Speculation: The coaching search continues

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PlayOn

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I love how you are so staunch about "waiting and seeing", but you've really decided that this is a good move that shouldn't be criticized, yet you have no thoughts about why it's a good move other than "if Staios made it he must think it's good and who am I to question his thinking."

I wonder why even be on a board where the purpose is to debate whether moves are good or bad, when your position is fans don't know enough to deem whether a move is good or bad.

I guess every post in every thread should be "I have no opinion but support it because if they're doing it they must have good reasons!"

That'd be fun.
No one is saying any of this.

But we are hiring Green, so it is what it is. And we all have access to his record on hockeydb. People have posted press conferences, articles, radio interviews that assess Green’s coaching style and then the next post is “best in class? No they’re just cheap”.

It isn’t much of a discussion. He might be a bad coach, he might be a good one. To have a discussion in good faith you have to acknowledge that his record coaching a mediocre at best team is not all there is to know or consider in the equation.
 

flyingfingers

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Agreed. Really don't care how the hire is perceived by fans.

It all comes down to how he runs training camp and prepares the team for next season. If he can get this group to play over .500 for the first couple months that's a win.

Desperately need to come out of the gates strong this season. Can't have the season down the drain before the new year yet again.

The win is making the playoffs. Not a good start. Not internal growth. But playoffs.

Thomas Chabot will be older at the start of next season than Karlsson was when we traded him. Tkachuk has already played more games in a Sens jersey than Mark Stone.

By NHL standards, the core of this team isn't all that young anymore.
 
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Cosmix

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booboos's article.

A paragraph that should have us thinking. the party about "seeing if something better comes along" got me...

Green was still a top candidate for the Devils job but it’s clear Fitzgerald is waiting to see if something better comes along and that’s why he granted Green permission to speak with other teams.
That was a horrible article by Garrioch. Typical though.
 

flyingfingers

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No one is saying any of this.

But we are hiring Green, so it is what it is. And we all have access to his record on hockeydb. People have posted press conferences, articles, radio interviews that assess Green’s coaching style and then the next post is “best in class? No they’re just cheap”.

It isn’t much of a discussion. He might be a bad coach, he might be a good one. To have a discussion in good faith you have to acknowledge that his record coaching a mediocre at best team is not all there is to know or consider in the equation.

Well not really.

So far, he's proven to be a bad coach. There's no real question about that. Just like there's no question about DJ Smith. Thus far in his NHL career, a bad coach.

The discussion should be what makes people think he'll turn it around and be better in Ottawa?
And the answer isn't "wins and losses in Vancouver don't matter and trust Staios."

What did you see in Vancouver or New Jersey that gives you hope?

The Lalji clip is the first positive reasoning I've heard beyond trust management. I've read he's more of a hard ass. Maybe that's what Staios was looking for.

I haven't decided it's a good move, where have I once said I like the move? Maybe try and follow along instead of making shit up about my position?

Then why respond to everyone criticizing the move saying they shouldn't criticize the move? His record in Vancouver was bad. Don't tell me it wasn't bad. His performance in New Jersey was bad, as every Devils fan on their board has said. Don't tell me that Siegenthaler was injured so we can't judge him.

If you want to wait and see, wait and see, and let others complain. You might be right and I might be wrong. We'll reconvene in March.
 
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Wallet Inspector

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Well not really.

So far, he's proven to be a bad coach. There's no real question about that. Just like there's no question about DJ Smith. Thus far in his NHL career, a bad coach.

The discussion should be what makes people think he'll turn it around and be better in Ottawa?
And the answer isn't "wins and losses in Vancouver don't matter and trust Staios."

What did you see in Vancouver or New Jersey that gives you hope?


The Lalji clip is the first positive reasoning I've heard beyond trust management.

I've read he's more of a hard ass. Maybe that's what Staios was looking for.
In fairness, the first two season in Vancouver, the Canucks were rebuilding.

Also, Vancouver's defense has been really bad on paper up until this year. We complain about our roster but we still have four top-4 calibre d-men. Vancouver basically just had Q Hughes after Tanev walked.
 

BonHoonLayneCornell

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Well we'll see. So far, we're still operating like the smallest market team in the league, with less crazy quotes.

There's a reason a large percentage of fans are already disappointed, less than a year into this ownership group.

They haven't gotten off to a strong start.

