Proposal: Tanev to Toronto

[Blueangel1891]

The most I'd do for Tanev is JVR, Carrick, & Kapanen. Theirs no way a team gives up a young center peice player for one who maxes out as a #2 defenceman because he's limited offensively.

Actually, that's exactly what Edmonton did this summer. Granted, they had more young center piece players to chose from

 

[Liferleafer]

Agreed, but we're not trading our best player for something that won't fundamentally change this franchise.

Without an overpayment, there's no way in hell the Nucks trade Tanev

That is more than fair. I do not see Tanev being moved.

 

[Liferleafer]

Actually, that's exactly what Edmonton did this summer. Granted, they had more young center piece players to chose from

Taylor Hall, while an excellent player, is on a 6 million dollar contract. That's a far cry from an 18 year old player just entering his ELC like Marner. It's a cap world, and really good young ELC players are like gold now. And i agree, it was time for Edmonton to make a move to address a huge need.

 

[Matthews316]

Actually, that's exactly what Edmonton did this summer. Granted, they had more young center piece players to chose from

A trade done to shake up the culture of the team and theirs no doubt New Jersey wins this trade. Hall isn't just a 1st line winger, he's one of the best goal scorers in the league. I'm not sure why people use this trade as a barometer to measure values, as their's too many circumstances surrounding the situation.

 

[TOGuy14]

A trade done to shake up the culture of the team and theirs no doubt New Jersey wins this trade. Hall isn't just a 1st line winger, he's one of the best goal scorers in the league. I'm not sure why people use this trade as a barometer to measure values, as their's too many circumstances surrounding the situation.

Two other things to note:

1. Chia only made the deal because he got a close enough replacement to Hall in the form of Lucic for nothing but UFA dollars.

2. Chia is widely considered to have overpaid by a wide margin in the deal out of desperation to fix his back end.

So given these factors, how exactly does this relate to Toronto right now?

 

[Matthews316]

Two other things to note:

1. Chia only made the deal because he got a close enough replacement to Hall in the form of Lucic for nothing but UFA dollars.

2. Chia is widely considered to have overpaid by a wide margin in the deal out of desperation to fix his back end.

So given these factors, how exactly does this relate to Toronto right now?

I made an offer for Tanev and pointed out that Vancouver shouldn't expect young center peice player unless a team is desperate like Edmonton was.

 

[Ciao]

Vancouver should have traded Tanev for Hall, if that's what they want. That kind of deal won't come by again.

 

[VanJack]

The chances of the Oilers trading Taylor Hall to a division rival like the Canucks were about the same as Friday's Lotto jackpot.

 

[mattydamon]

Really don't think there is a trade to be made here, Tanev would be almost perfect on the Leafs but alas the pieces aren't there to make both sides happy.

These threads always become flame wars, my own humble suggestion would be to kill any more of these before they start as we've been over there a hundred times.

 

[Matthews316]

Really don't think there is a trade to be made here, Tanev would be almost perfect on the Leafs but alas the pieces aren't there to make both sides happy.

These threads always become flame wars, my own humble suggestion would be to kill any more of these before they start as we've been over there a hundred times.

If Vancouver can get past that Toronto won't give up Marner/Nylander, then I think a deal can get done.
Vancouver has 5 guys over 30 making the most money on the team, and a bunch of replaceables on one-year deals like Megna and Skille. Burrows' contract is also up at the end of the year and bound for a pay-cut.

I think players like JVR, Kapanen, Soshnikov, Leipsic and Carrick (Not saying trade all of them for Tanev) can help Vancouver as a bridge for the younger guys like Juolevi, Virtanen, Boeser and Demko.

 

[Hi-wayman]

Bottom line is, no team will trade a Marner/Nylander level player for Tanev, that's been my contention. If that is your demand...and you have every right to demand that,then you have seriously limited the teams that would be interested. I mean you are asking for a teams TOP ELC forward....i don't even know what a Marner equivalent would be on teams interested in Tanev.

