the Habs need to do now is have 2 players below the goal line on the PP to make it the envy of anyone who wants to run a terrible PP.

When your PP f***ing sucks, you do the basics. Pucks to the net, screen and get a dirty goal. Habs don't like to that. They do it and then go back to trying to be fancy.

I know most won't agree with this but i miss the days of having 2 defensemen on the PP with booming one-timers

 

[Rapala]

The getting trapped in our zone, for MINUTES, and generally chaos in our end, that’s all coaching. I am aware and support the fact that we are maybe just over a third of the way through our rebuild, but we shouldn’t be getting throttled like that in our zone night after night

This was one of the main indicators I was looking at coming into this season as a measure of progress.
So far we've actually regressed as far as I can see. It doesn't take a genius to understand how it affects our offense overall.

 

[Yoor]

I wouldn't advocate firing MSL, especially since the plan is to somewhat develop him at HC and there isn't a clear good NHL fit that's bilingual, but he's the 5th longest tenured HC in the NHL, and the only one around for longer who hasn't won a cup is Brind'Amour. Montreal (and fans) have been patient, especially considering extenuating circumstances.

Its not just on the personnel, the way the team defends under MSL has always been questionable. Examining and changing the way the team defends or bringing in a more experienced assistant/associate coach is not unreasonable.

OR the Montreal Canadiens, the most storied franchise in hockey could..you know hire the best available coach period. Not "develop" a coach wth is that?? I was open minded about MSL but not anymore, sorry. I am sure I am not alone here but we have had a string of terrible coaches for some years now and I am sick of it. I get the bi-lingual thing but it's 2024 and this league is ultra competitive so why give yourself a potential handicap right off the bat? We have a very young team and if this persists for much longer it risks creating a loser culture/mindset among the players not to mention a few years of lost quality development for our prospects.

We have talented prospects and young players...we need to get this right, this is a pivitol year.

Oh and for the record before the pro french crowd jumps down my throat..my parents are from PQ and I am fully biligual with french as my first language. It isn't about language anymore...I want to build a contender with the best coaching staff we can buy. Period.

Listening to Marty's press conference he sounds like a defeated guy.

"Tsé" - MSL

 

[Tyson]

OR the Montreal Canadiens, the most storied franchise in hockey could..you know hire the best available coach period. Not "develop" a coach wth is that?? I was open minded about MSL but not anymore, sorry. I am sure I am not alone here but we have had a string of terrible coaches for some years now and I am sick of it. I get the bi-lingual thing but it's 2024 and this league is ultra competitive so why give yourself a potential handicap right off the bat? We have a very young team and if this persists for much longer it risks creating a loser culture/mindset among the players not to mention a few years of lost quality development for our prospects.

We have talented prospects and young players...we need to get this right, this is a pivitol year.

Oh and for the record before the pro french crowd jumps down my throat..my parents are from PQ and I am fully biligual with french as my first language. It isn't about language anymore...I want to build a contender with the best coaching staff we can buy. Period.


"Tsé" - MSL

%
Too me I want the most iconic franchise to have the best coaches and I don't think we are remotely close to having upper tier quality coaches. Every GM makes mistakes and Hughes has made several.

 

[Darz]

OR the Montreal Canadiens, the most storied franchise in hockey could..you know hire the best available coach period. Not "develop" a coach wth is that?? I was open minded about MSL but not anymore, sorry. I am sure I am not alone here but we have had a string of terrible coaches for some years now and I am sick of it. I get the bi-lingual thing but it's 2024 and this league is ultra competitive so why give yourself a potential handicap right off the bat? We have a very young team and if this persists for much longer it risks creating a loser culture/mindset among the players not to mention a few years of lost quality development for our prospects.

We have talented prospects and young players...we need to get this right, this is a pivitol year.

Oh and for the record before the pro french crowd jumps down my throat..my parents are from PQ and I am fully biligual with french as my first language. It isn't about language anymore...I want to build a contender with the best coaching staff we can buy. Period.


"Tsé" - MSL

I understand your point, but you know deep down, there is no way in hell the Montreal Canadiens are ever going to have a head coach (outside of an intern situation) that isn't bi-lingual. Its just one of those things you have to accept.

