The 2024-2025 Roster Thread

[MOGlLNY]

As we are playing a bit better after the depths of the losing streak, I think its time to accept reality a bit. We aren't making the playoffs this year. The hole is too big, the roster isn't good enough to recover.

Short term, I think the TDL is pretty obvious:

You move on from your pending UFAs and extract value. That's Greenway, Zucker, Joker if anyone wants him. I'd be open to bringing Zucker back in July....but only on 1 year deals.

My big hope is that Adams is moved on from sooner rather than later. We don't need an unqualified GM wildly swinging to save his job. Interim GM title for Karmanos is fine.

I'm not interested in moving any of the RFAs, at least for futures. These are questions for the next GM.

Next summer likely depends on GM/Coach and what system they want to play. It could be a big blow up or simply a retool.

1. I'd keep Zucker, we need more of him not less. If he's willing to take quite a bit less for a 2 year deal, I'd do it. Greenway is apparently already gone so yeah I'd move on. Jokiharju just pray someone takes him.

2. Let Lindy bring in the assistants HE wants unless the PP absolutely explodes.

3. Get Adams out of the GM position, get someone with experience in. I'd honestly be fine with Karmanos as he has been in the AGM role for a LONG long time for multiple organizations. Ideally I'd like a structure where a Lombardi or Shero type is our POHO and Karmanos is the GM. But I don't think Terry is willing and if he did it would be Adams in that spot. Which changes nothing

4. Make the very obvious moves we all have been asking for for the last 2 offseasons.

 

[Fjordy]

I like the option with Jarmo if you need an experienced GM. Most of the old ex-GMs are probably not interested in this job, they are more suited to POHO status. But Terry is a staunch opponent of POHO. And other former experienced GMs (not too old) look weaker to me than Jarmo. Columbus fans say he is a pretty decent GM.

Karmanos, I have no idea what kind of GM he will be, but any new GM should have a time frame, prepare a fighting roster for next season to make the playoffs.

 

[Tatanka]

Where did JJP go>?

Busy puttting up 9 points in the last 10 games.

 

[dickiedunnwrotethis]

I like the option with Jarmo if you need an experienced GM. Most of the old ex-GMs are probably not interested in this job, they are more suited to POHO status. But Terry is a staunch opponent of POHO. And other former experienced GMs (not too old) look weaker to me than Jarmo. Columbus fans say he is a pretty decent GM.

Karmanos, I have no idea what kind of GM he will be, but any new GM should have a time frame, prepare a fighting roster for next season to make the playoffs.

Jarmo is a mixed bag.

The Good: A solid resume at the draft, particularly with Russians. The ability to extract value in trades while under trying circumstances.

The Bad: With the exception of a few years under Torts he wasn't able to build any kind of team identity (and I give Torts the lion's share of the credit for that). Sabres desperately need someone who can forge this team an identity. He also failed to manifest a player-friendly culture, particularly with younger players. Unnecessarily squeezing RFAs would be one example. Hiring Babcock would be a another; one that revealed an egregious disconnect with player expectations. Buffalo can't afford that. We don't have palm trees. And (largely unfairly) there's the lingering stink of the Eichel affair.

The Ugly: Jarmo and free agency. No sense of team-building or salary cap management, just spending like a sailor on leave after 6 months at sea. Small market teams can't afford to make those kinds of mistakes.

I don't think we need a GM with experience, we just need a good one. Plently of good first time GMs out there and plently of bad experienced GMs as well. We just need to separate the wheat from the chaff, although with this ownership that seems like a Herculean task.

 

[Fjordy]

Jarmo is a mixed bag.

The Good: A solid resume at the draft, particularly with Russians. The ability to extract value in trades while under trying circumstances.

The Bad: With the exception of a few years under Torts he wasn't able to build any kind of team identity (and I give Torts the lion's share of the credit for that). Sabres desperately need someone who can forge this team an identity. He also failed to manifest a player-friendly culture, particularly with younger players. Unnecessarily squeezing RFAs would be one example. Hiring Babcock would be a another; one that revealed an egregious disconnect with player expectations. Buffalo can't afford that. We don't have palm trees. And (largely unfairly) there's the lingering stink of the Eichel affair.

The Ugly: Jarmo and free agency. No sense of team-building or salary cap management, just spending like a sailor on leave after 6 months at sea. Small market teams can't afford to make those kinds of mistakes.

I don't think we need a GM with experience, we just need a good one. Plently of good first time GMs out there and plently of bad experienced GMs as well. We just need to separate the wheat from the chaff, although with this ownership that seems like a Herculean task.

