Team Canada 2022

[ORRFForever]

Marner has only 12 minutes in career penalties so I had to check that out and yea, 5 of the 6 penalties Marner has ever taken the last 5 years have been over the glass penalties (one of the dumbest rules in hockey to most people).

It should be noted that all 6 penalties Marner has ever taken have been killed off and the Leafs have gone 3-3 in those games. (which makes it seem kind of trivial no?)

His career penalties taken in the playoffs/game is also below average in the league (comparables being Rantanen, Pastrnak, Kuznetsov and Nylander over the last 3 years).

There are players who cost their teams with penalties in the playoffs, Marner just isnt one of them.

No... It does not make it trivial at all.

The last thing we need, in an elimination game, is for that fool to flip the puck over the glass during a crucial part of the game.

Marner is mistake prone and he doesn't know how to contain his emotions and play within himself when things go wrong. He never has so leave him at home.

 

[ORRFForever]

I think "playoff performer" matters less when you're surrounded by a lot more talent that can pick up the slack when you struggle than it does when you're your team's top player and the chances of your team rest almost solely on your shoulders.

He did the SAME thing at the 2013 World Juniors on a loaded team.

Canadians will rue the day we take Marner.

 

[SOLR]

Is this 2014? Tavares is not better than Huberdeau at this point. Tavares will not be playing on this team's second line. To think he's higher than Huberdeau on the team's hierarchy is based on nothing but turning back the clock. That's like saying Jonathan Toews is ahead of MacKinnon in the hierarchy because he's played for TC at the Olympics before and MacKinnon hasn't.

You are talking like Tavares is 35 years old - he's not, he's 30 and still a ppg producer about. It's at best splitting hair to pretend like Tavares has declined. Moreover, Huberdeau was never really in the good graces of team Canada, I would be very surprised if they play him where he deserves. Who are we leaving home to play Tavares on LW exactly? Hall? Stamkos? Horvat? + it's not just about Chemistry. McDavid needs a shooter with him. That's Marchand, Tavares or Mackinnon on LW or Barzal/Seguin/Suzuki on RW. Then if we are hellbent at playing Crosby with Marchand, that reduces the list by a lot.

 

[ORRFForever]

You are talking like Tavares is 35 years old - he's not, he's 30 and still a ppg producer about.

Even as a Leaf fan, I had to double check because, yes, JT is about to be 31, but he moves like he's 40.

 

[zeke]

It's weird that so many people consider a line thats 33-34-36 yrs old to be a crucial LOCK just because they were good last tournament when they were 28-29-31yrs old.

 

[zeke]

You're missing the part about the difference being Crosby has been an integral part of Team Canada's success, so having guys with chemistry with him makes sense since he's actually going to play a lot.

Tavares is a bit player. You don't make room on the team for him and leave at home better players just because him and Marner played together one season. That's not how these teams work.



I'm willing to bet you that Point will play on the wing. McDavid, MacKinnon, and Crosby are going to be the top 3 centers and they're not going to waste Point as the 4C in a checking role. He'll be on the wing with either McDavid or MacKinnon.

As far as Tavares being a "shooter than can move", are we talking about the same guy? He's a slow skater. I don't know why you think he's got wheels.



Is this 2014? Tavares is not better than Huberdeau at this point. Tavares will not be playing on this team's second line. To think he's higher than Huberdeau on the team's hierarchy is based on nothing but turning back the clock. That's like saying Jonathan Toews is ahead of MacKinnon in the hierarchy because he's played for TC at the Olympics before and MacKinnon hasn't.

Weird how people want to rewrite what Tavares is. Tavares was on Canada's 2nd line last tourney, from the start of camp to the final.

And what's with people wishcasting that Tavares is old?

Last 2yrs Canadian PPG:

1. McDavid (25) 1.68
2. MacKinnon (26) 1.35
3. Marchand (33) 1.27
4. Marner (24) 1.18
5. Crosby (34) 1.14
6. Huberdeau (28) 1.12
7. Scheifele (28) 1.07
8. Stamkos (31) 1.05
9. Stone (29) 1.03
10. Tavares (31) 0.92
11. Point (25) 0.92
12. O'Reilly (30) 0.91
13. Bergeron (36) 0.90
14. Couturier (29) 0.88
15. Toews (33) 0.86
16. Barzal (25) 0.85

And Tavares does that as a top competition C, not as a sheltered winger.

 

[zeke]

McDavid --- Crosby --- MacKinnon
Marchand --- Point --- Marner
Couturier --- O'Reilly --- Stone
Tavares --- Bergeron --- Barzal
(Huberdeau --- Scheifele - Stamkos)

Go with the proven two-way cup caliber Cs up the middle. (Though probably swap old man bergy out to the wing too and let Barzal be 4C).

