The Case for Tyler Bozak: All Tyler Bozak Discussion Here

[Menzinger]

Seguin and Getzlaf are fully capable of producing at high levels with whomever they play with. Its proven with a considerable amount of data that Bozak can't produce away from Kessel. The comparison can't be made in the slightest.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

Seguin and Getzlaf are fully capable of producing at high levels with whomever they play with. Its proven with a considerable amount of data that Bozak can't produce away from Kessel. The comparison can't be made in the slightest.

Who cares, he is producing. When he and Kessel produce, we enhance our chances of winning games exponentially.

Further, I doubt Seguin or Getzlaf produce at the same without Benn or Perry. To suggest they would, would infer Benn and Perry are not elite players.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Who cares, he is producing. When he and Kessel produce, we enhance our chances of winning games exponentially.

Further, I doubt Seguin or Getzlaf produce at the same without Benn or Perry. To suggest they would, would infer Benn and Perry are not elite players.

The point being made in case you missed was that comparing Bozak to Getzlaf is a laugh and a half.

 

[pcruz]

Seguin and Getzlaf are fully capable of producing at high levels with whomever they play with. Its proven with a considerable amount of data that Bozak can't produce away from Kessel. The comparison can't be made in the slightest.

To be fair, neither has had to produce without the great wingers.

Getzlav has always had Perry, and Selanne, and Ryan, etc...

Seguin had a career high 67 points in Boston with the likes of Lucic, Bergeron, Marchand, Kreijci and Horton.

Since being paired up with Benn, and now also Spezza, he's picked up his scoring as well.

While it's ludicrous to compare Bozak to Seguin or Getzlav, I don't see where the comparison was made. The situations the players are in were compared, but not the players themselves.

The statement was:

All Centers with points play with good wingers.

Not sure why Bozak is the exception to this rule, it's a tiring argument.

Should Getzlaf be given an asterisk because he has played with Perry his entire career?

Should Seguin's stats be asterisked because he plays with Benn?

 

[Grant]

Bozak had a losing faceoff record last year lol, this is really reaching.

Last years faceoff stats are irrelevant since I was talking about the year before that.

 

[QMJHLfollower]

The Bozak hate on Leafs board is unvelibable.

The guy is playing very good hockey for us, he's one of the bright spot on our roster and for unknow reasons, people complain about him.

He's a legit top 6 center that makes our team a lot better then if he was not playing.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

To be fair, neither has had to produce without the great wingers.

Getzlav has always had Perry, and Selanne, and Ryan, etc...

Seguin had a career high 67 points in Boston with the likes of Lucic, Bergeron, Marchand, Kreijci and Horton.

Since being paired up with Benn, and now also Spezza, he's picked up his scoring as well.

While it's ludicrous to compare Bozak to Seguin or Getzlav, I don't see where the comparison was made. The situations the players are in were compared, but not the players themselves.

The statement was:

No comparison was made, it was a strawman response to make it seem like it was.

The point I was making was even a Gretzky had a Kurri to play with, all productive centers play with elite talent.

That was the point, good of you to catch on.

 

[ULF_55]

http://stats.hockeyanalysis.com/

Go to player stats and search up whichever player, then you can filter by as many years as you want. Besides this, Bozak's GA/60 rises significantly without Kessel, and his GF/20 falls quite a bit.

In the last 7 years, Bozak has 11 ES points without Kessel, 3 goals and 8 assists.

I got 12 points in 6 years.

Bozak|With Kessel|Without Kessel
Points|115|12
Minutes|3816|761
PtsPerMinPlayed|0.0301|0.0158

So he scores twice as much with Kessel. Is there any reason that isn't expected? No. Kessel is the best offensive player on the Leafs.

Now that is just a 1000 feet view of the results.

We know that Bozak is used for defensive zone starts, both at regular strength and on the penalty kill. We know that Kessel is not someone that is put out for defensive zone draws, unless it is his regular line.

Of those 761 minutes without Kessel how many were a defensive zone draw?

I'm guessing there are stats that show how many of those minutes were started in the defensive zone?

 

[Hockey Talker29]

If there was discernible proof that Bozak elevates the play of those around him, rather than just gliding along with it, then he would receive a lot more credit.

The fact is, there is actually no evidence that he elevates anyone's play. Which is why he has received this criticism for years.

With that being said, he's elevating some key parts of his game this year, and he's producing at the point rate that I would require as Kessel's center.

I'm not going to criticize him while he's play well.

 

[AuGsY]

70 pt pace last year, nearly PPG pace this year while being one of the top face-off guys in the league AND hes signed under a reasonable 4.2m cap hit.

Compared to some of the other players/contracts we have(cough clarkson), Bozak has been a blessing in disguise.

 

[Durrr]

I got 12 points in 6 years.

Bozak|With Kessel|Without Kessel
Points|115|12
Minutes|3816|761
PtsPerMinPlayed|0.0301|0.0158

So he scores twice as much with Kessel. Is there any reason that isn't expected? No. Kessel is the best offensive player on the Leafs.

Now that is just a 1000 feet view of the results.

We know that Bozak is used for defensive zone starts, both at regular strength and on the penalty kill. We know that Kessel is not someone that is put out for defensive zone draws, unless it is his regular line.