Take a look in the Brodie thread...the OP n that one was looking for Nylander, and was willing to add for Marner. So if we had to deal Nylander, Brodie would be chosen over Tanev.

The Canucks & the Leafs are not likely trading partners in many ways, but it stems from both being rebuilding clubs. Neither team can afford to trade the players that are the core of those rebuilding clubs. Tanev is recognized by the media and most GM's around the league as one of the top right hand shot defensive defencemen in the NHL. At 27 he is young & skilled enough to anchor first pairing assignments on a Canuck rebuild and just signed for 4 more seasons at a relatively low $4.45 M per.

In short, Tanev is the Canucks defense. When he is out of the lineup, the rest of the Canuck defencemen noticably flounrder. The Canucks are trying to rebuild into a defense first team where as the Leafs rebuild is based more on offense. Tanev is too important to the Canucks to trade him even for Marner or Nylander & if either of those are not good enough to replace what the Canucks lose that Tanev brings to the Canucks, then lesser Leaf players or prospects would be even considered less.

Equally Marner and Nylander are far too important to the offensive style team the Leafs are buiding. Tanev's & Gudbranson's defense first style would not benefit the Leafs as much as their cost. Edler, Hutton or Stecher would be more complementary to the Leaf's style of play. Edler though would likely be the only one of the three the Canuks may consider trading & as the other half of the Canuck's first pairing he would not come cheap either.

I think you greatly under value what Tanev brings probably because as I suggest, Tanev's skills are not what the Leafs look for in a defenceman to compliment the Leafs style. The Canucks & the Leafs are not going to be Cup Contenders for a few years yet. During that time the Canucks can get along with older forwards during the duration of rebuilding. The same goes for defencemen on the Leafs while both teams work on replacing their weeknesses through the draft or trade deadline. Just don't expect other teams, contenders or not, willing to trade of first line/first pairing players that they have spent so much in development.

First pairing defencemen are very rarely traded in the NHL. The loss of a first pairing defenceman is so hard to replace it often is the quick decline of that team. At the beginning of this season has seen three though the Subban - Weber trade really was just a switch of teams rather than trading a defenceman for a foreward. The Larsson - Hall trade would be the best example for a first pairing - first line trade that you asked for. Even then I would rate Tanev above Larsson & both Marner & likely Nylander above Hall.

 

[TOGuy14]

Wonder if a three way trade might make sense with a basis being

To TOR
Tanev

To NYI
JVR

To VAN
Barzal

Additions and pieces to be added all around for sure, but as a basis?

VAN gets a top end home town prospect, Leafs get their RHD, and Islanders get someone to pair with Tavares

 

[Matthews316]

The Canucks & the Leafs are not likely trading partners in many ways, but it stems from both being rebuilding clubs. Neither team can afford to trade the players that are the core of those rebuilding clubs. Tanev is recognized by the media and most GM's around the league as one of the top right hand shot defensive defencemen in the NHL. At 27 he is young & skilled enough to anchor first pairing assignments on a Canuck rebuild and just signed for 4 more seasons at a relatively low $4.45 M per.

In short, Tanev is the Canucks defense. When he is out of the lineup, the rest of the Canuck defencemen noticably flounrder. The Canucks are trying to rebuild into a defense first team where as the Leafs rebuild is based more on offense. Tanev is too important to the Canucks to trade him even for Marner or Nylander & if either of those are not good enough to replace what the Canucks lose that Tanev brings to the Canucks, then lesser Leaf players or prospects would be even considered less.

Equally Marner and Nylander are far too important to the offensive style team the Leafs are buiding. Tanev's & Gudbranson's defense first style would not benefit the Leafs as much as their cost. Edler, Hutton or Stecher would be more complementary to the Leaf's style of play. Edler though would likely be the only one of the three the Canuks may consider trading & as the other half of the Canuck's first pairing he would not come cheap either.