Let McD and Mack loose on the wings.

Get the best defensive line in the world as the 3rd line.

Then add the remainijg best 3 guys that aren't defensive liabilities as the 4th line.

Huberdeau, Scheifele, Stamkos would be on the outside looking in for me given their defensive deficiencies.

Toews could make a play for a spot too if he comes back strong.

 

[I Hart Conor Garland]

McDavid --- Crosby --- MacKinnon
Marchand --- Point --- Marner
Couturier --- O'Reilly --- Stone
Tavares --- Barzal --- Bergeron
(Huberdeau --- Scheifele - Stamkos)

Oof.

 

[zeke]

Oof.

Biff.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Weird how people want to rewrite what Tavares is. Tavares was on Canada's 2nd line last tourney, from the start of camp to the final.

I was talking about the 2014 Olympics. Tavares had something like the second least TOI/GP among all forwards, behind I believe Kunitz. And he got injured and missed the entire medal round. He was a bit player on that team.

Last 2yrs Canadian PPG:

1. McDavid (25) 1.68
2. MacKinnon (26) 1.35
3. Marchand (33) 1.27
4. Marner (24) 1.18
5. Crosby (34) 1.14
6. Huberdeau (28) 1.12
7. Scheifele (28) 1.07
8. Stamkos (31) 1.05
9. Stone (29) 1.03
10. Tavares (31) 0.92
11. Point (25) 0.92
12. O'Reilly (30) 0.91
13. Bergeron (36) 0.90
14. Couturier (29) 0.88
15. Toews (33) 0.86
16. Barzal (25) 0.85

And Tavares does that as a top competition C, not as a sheltered winger.

So he's 10th among all eligible Canadian forwards, and some of the guys behind him are either on the upswing (Point, Barzal) or are much better defensively than him (the rest after him).

I don't think you made the point you were going for by posting that list. You basically just made the argument for why he shouldn't be picked. He's an offensive player whose offense isn't even that high (relative to other options) to be selected in an offensive role, and his defense is nowhere near good enough to be selected in a defensive role.

 

[Northern Avs Fan]

Weird how people want to rewrite what Tavares is. Tavares was on Canada's 2nd line last tourney, from the start of camp to the final.

And what's with people wishcasting that Tavares is old?

Last 2yrs Canadian PPG:

1. McDavid (25) 1.68
2. MacKinnon (26) 1.35
3. Marchand (33) 1.27
4. Marner (24) 1.18
5. Crosby (34) 1.14
6. Huberdeau (28) 1.12
7. Scheifele (28) 1.07
8. Stamkos (31) 1.05
9. Stone (29) 1.03
10. Tavares (31) 0.92
11. Point (25) 0.92
12. O'Reilly (30) 0.91
13. Bergeron (36) 0.90
14. Couturier (29) 0.88
15. Toews (33) 0.86
16. Barzal (25) 0.85

And Tavares does that as a top competition C, not as a sheltered winger.

I think he’d be 11th, because he’s behind Makar, but the point still stands.

He’ll be in the mix, but I just wonder how many playmaking centres Canada is going to take. It seems like there are so many of them. I guess it depends on how well the coaching staff thinks his skills translate to the wing.

 

[86Habs]

I think he’d be 11th, because he’s behind Makar, but the point still stands.

He’ll be in the mix, but I just wonder how many playmaking centres Canada is going to take. It seems like there are so many of them. I guess it depends on how well the coaching staff thinks his skills translate to the wing.

He played LW at the 2016 World Cup, on a line with Getzlaf and Perry. If Tavares makes Team Canada, it would be at LW, not at C imo.

 

[Dominance]

Kindly shut the f*** up, fellow Leafs fans. You’re focusing on the wrong damn maple leaf.

Tavares is not a top-12 (likely not even top-15) Canadian forward at this point. Marner on the other hand absolutely is and there’s no situation where he’s not on this team.

 

[JackSlater]

Looking forward to the new season starting. The lack of any relevant games over the last months has led things down some odd paths here.

 

[Gold Standard]

Looking forward to the new season starting. The lack of any relevant games over the last months has led things down some odd paths here.

pretty much this.

I gave up on this thread until we see at least 25 games. at least.

 

[86Habs]

There is little discussion of the defence group, which is the most interesting aspect of the team that I'll be monitoring over the next few months. The forward group is substantially determined, imo.

 

[Zybalto]

He played LW at the 2016 World Cup, on a line with Getzlaf and Perry. If Tavares makes Team Canada, it would be at LW, not at C imo.