We'll see what they do in free-agency.
Well, I do hear you and everyone else. Don't get me wrong. It is uninspiring. I wouldn't have expected this to go over well no matter what. I'm just still in the mode where I think this was SS's preferred choice out of candidates willing to come there, not a pool purposely reduced by 80% because of assistant GM Scrooge McMelnyk.

I'm willing to see where it goes, and quite frankly, I've accepted that despite the kool-aid PD wanted us all to gorge on, this team is not on the cusp of greatness. It may in fact be entirely broken and need years of work to course correct.
 

flyingfingers

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In fairness, the first two season in Vancouver, the Canucks were rebuilding.

Also, Vancouver's defense has been really bad on paper up until this year. We complain about our roster but we still have four top-4 calibre d-men. Vancouver basically just had Q Hughes after Tanev walked.

I think we're in a similar stage as Vancouver was when he took over. A young team, with talent, but hasn't really come close to putting it together, especially in their own end.

So I'm not sure why Travis Green will do better here than in Vancouver. They were never good defensively during his tenure. When he left, they had the same issues we do now.

At least with guys like McLellan and Evason, they have a track record of getting teams to play a way that we want our team to play.
 

Micklebot

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Well not really.

So far, he's proven to be a bad coach. There's no real question about that. Just like there's no question about DJ Smith. Thus far in his NHL career, a bad coach.

The discussion should be what makes people think he'll turn it around and be better in Ottawa?
And the answer isn't "wins and losses in Vancouver don't matter and trust Staios."

What did you see in Vancouver or New Jersey that gives you hope?

The Lalji clip is the first positive reasoning I've heard beyond trust management. I've read he's more of a hard ass. Maybe that's what Staios was looking for.
He's proven to have been a coach of bad team, the same bad team that a proven good coach in Boudreau lead to a 18-25-0 record before getting canned last year.

Context is important, he took over a rebuilding team, the progressed as one should expect for three years under him. He didn't get it done his last two years and got fired fore it. Is that because the team tuned him out (happens to some of the best coaches out there) is it because hes a bad coach, is it because of some other factors?

I see a guy that didn't meet expectations his last year in Vancouver, otherwise the team performed about as I expected given the context (Pettersson's injury in the shortened season imo had a big impact). How much did have to do with the success and the failures of that team, I'm not sure.
 

Loach

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I think we're in a similar stage as Vancouver was when he took over. A young team, with talent, but hasn't really come close to putting it together, especially in their own end.

So I'm not sure why Travis Green will do better here than in Vancouver. They were never good defensively during his tenure. When he left, they had the same issues we do now.

At least with guys like McLellan and Evason, they have a track record of getting teams to play a way that we want our team to play.
Mar 6 2024. What was your first account? Are you pals with whutshisnutz?
 

Micklebot

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Then why respond to everyone criticizing the move saying they shouldn't criticize the move? His record in Vancouver was bad. Don't tell me it wasn't bad. His performance in New Jersey was bad, as every Devils fan on their board has said. Don't tell me that Siegenthaler was injured so we can't judge him.

If you want to wait and see, wait and see, and let others complain. You might be right and I might be wrong. We'll reconvene in March.
What I've done is provide the context lacking in some of the criticisms, if seeing additional context somehow is upsetting to you, idk what to say,
 

Sens of Anarchy

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EMO reigns supreme.

Travis Green was not 1 or 2 on my list.. but I thought he was a good candidate to have on the list. I think he has some really good traits. He'll be demanding , fair, and will expect 100% effort. He brings structure, tactics and can adapt to situations in a game. He prepares well and can breakdown the x's and o's of opponents play. He is a good communicator and builds trust . He uses video 1 on 1 vs embarrassing the player in a group setting.

It will be about the fit with the players as much as anything .. and the fit with management. I hope JM was part of this selection process ... I also know that fans are not in any position to gauge how good a fit the candidate is.
I think most people wanted Berube... and he wasn't coming here. McLellan .. has been around , has a lot of experience .. I don't recall anyone banging the table for him. Dean Evason I thought was a good option.. Others voiced their disapproval. Is not hiring Roy a mistake.. maybe. There was opposition there too.

Staios and co.. have made a decision after going through a process. He likely wasn't #1 on their list but he turned out to be... why.. I am willing to give the guy a chance. I don't know how the team will respond. A couple key players were still going on about DJ months after he was fired.. Green has some experience with young immature players too.
 

Senator Stanley

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BondraTime

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Like Giroux said:

“There’s no coach with a special recipe.It’s about being able to have a coach that puts in a system and us players to play the way he wants us to play. We need to be consistent in doing that. At the end of the day it’s on the players.”