I think you greatly under value what Tanev brings probably because as I suggest, Tanev's skills are not what the Leafs look for in a defenceman to compliment the Leafs style. The Canucks & the Leafs are not going to be Cup Contenders for a few years yet. During that time the Canucks can get along with older forwards during the duration of rebuilding. The same goes for defencemen on the Leafs while both teams work on replacing their weeknesses through the draft or trade deadline. Just don't expect other teams, contenders or not, willing to trade of first line/first pairing players that they have spent so much in development.

First pairing defencemen are very rarely traded in the NHL. The loss of a first pairing defenceman is so hard to replace it often is the quick decline of that team. At the beginning of this season has seen three though the Subban - Weber trade really was just a switch of teams rather than trading a defenceman for a foreward. The Larsson - Hall trade would be the best example for a first pairing - first line trade that you asked for. Even then I would rate Tanev above Larsson & both Marner & likely Nylander above Hall.

Vancouver isn't actively trying to rebuild though, signing Eriksson was evidence of that. Not to mention I believe that the Sedins, Tanev and Miller can keep Vancouver high up enough in the standings to miss out on a very high pick. You make a lot of good points but that is the flaw in your argument. Vancouver needs to blow it up completely, even if it means getting rid of a coveted player for future building blocks. It's going to be hard as hell to get rid of the Sedins so you have to start somewhere.

 

[Menzinger]

Actually, that's exactly what Edmonton did this summer. Granted, they had more young center piece players to chose from

Different situation - ie with the age range of the players. It was a deal that was also widely panned (and rightfully so).

 

[Hunter368]

Wonder if a three way trade might make sense with a basis being

To TOR
Tanev

To NYI
JVR

To VAN
Barzal

Additions and pieces to be added all around for sure, but as a basis?

VAN gets a top end home town prospect, Leafs get their RHD, and Islanders get someone to pair with Tavares

I doubt NY trades Brazal for JVR, but I'll defer to NY fans. Brazal is better then anything the Leafs have to offer the Nucks outside of the big 3.

 

[VoluntaryDom]

HECK NO from Toronto.

Tanev for Bracco, maybe

or Tanev and a 3rd for Dermott

or Tanev and a 4th for Komarov

There are so many delusional Nucks fans here. They ask for a kings ransom for Tanev, a fine #3/4 defenseman and could be useful on the Leafs but not at this price. He's not Marc-Edouard Vlasic, ok, Nucks?

PS Stralman > Vlasic

 

[Hunter368]

HECK NO from Toronto.

Tanev for Bracco, maybe

or Tanev and a 3rd for Dermott

or Tanev and a 4th for Komarov

There are so many delusional Nucks fans here. They ask for a kings ransom for Tanev, a fine #3/4 defenseman and could be useful on the Leafs but not at this price. He's not Marc-Edouard Vlasic, ok, Nucks?

PS Stralman > Vlasic

Wow......so wrong.....embarrassing post.

 

[Liferleafer]

HECK NO from Toronto.

Tanev for Bracco, maybe

or Tanev and a 3rd for Dermott

or Tanev and a 4th for Komarov

There are so many delusional Nucks fans here. They ask for a kings ransom for Tanev, a fine #3/4 defenseman and could be useful on the Leafs but not at this price. He's not Marc-Edouard Vlasic, ok, Nucks?

PS Stralman > Vlasic

A garbage offer for Vancouver using bad Leaf value posted by a guy with Boltsfan in his name.....ya.

 

[Hi-wayman]

Vancouver isn't actively trying to rebuild though, signing Eriksson was evidence of that. Not to mention I believe that the Sedins, Tanev and Miller can keep Vancouver high up enough in the standings to miss out on a very high pick. You make a lot of good points but that is the flaw in your argument. Vancouver needs to blow it up completely, even if it means getting rid of a coveted player for future building blocks. It's going to be hard as hell to get rid of the Sedins so you have to start somewhere.