 

[Yoor]

I understand your point, but you know deep down, there is no way in hell the Montreal Canadiens are ever going to have a head coach (outside of an intern situation) that isn't bi-lingual. Its just one of those things you have to accept.

Stanley cup wins have a way of making people forget about which language the coach speaks.

 

[Darz]

Stanley cup wins have a way of making people forget about which language the coach speaks.

I don't disagree with you, and would tell anyone who would listen the same thing for the past 30 or so years, but at some point you just have to accept it...3 things in life are certain...death, taxes and the Montreal Canadiens will have a bi-lingual coach

 

[BLONG7]

When I watch Mailloux a Dman chase a player all the way back to the blue line I shake my head and ask...why isn't the Dman near the net playing zone?

He has to at some point soon, realize they do not understand how to play in their own zone.............is it his decisions, or is it Robidas?
Who and what is the plan? It sure can't be a sustainable type of defence system, because for 3 years now we get hemmed 5 on 5 and make it like a PP for the other guys, and then we get picked apart.
We could have Chara and Proger back there and it wouldn't work.

I don't disagree with you, and would tell anyone who would listen the same thing for the past 30 or so years, but at some point you just have to accept it...3 things in life are certain...death, taxes and the Montreal Canadiens will have a bi-lingual coach

Sad...........and True.

 

[BLONG7]

OR the Montreal Canadiens, the most storied franchise in hockey could..you know hire the best available coach period. Not "develop" a coach wth is that?? I was open minded about MSL but not anymore, sorry. I am sure I am not alone here but we have had a string of terrible coaches for some years now and I am sick of it. I get the bi-lingual thing but it's 2024 and this league is ultra competitive so why give yourself a potential handicap right off the bat? We have a very young team and if this persists for much longer it risks creating a loser culture/mindset among the players not to mention a few years of lost quality development for our prospects.

We have talented prospects and young players...we need to get this right, this is a pivitol year.

Oh and for the record before the pro french crowd jumps down my throat..my parents are from PQ and I am fully biligual with french as my first language. It isn't about language anymore...I want to build a contender with the best coaching staff we can buy. Period.


"Tsé" - MSL

Bottom line for me, MSL can speak 5 languages, I have never cared, we need who ever our coach is to be better..............if the players can be expected to develop, then so can the coaches.

OR the Montreal Canadiens, the most storied franchise in hockey could..you know hire the best available coach period. Not "develop" a coach wth is that?? I was open minded about MSL but not anymore, sorry. I am sure I am not alone here but we have had a string of terrible coaches for some years now and I am sick of it. I get the bi-lingual thing but it's 2024 and this league is ultra competitive so why give yourself a potential handicap right off the bat? We have a very young team and if this persists for much longer it risks creating a loser culture/mindset among the players not to mention a few years of lost quality development for our prospects.

We have talented prospects and young players...we need to get this right, this is a pivitol year.

Oh and for the record before the pro french crowd jumps down my throat..my parents are from PQ and I am fully biligual with french as my first language. It isn't about language anymore...I want to build a contender with the best coaching staff we can buy. Period.


"Tsé" - MSL

Bottom line for me, MSL can speak 5 languages, I have never cared, we need who ever our coach is to be better..............if the players can be expected to develop, then so can the coaches.

 

[morhilane]

There was a late night article on Radio-Canada quoting a lots of MLS about the Dzone play. What he said:
- players are too passive and reactive instead of anticipating to kill plays
- the players to leave too much spaces
- the players aren't aggressive enough to cause errors

I think MSL reads HFBoards.

 

[Rapala]

There was a late night article on Radio-Canada quoting a lots of MLS about the Dzone play. What he said:
- players are too passive and reactive instead of anticipating to kill plays
- the players to leave too much spaces
- the players aren't aggressive enough to cause errors

I think MSL reads HFBoards.

That he finally realizes we are too passive is good.
Things will not get better until he acknowledges the fact that his team is not able to pre-cognize the type of system he wants to play.
Let's count up the players with a good sense of anticipation shall we...
Getting more aggressive at this point may actually cause the breakdowns to happen quicker it's a slippery slope.
This is all stuff we've discussed as long as two years ago.