Prospect Info: The 2023-2024 Prospects Thread Pt. 3

[credulous]

Surely there has to be enough former employees of 'Cap Geek' and 'Cap Friendly' around to hire and beef up the 'Puckpedia' site? But I suppose these sites are hard to maintain and make work financially, so it may take some time to build it up.

how many employees do you think these sites have? they make next to no money and you need inside sources to actually get the data

 

[VanJack]

I just think a lot of the negativity is a case of the Canuck faithful on HF Boards being starved for any kind of success with later round picks throughout the Benning years.

So much ink and speculation was thrown around about these picks, and with the benefit of hindsight, almost all of them flopped. Their record of drafting blueliners was so bad, it was almost laughable. So we're still so early in the Rutherford-Allvin regime, that the pessimism and skepticism is bound to linger.

Call me a hopeless optimist, but I really believe some of the kids the Canucks are unearthing in later rounds these day, do look like they have a chance to play. Obviously not all of them are going to pan out--that's just the reality of drafting 18-year old kids. But most of them are actually improving significantly in their draft-plus one seasons. And that's really all you can ask for.

 

[credulous]

So much ink and speculation was thrown around about these picks, and with the benefit of hindsight, almost all of them flopped. Their record of drafting blueliners was so bad, it was almost laughable. So we're still so early in the Rutherford-Allvin regime, that the pessimism and skepticism is bound to linger.

almost like there is a lesson to be learned here

Call me a hopeless optimist, but I really believe some of the kids the Canucks are unearthing in later rounds these day, do look like they have a chance to play. Obviously not all of them are going to pan out--that's just the reality of drafting 18-year old kids. But most of them are actually improving significantly in their draft-plus one seasons. And that's really all you can ask for.

oh nm

 

[theguardianII]

I just think a lot of the negativity is a case of the Canuck faithful on HF Boards being starved for any kind of success with later round picks throughout the Benning years.

So much ink and speculation was thrown around about these picks, and with the benefit of hindsight, almost all of them flopped. Their record of drafting blueliners was so bad, it was almost laughable. So we're still so early in the Rutherford-Allvin regime, that the pessimism and skepticism is bound to linger.

Call me a hopeless optimist, but I really believe some of the kids the Canucks are unearthing in later rounds these day, do look like they have a chance to play. Obviously not all of them are going to pan out--that's just the reality of drafting 18-year old kids. But most of them are actually improving significantly in their draft-plus one seasons. And that's really all you can ask for.

Nashville became known for creating Dmen, mostly because they drafted so many.

Allvin/Rutherford have been around going on 4 years, that is not just yesterday.

Later round picks often look better on good teams where their presence is as noted.

If reading about the two offer sheets there is reference to both having their confidence weakened by benching's for a single mistake. This has happened way too much with the Canucks and so not many bottom six guys here but some few go on to become regulars on other teams.

The Canucks really don't have too much depth. There are a lot of tweeners out there available, guys to take a chance on and see if Manny can get them into the show or are late bloomers that other team's don't have enough contract spots for, Columbus for example and quickly Utah soon.

 

[theguardianII]

Surely there has to be enough former employees of 'Cap Geek' and 'Cap Friendly' around to hire and beef up the 'Puckpedia' site? But I suppose these sites are hard to maintain and make work financially, so it may take some time to build it up.

Those sights aren't that complicated. I used to make them up with DBase back before windows.
Even using windows a rudimentary stats pages can be made.

It is the data to put into tables and the time to do it.
Judging by the "thank you's" on cap friendly there were not too many folks involved in data entry

The tables themselves are easy, making it look good maybe harder I never went there afterwards
My claim to fame was a 390 page program that did calculations on 18 different things and needed 52 separate pages of data. My program kept running out of memory and space. Drives were measured by MBytes like 10 was huge. We used a marco (a small short cut command program) to get more space, log out of a program and a macro to enter.
I even came up with stats for players, again very basic but using the number 1 as neutral and the use of +/-, which while being reviled is still relevant especially for the standings. Teams with the best +/- are at the top and that filters down to those players as well.