Now, whether that’s Green or not we will see, but that’s who Staios and Jacques saw fit for their view of a system they want and see the team playing.

This isn’t a money thing, Green was making close to 3 million in Vancouver, he’s likely coming in somewhere around there again.
 

GCK

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Oh? Leaving DJ Smith to twist in the wind in front of the media and fans for weeks when everyone in the league knew he was a dead man walking, before the season even started, was first class?

I thought it was pretty amateur.

A lot of the early season mess could've been avoided if Andlauer had acted with any sense of urgency. He didn't, and if you sense the vibes in Sens land, he's already lost quite a bit of goodwill.
Maybe you are misinformed but Andlauer didn’t take over until September 21st. The NHL and Melnyk board cost us an entire offseason
 

flyingfingers

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He's proven to have been a coach of bad team, the same bad team that a proven good coach in Boudreau lead to a 18-25-0 record before getting canned last year.

Context is important, he took over a rebuilding team, the progressed as one should expect for three years under him. He didn't get it done his last two years and got fired fore it. Is that because the team tuned him out (happens to some of the best coaches out there) is it because hes a bad coach, is it because of some other factors?

I see a guy that didn't meet expectations his last year in Vancouver, otherwise the team performed about as I expected given the context (Pettersson's injury in the shortened season imo had a big impact). How much did have to do with the success and the failures of that team, I'm not sure.

Bruce Boudreau had a 50-40-13 record in his time in Vancouver. Boudreau took over from Green when the Canucks were 8-15-2, and had a 32-15-10 record the rest of that season.

Don't you remember "Bruce there it is!"?

In the 1.5 seasons pre-Boudreau, Green had a 31-44-6 record.

So Boudreau, despite not being able to make it through a POHO and GM change, actually did quite a bit better with the same "bad" team.

And I don't think Boudreau is anything to write home about. I wouldn't have hired him for this job either. Especially not with some of the other candidates who were available.
 

Micklebot

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Bruce Boudreau had a 50-40-13 record in his time in Vancouver.

In the 1.5 seasons pre-Boudreau, Green had a 31-44-6 record.

So Boudreau, despite not being able to make it through a POHO and GM change, actually did quite a bit better with the same "bad" team.

And I don't think Boudreau is anything to write home about. I wouldn't have hired him for this job either.
Why was Boudreau so bad in year two? Wax his .424 pts % the POHO and GM's fault?
 

flyingfingers

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Why was Boudreau so bad in year two? Wax his .418 pts % the POHO and GM's fault?

The distraction of Rutherford publicly musing how long he'd keep Boudreau around the summer before that year certainly didn't help, no.

But, I think that .418% pts % is evidence that Boudreau isn't a great fit to be a head coach in this league anymore. And as far as I know, he hasn't gotten a job since. And he probably won't.

Which is why I'm questioning why the Senators decided to hire a coach who did even worse?

I'm certainly not arguing that Boudreau would be a better fit for Ottawa than Green. I'm arguing that a guy like Evason, who has 144-73-27 record would have. Or Todd McLellan, who's had 10 winning NHL seasons.
 

BondraTime

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Wouldn’t surprise me to see Jason King brought in as an assistant, not sure if Minny will be keeping the same bench with a new head coach
 

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Why was Boudreau so bad in year two? Wax his .424 pts % the POHO and GM's fault?

Goaltending.

Demko got injured and only played 32 games. Had a .903 SV%, well below his career average.

More importantly, Martin and Delia provided Korpisalo/Forsberg-esque goaltending in his absence.

Martin had a .871 SV% in 29 games and Delia had a .882 SV% in 20 games.

Boudreau was a far better coach than Green ever was in Vancouver.
 

SENATOR

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Green is the worst coach after DJ In this league. Just a garbage thrift choice. You get what you pay for. That's why Canadian teams do not win Stanley Cups anymore. Canucks had no system and never played a structured game. When Green was promoted in NJ, the head office almost threw up with disgust after a few games. Winning only 8 games. TG will be a walking disaster. He is not smart enough to be coaching in NHL.
 

Burrowsaurus

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Mar 20, 2013
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Agreed. Really don't care how the hire is perceived by fans.

It all comes down to how he runs training camp and prepares the team for next season. If he can get this group to play over .500 for the first couple months that's a win.

Desperately need to come out of the gates strong this season. Can't have the season down the drain before the new year yet again.
Well yeah that’s the bare minimum even for any team. Don’t be out of it by the new year
 
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