Of those 761 minutes without Kessel how many were a defensive zone draw?

I'm guessing there are stats that show how many of those minutes were started in the defensive zone?

While this is true, the pk would not be included in these stats. Second, even when Bozak is out on a draw, as soon as the draw is taken and possession is gained, either kessel comes on or bozak comes off , so i doubt its a huge amount of these minutes. Either way, i originally posted these stats in reaponce to a poster saying he can play and produce anywhere in yhe line up, which is simply at the very least very unproven. Right now all we know is that he can produce with Kessel, and honestly who can't?

 

[Peasy]

While this is true, the pk would not be included in these stats. Second, even when Bozak is out on a draw, as soon as the draw is taken and possession is gained, either kessel comes on or bozak comes off , so i doubt its a huge amount of these minutes. Either way, i originally posted these stats in reaponce to a poster saying he can play and produce anywhere in yhe line up, which is simply at the very least very unproven. Right now all we know is that he can produce with Kessel, and honestly who can't?

He doesn't win every single face off...

 

[Durrr]

If there was discernible proof that Bozak elevates the play of those around him, rather than just gliding along with it, then he would receive a lot more credit.

The fact is, there is actually no evidence that he elevates anyone's play. Which is why he has received this criticism for years.

With that being said, he's elevating some key parts of his game this year, and he's producing at the point rate that I would require as Kessel's center.

I'm not going to criticize him while he's play well.

Agreed, however his 5-5 play is actually worse th en last year. 6 es points, 1 goal and 2 primary assists. His offense on the power play has increased though, which is a step in the right direction.

 

[ULF_55]

Agreed, however his 5-5 play is actually worse th en last year. 6 es points, 1 goal and 2 primary assists. His offense on the power play has increased though, which is a step in the right direction.

He has 10 even strength points and 1 short handed point.

He has 8 PP Points.

http://www.nhl.com/ice/playerstats....ASALL&sort=evenStrengthPoints&viewName=points

 

[realgoodleafs]

He has 10 even strength points and 1 short handed point.

He has 8 PP Points.

http://www.nhl.com/ice/playerstats....ASALL&sort=evenStrengthPoints&viewName=points

Must mean he has 4 points at 4v4?

 

[Cap'n Flavour]

Must mean he has 4 points at 4v4?

ENG goal last game, assist to Polak's ENG the game before, and presumably 2 points 4v4?

 

[Durrr]

He has 10 even strength points and 1 short handed point.

He has 8 PP Points.

http://www.nhl.com/ice/playerstats....ASALL&sort=evenStrengthPoints&viewName=points

He only has 6 ES 5-5 points, unless they are including 4-4?

 

[Durrr]

ENG goal last game, assist to Polak's ENG the game before, and presumably 2 points 4v4?

Yeah, not sure what NHL.com is doing but 6-5 is not even strength, which he has 2 points.

 

[Cor]

He only has 6 ES 5-5 points, unless they are including 4-4?

4 on 4 is even strength.

6 on 5 is even strength as well

 

[Cor]

Yeah, not sure what NHL.com is doing but 6-5 is not even strength, which he has 2 points.

6 on 5 is considered even strength

 

[Durrr]

He doesn't win every single face off...

Who said he did? I just said he had a losing record last season, far from being a faceoff wiz that wins us game 7 due to this ability.

 

[Cor]

Seguin and Getzlaf are fully capable of producing at high levels with whomever they play with. Its proven with a considerable amount of data that Bozak can't produce away from Kessel. The comparison can't be made in the slightest.

What data?

Ever since he has been in the league he has been with Kessel. There is minimal time to look at Bozak away from Kessel unless you take into account SH time, which would be ridiculous.

JVR - Bozak - Clarkson were a very solid line when they were together for short games. Not sure how much they finished, but they were around the net and had chances.

Bozak is arguably at his best on the PK. Away from Kessel.

In fact, I'd say if you put Bozak on the 2nd PP, it would produce more.

 

[AustonMitchWilly]

I got 12 points in 6 years.

Bozak|With Kessel|Without Kessel
Points|115|12
Minutes|3816|761
PtsPerMinPlayed|0.0301|0.0158

So he scores twice as much with Kessel. Is there any reason that isn't expected? No. Kessel is the best offensive player on the Leafs.

Now that is just a 1000 feet view of the results.

We know that Bozak is used for defensive zone starts, both at regular strength and on the penalty kill. We know that Kessel is not someone that is put out for defensive zone draws, unless it is his regular line.

Of those 761 minutes without Kessel how many were a defensive zone draw?

I'm guessing there are stats that show how many of those minutes were started in the defensive zone?

Does this include points of which he scored when Kessel did not register for a goal/assist? Or points in games where he may have been paired with kessel but kessel was not on the ice at that time?

 

[Semantics]

Who cares, he is producing. When he and Kessel produce, we enhance our chances of winning games exponentially.

Actually, Bozak leads the Leafs in points during losses.

 

[BorntoLose]

Actually, Bozak leads the Leafs in points during losses.

makes sense if Kessel doesnt score we usually lose, and Bozak is 2nd in team scoring.