If you ever heard of Data Base then you know this is when they were teaching things like DOS in universities and colleges and cell phones were a brick and only weighed 3 pounds. Photo taking was a privacy issue and beer was still 30 cents at the legion. Gas was really expensive at 28 cents a litre too. Propane fuel was 9 cents a liter some days.

 

[credulous]

Those sights aren't that complicated. I used to make them up with DBase back before windows.
Even using windows a rudimentary stats pages can be made.

It is the data to put into tables and the time to do it.
Judging by the "thank you's" on cap friendly there were not too many folks involved in data entry

The tables themselves are easy, making it look good maybe harder I never went there afterwards
My claim to fame was a 390 page program that did calculations on 18 different things and needed 52 separate pages of data. My program kept running out of memory and space. Drives were measured by MBytes like 10 was huge. We used a marco (a small short cut command program) to get more space, log out of a program and a macro to enter.
I even came up with stats for players, again very basic but using the number 1 as neutral and the use of +/-, which while being reviled is still relevant especially for the standings. Teams with the best +/- are at the top and that filters down to those players as well.

If you ever heard of Data Base then you know this is when they were teaching things like DOS in universities and colleges and cell phones were a brick and only weighed 3 pounds. Photo taking was a privacy issue and beer was still 30 cents at the legion. Gas was really expensive at 28 cents a litre too. Propane fuel was 9 cents a liter some days.

i would simply use kafka + dataflow for ingest and transformation and snowflake or bigquery for storage, retrieval and modelling

 

[theguardianII]

i would simply use kafka + dataflow for ingest and transformation and snowflake or bigquery for storage, retrieval and modelling

Beyond me now. Remember it DOS. Dbase was one of the best data programs, Lotus 123, Word Perfect and a few others out there.
Had to input in cells what they call algorithms now, we just called them formulas that we made up as we went long. I think I remember that Dbase could use Lotus info.
But hey this was before there was a public internet, programs measured in K's. Late 80's

Off topic now though.
Sorry.

I looked up using PP that there are several D's of size that might be looked at, some with a few NHL games under their belt.
A center, Logan Brown could also be available, huge, cheap and could play in Abby and has NHL experience. Has sporadic skill too.

 

[sting101]

Not sure what you call impact. Of the Canucks 23 roster players only 1 has less than 100 games played (Silovs), and 6 have less than 200 games played. I assume you would agree with the general assessment that 100 games is a legit NHL career, and 200 games is a NHL regular player. Simple math says 16 x 32 reams is around 500 NHL players with legit careers. The median NHL career is 5 years. Top players get about 12.

In a round about way, what I am saying is that most years produce 30 - 40 players that will end up having NHL careers of more than 200 games.

yes that's mostly accurate if you look at each draft year 300 games is the marker i use but that's semantics at that stage given the 15yrs a player has without serious injury to get to that number

At the top of that is about 10-15 players that are what i would deem core/impact. Some years like 2015 and 2003 are obviously exceptions with more while others like 2012 and 2016 are pretty thin

 

[tantalum]

Nashville became known for creating Dmen, mostly because they drafted so many.

Allvin/Rutherford have been around going on 4 years, that is not just yesterday.

Later round picks often look better on good teams where their presence is as noted.

If reading about the two offer sheets there is reference to both having their confidence weakened by benching's for a single mistake. This has happened way too much with the Canucks and so not many bottom six guys here but some few go on to become regulars on other teams.

The Canucks really don't have too much depth. There are a lot of tweeners out there available, guys to take a chance on and see if Manny can get them into the show or are late bloomers that other team's don't have enough contract spots for, Columbus for example and quickly Utah soon.

Alvin was hired January 2022....that's 2.5 years ago going on 3 not 4.