Well, I don't know, the team was in the playoffs for half of his tenure. I'm not saying he's perfect, I just think he's okay. Columbus is a small market team too, Babcock was a big mistake. He's experienced, good negotiator, he's not afraid to make deals, I think he's made a lot of good deals. I trust the opinion of Columbus fans that he's a good GM.

Who's going to look for that GM? Terry? What if he hires the wrong rookie again or, God forbid, Benning or something.

I think Jarmo is okay for me, if you look at people with experience, and a rookie GM should hire a POHO, which we don't have.

My best option is to hire a POHO or an advisor like Lombardi, Dudley, Wilson or Holland and have him interview potential GMs. Of course, it probably won't be an experienced GM, but I'm okay with that, as long as it's the right one.

Option two, when Terry is categorically against hiring a POHO/advisor and wants to hire a GM himself. Here I'm okay with hiring Jarmo, because I think he's a viable option with experience on a small team in a small market, plus all the other pluses I listed earlier, plus the opinion of Columbus fans, which I trust.

There's also an internal hire, which seems quite real because of Terry. Karmanos is a possibility, but I have no idea what kind of GM he'll be or how tied into this stupid "kids should make the playoffs and develop with the kids" plan he is.

 

[Butt Ox]

So circling back around to Rasmussen - if Greenway is gone, he would be a size and PKing replacement there who plays center. Yes, he's got kinda lead feet and given that they keep preaching pace, tempo and speed it's an odd move. I just don't want to see what they would swing to make that happen. *sigh*

It works for getting bigger and such, but doesn't work for value if they're doing something like Quinn for him IMO. Also, not sure why the Wings would be moving on there now that he's finally rounded into usefulness.

I get how some can feel a magic bean vibe but Rasmussen would have to be more than a bigger Krebbs (leaving us wishing they were better suited for their role), and ideally more than a fwd version of Power (love what you do well and lacking in essential areas). Like you, I can't see a value deal between the two clubs either. Nothing palatable.

I saw the stomping guy being floated as a possibility too. No interest for sure.

 

[slip]

The important thing to remember is last week everyone was panicking after the Sabres crashed to the bottom of the conference standings.

Well a week and three straight wins later, we're.....sitting at the bottom of the conference.

 

[Fjordy]

The important thing to remember is last week everyone was panicking after the Sabres crashed to the bottom of the conference standings.

Well a week and three straight wins later, we're.....sitting at the bottom of the conference.

This is payback for the terrible streak and Adams' inaction for at least several seasons. It's strange that no one told him how to properly build a team and how to properly develop kids.

 

[Fjordy]

I don't know, Detroit fans on the main boards are always talking about some Petes who never makes mistakes with insider tips (maybe he is somehow connected). We'll see what happens, but I wouldn't be surprised to see some kind of deal where Terry ends up saving money in the long run. We haven't thought of that.

 

[Djp]

This is how we got into this mess

The NHL is not a developmental league.

If the kids can’t earn a NHL spot there are tons of lower leagues for them. This is a professional league about winning at a professional level

Unless you are McDavid or Eichel, you need some time having NHL experience in order for gou to develop. Its very very rare for a player to come in and fo well from nhl games

Vets keeping rookies down is utter BS. On the surface vet A is the prospect B low bar, but their high bar is much higher but they timr to adjust so their rookie year might be below vet B buy yr 2 is better if they get 40 games in yr 1.

I'd rather give the kids in tochrster some game time rather than joglinder with 3 more full years left

 

[My Cozen Dylan]

I don't know, Detroit fans on the main boards are always talking about some Petes who never makes mistakes with insider tips (maybe he is somehow connected). We'll see what happens, but I wouldn't be surprised to see some kind of deal where Terry ends up saving money in the long run. We haven't thought of that.

What does this Petes guy say about us?

 

[Zman5778]

What does this Petes guy say about us?

Speculation: - Detroit - Buffalo?

Would something around Cossa+ for Byram make sense for Buffalo? cossa hasn't really showed anything at nhl level that would make it worth moving byram imo.

forums.hfboards.com

So unless something crazy, like Larkin being traded to Buffalo, which wouldn’t be as crazy as some might think btw, it’s a good bet that Rasmussen and/or Chiarot are players Buffalo is zeroing in on, and Byrum is who Detroit is likely zeroing in on. I’m not in the business of predicting what could be added to any trade, if anything. Trades aren’t about winning and losing value. They’re about making teams better. Something those “stat watchers” never can process.

 

[Fjordy]

What does this Petes guy say about us?

I don't quite get it, but there's supposedly a lot of smoke there. Chiarot and Rasmussen are mentioned, and they'll likely be traded to Buffalo, Winnipeg or Edmonton. Detroit is also interested in Byram.