He did play left wing at the 2016 tournament but he was on the 2nd line with Getzlaf and Stamkos, while Perry played with Toews and Couture.

 

[Mathieukferland]

Looking forward to the new season starting. The lack of any relevant games over the last months has led things down some odd paths here.

“Highlights” include

1. Tom Wilson must be brought for grit
2. Mitch Marner wouldn’t make Team Canada C
3. Bo Horvat being given any chance of making it as he adds a “surprise element”
4. Brad Marchand has declined too much and is not needed
5. John Tavares needs to be riding shotgun in the top 6 due to his elite skating ability

 

[zeke]

I was talking about the 2014 Olympics. Tavares had something like the second least TOI/GP among all forwards, behind I believe Kunitz. And he got injured and missed the entire medal round. He was a bit player on that team.

He was iirc the youngest forward on the team, and, as you said, was injured.

So he's 10th among all eligible Canadian forwards, and some of the guys behind him are either on the upswing (Point, Barzal) or are much better defensively than him (the rest after him).

I don't think you made the point you were going for by posting that list. You basically just made the argument for why he shouldn't be picked. He's an offensive player whose offense isn't even that high (relative to other options) to be selected in an offensive role, and his defense is nowhere near good enough to be selected in a defensive role.

I'm not sure where you get the idea that Tavares isn't good defensively? He is a top usage center with very good impact metrics on both ends of the ice. This isn't a Stamkos or huberdeau or scheifele who have serious issues in their own end, even when in a relatively sheltered winger role.

 

[Zybalto]

Was looking back at those 2016 lines and does anyone remembers how intense the 2 pre-tournament games were against the US?

The first game the Americans were running around (especially Kesler) and taking shots like these at our players:



The US eventually won that game 4-2 and everyone was talking about how we were getting pushed around and the US had built a team to take out Canada and then the next game Canada targeted Kesler and dominated the states, eventually winning 5-2.

Kesler getting wrecked by Tavares and Thornton:






Good times.

 

[zeke]

He did play left wing at the 2016 tournament but he was on the 2nd line with Getzlaf and Stamkos, while Perry played with Toews and Couture.

Yep. Getzlaf line being the 2nd scoring line and Toews line being the checking 3rd line.

4th line was a led by O'Reilly at C with old man Thornton (already 37) on the wing, and then I think mostly Duchene but maybe some Giroux and Seguin sprinkled in.

 

[zeke]

Kindly shut the f*** up, fellow Leafs fans. You’re focusing on the wrong damn maple leaf.

Tavares is not a top-12 (likely not even top-15) Canadian forward at this point. Marner on the other hand absolutely is and there’s no situation where he’s not on this team.

Why talk about Mitch? He's a no-brainer selection and will be on one of the top lines. Nothing interesting to discuss there.

Tavares is a much more interesting discussion.

 

[zeke]

I think he’d be 11th, because he’s behind Makar, but the point still stands.

He’ll be in the mix, but I just wonder how many playmaking centres Canada is going to take. It seems like there are so many of them. I guess it depends on how well the coaching staff thinks his skills translate to the wing.

Hard for pure wingers to make team canada with all the good centers.

Last time the only wingers to make the team were Marchand and Perry.

 

[Dominance]

Why talk about Mitch? He's a no-brainer selection and will be on one of the top lines. Nothing interesting to discuss there.

Some don’t seem to think he has a place on the team, which is a little crazy to me. Marner’s one of the absolute top offensive weapons in the league and has proven capable (if not necessarily recently) of being quite good defensively as well. A guy who could play anywhere from first to fourth line on this team.

 

[86Habs]

Yep. Getzlaf line being the 2nd scoring line and Toews line being the checking 3rd line.

4th line was a led by O'Reilly at C with old man Thornton (already 37) on the wing, and then I think mostly Duchene but maybe some Giroux and Seguin sprinkled in.

During Babcock's tenure there's been little difference between ice time/overall usage for the 1st, 2nd and 3rd lines. Generally, Babcock's 4th lines have received limited ice time, which was true again in 2016, and he may have ridden the Crosby line a little harder in 2016 than he did in previous tournaments given how dominant they were. I don't have ice times for the 2016 tournament in front of me, but as an example of Babcock's forward deployment in the 2014 epic semi-final game against the U.S., Jeff Carter received the most ice time of any forward. In the gold medal game, it was Toews then Getzlaf.

I remember Getzlaf and Perry playing together in 2016 (why would Babcock split them up?), but its been five years so I could easily be wrong.

Seguin was injured and didn't play in the tournament (as were Benn and Carter). O'Reilly, Perry and Couture were their replacements. Giroux only dressed one game, apparently to give Getzlaf a meaningless round robin game off.