They do lack depth but it is getting better. And it will continue to get better as they continue to dig out of the mess left to them.

This year is the D+3 from the first draft they had control. Lekk will likely see NHL time this year. EP2 has some AHL experience from end of last year and will be fulltime AHL this year. I believe Kudryavtsev has a ELC. Willander will be in his D+2 year.....there is depth coming. It's supplemented by cheap UFA contracts.

 

[Hodgy]

Every new management always promises to improve depth and the prospect pool, and very few do so in excess of league averages.

 

[tantalum]

Every new management always promises to improve depth and the prospect pool, and very few do so in excess of league averages

Sure but league average would be a massive improvement.

 

[wetcoast]

The Province has a review of how Fernstrom, Mynio, and Romani did at the Summer Showcase.

Canucks prospects: Who left a mark at the World Junior summer showcase?

Somehow I failed to register until now that Fernstrom is 6'2".

His size still won;t matter if his skating doesn't improve substantially though.

 

[Vector]

Jacob Truscott, and Matthew Thiessen, are no longer Canucks prospects. Their rights have been relinquished today.

 

[Nucker42]

Jacob Truscott, and Matthew Thiessen, are no longer Canucks prospects. Their rights have been relinquished today.

Any other good prospects available?

 

[Vector]

Any other good prospects available?

Not at this point. All the worthwhile ones become available way earlier in the season. This round is pretty much all 24/25 year college guys.

 

[andora]

D petey realistic projection is a brayden mcnabb type which is spectacular

Boring safe and physical

 

[iceburg]

I keep seeing the occasional comment that Klimovich is going back home. Is this confirmed? I may have missed the news.

 

[Vector]

I keep seeing the occasional comment that Klimovich is going back home. Is this confirmed? I may have missed the news.

It was heavily rumoured that he was going back to Russia but with Malhotra being hired his agent, Dan Milstein, has said that he's staying in Abbotsford and is excited to forge a relationship with his new coach.

 

[bandwagonesque]

yes that's mostly accurate if you look at each draft year 300 games is the marker i use but that's semantics at that stage given the 15yrs a player has without serious injury to get to that number

At the top of that is about 10-15 players that are what i would deem core/impact. Some years like 2015 and 2003 are obviously exceptions with more while others like 2012 and 2016 are pretty thin

If you look at any draft, the 300gp bar will incorporate both future Hall Of Fame players and 7th defencemen, and an individual draft is too small a sample to expect a consistent distribution. If we want to analyze drafts we have to go deeper than that, but it's a lot of work and when people discuss drafts it's usually to support or condemn a particular front office and not much more.

 

[timw33]

I keep seeing the occasional comment that Klimovich is going back home. Is this confirmed? I may have missed the news.

Getting a mutual contract termination and his contract slot back would be nice.

 

[iceburg]

Getting a mutual contract termination and his contract slot back would be nice.

Healthy scratch in Abbotsford doesn't bode well for him. We'll see how he does under Malholtra.

 

[Phrasing]

2024-25 NHL Prospect Pool Breakdown: Vancouver Canucks’ Top 10

Another top 10 breakdown of Canucks cupboard.

 

[VanJack]

how many employees do you think these sites have? they make next to no money and you need inside sources to actually get the data

OK.....but why would the Caps then buy the former Cap Friendly site and keep most of their guys around? Doesn't make much sense unless they acquired it for peanuts.

 

[credulous]

OK.....but why would the Caps then buy the former Cap Friendly site and keep most of their guys around? Doesn't make much sense unless they acquired it for peanuts.

they bought it for the tech (and maybe the nhlpa connections, altho i bet the caps have those already) and for the staff to build internal tooling. why would they buy the site and then just fire the staff?

 

[Vector]

they bought it for the tech (and maybe the nhlpa connections, altho i bet the caps have those already) and for the staff to build internal tooling. why would they buy the site and then just fire the staff?

To be fair, the bolded happens all the time and it's a constant question.