I hope it's Jets or Oilers and not us. I also don't see a reasonable deal for Byram with Detroit unless one of their top four is involved in the trade.

 

[My Cozen Dylan]

Speculation: - Detroit - Buffalo?

Would something around Cossa+ for Byram make sense for Buffalo? cossa hasn't really showed anything at nhl level that would make it worth moving byram imo.

forums.hfboards.com

Yeah…yeah that’s about what I should’ve expected.

 

[MOGlLNY]

Trading Byram for an absolute nothing burger would be so f***ing typical. I will be furious

 

[jc17]

Can they just give him back?

 

[jc17]

Trading Byram for an absolute nothing burger would be so f***ing typical. I will be furious

We've had enough tough stuff in reality.

No need to stress about hypotheticals without much smoke

 

[TehDoak]

Unless you are McDavid or Eichel, you need some time having NHL experience in order for gou to develop. Its very very rare for a player to come in and fo well from nhl games

Vets keeping rookies down is utter BS. On the surface vet A is the prospect B low bar, but their high bar is much higher but they timr to adjust so their rookie year might be below vet B buy yr 2 is better if they get 40 games in yr 1.

I'd rather give the kids in tochrster some game time rather than joglinder with 3 more full years left

Sure, players DO develop in the NHL....but not at the expense of the NHL team progressing. And certainly not in bulk like we have

We've thrown away 4 years on the 'don't block the kids' mantra. What are the success stories? Cozens? Peterka? Quinn? Power? Samuelsson? Wouldn't all of these players benefited from more veteran support? More developmental time?

The only real success of Adams development cycle is ironically Luukkonen. And in the process he likely likely set back Levi's development multiple times.

The team needs to, as a rule, use Rochester more for prospects and stop rushing them. Peterka, Quinn, Levi, Cozens and Samuelsson all likely needed more time at lower levels. Power needed a lessor role at the NHL level. And they ALL needed more veteran support.

Expecting young players just to 'figure it out' is setting them up for failure, and we have. Its been the hallmark of the Adams era.

And to circle back to your original thought....You should never worry about whether adding a veteran that addresses a need will stunt the development of a young player. Its fine to give a young player a chance in a larger role, especially if there are injuries. But...the rope you give a young player in filling a role in directly in proportion with your expectations of the season.

It's far worse for a young player to under perform and you not meet your teams goals than to meet your teams goals and a young player spends more time in the minors than you would have liked.

 

[MagnumForce2]

I don't quite get it, but there's supposedly a lot of smoke there. Chiarot and Rasmussen are mentioned, and they'll likely be traded to Buffalo, Winnipeg or Edmonton. Detroit is also interested in Byram.

I hope it's Jets or Oilers and not us. I also don't see a reasonable deal for Byram with Detroit unless one of their top four is involved in the trade.

Cozens and Byram for ?

 

[TheMistyStranger]

Well, I don't know the reason, maybe a different coach or some hidden injury, a year of decline or something else. I just look at the analytics and highlights, and he scores goals quite often while being near the net, which is very attractive.

Maybe he becomes a young Zucker

 

[Fjordy]

Cozens and Byram for ?

Compher and Chiarot

 

[PatLaFontaineASMR]

I don't know, Detroit fans on the main boards are always talking about some Petes who never makes mistakes with insider tips (maybe he is somehow connected). We'll see what happens, but I wouldn't be surprised to see some kind of deal where Terry ends up saving money in the long run. We haven't thought of that.

Just looked at some of his posts from over the summer. Detroit was supposed to be trading Olli Maata for Conor Garland. Wings were supposed to be trading their 1st for a bigger name player. Safe to say he just makes shit up.

 

[Fjordy]

Just looked at some of his posts from over the summer. Detroit was supposed to be trading Olli Maata for Conor Garland. Wings were supposed to be trading their 1st for a bigger name player. Safe to say he just makes shit up.

Yeah, I just realized what kind of guy this is, this one, whom I'm too lazy to even read, because he constantly writes long posts and I'm tired of translating all this. Although all this can be written much shorter.

Even without his inside information, I know that teams are studying each other’s players and there may be some smoke there.

 

[DJN21]

if yall wanna scapegoat me as the team "insider" and allege I've constantly been right in the past and might have connections....I'm up for the farce......

 

[Beerz]

Just looked at some of his posts from over the summer. Detroit was supposed to be trading Olli Maata for Conor Garland. Wings were supposed to be trading their 1st for a bigger name player. Safe to say he just makes shit up.

I said I wasn't going to but when I saw your post I had to get a few laughs. This guy is nothing more than Hockeyy Inssider .. throwing everything at the wall and seeing what sticks .. haha