I have to disagree with most of your post. Yes the Canucks are in rebuild and have been for over two years. Some want to call it retooling, but what ever it is called only the Sedins, Edler, Burrows & Hansen remain from the team roster that existed before Benning became GM. 5 players out of a plus 22 man roster that exists today. Sorry but that is an 80% turnover and that is far more of a rebuild than a little tweaking that could be called a retooling.

Next, no GM would be foolish enough to totally gut a team of all its players on the chance that he may be able to draft prospects that over the next three to five years will equal or better than the players he released or traded away. You and others are assuming that the prospects that are drafted are not only going to make it into the NHL, but are going to achieve their hyped up potential. There are two old sayings that apply here "It is an illusion. The grass is not greener on the other side of the fence" and "don't through the baby out with the bath water". In short what you already have is just as good or better that the players or draft picks of others.

Truth is that most will not turn out to be quality NHL prospects and those that do make the NHL , without older, experienced players to set standards & guidance, will try to retain the bad habits they learned in junior. All that will lead to is a longer rebuild time and maybe an even longer stint in mediocrity. You forget that the 17 plus players Benning has already replaced all were hyped equally to the so called prospects you want to draft. It turns out that Benning feels the Sedins, Edler, Burrows & Hansen are better players who will contribute more for the team now and in the future than what other teams have so far offered.

Last only a fool will believe a GM, a coach or any professional player will intentionally try to lose. Not only would that constitute cheating, trying to lose at anything goes against the very nature of an athlete. They push themselves to win. add to that why would a player or coach purposely loose so that a team can draft a better player who will replace them on the team they helped loose?

 

[Halla]

HECK NO from Toronto.

Tanev for Bracco, maybe

or Tanev and a 3rd for Dermott

or Tanev and a 4th for Komarov

There are so many delusional Nucks fans here. They ask for a kings ransom for Tanev, a fine #3/4 defenseman and could be useful on the Leafs but not at this price. He's not Marc-Edouard Vlasic, ok, Nucks?

PS Stralman > Vlasic

why is a tampa fan trying to make leafs fans look bad with this miserable offer. tanev AND a pick for dermott/komarov. get out.

 

[Matthews316]

I have to disagree with most of your post. Yes the Canucks are in rebuild and have been for over two years. Some want to call it retooling, but what ever it is called only the Sedins, Edler, Burrows & Hansen remain from the team roster that existed before Benning became GM. 5 players out of a plus 22 man roster that exists today. Sorry but that is an 80% turnover and that is far more of a rebuild than a little tweaking that could be called a retooling.

Next, no GM would be foolish enough to totally gut a team of all its players on the chance that he may be able to draft prospects that over the next three to five years will equal or better than the players he released or traded away. You and others are assuming that the prospects that are drafted are not only going to make it into the NHL, but are going to achieve their hyped up potential. There are two old sayings that apply here "It is an illusion that the grass is not greener on the other side of the fence" and "don't through the baby out with the bath water". In short what you already have is just as good or better that the players or draft picks of others.

Truth is that most will not turn out to be quality NHL prospects and those that do make the NHL , without older, experienced players to set standards & guidance, will try to retain the bad habits they learned in junior. All that will lead to is a longer rebuild time and maybe an even longer stint in mediocrity. You forget that the 17 plus players Benning has already replaced all were hyped equally to the so called prospects you want to draft. It turns out that Benning feels the Sedins, Edler, Burrows & Hansen are better players who will contribute more for the team now and in the future than what other teams have so far offered.

Last only a fool will believe a GM, a coach or any professional player will intentionally try to lose. Not only would that constitute cheating, trying to lose at anything goes against the very nature of an athlete. They push themselves to win. add to that why would a player or coach purposely loose so that a team can draft a better player who will replace them on the team they helped loose?

Only a fool forgets Buffalo's blatant attempt to lose purposely.

Only a fool would think this "retool" has any sort of substance. Especially when the Sedins are still leading the charge, A 31 year old Eriksson on a 6-year deal. Burrows and Hansen can't be long-term players for the Canucks, they need to be replaced by younger players, especially Burrows.

Your whole schtick is all nice and smooth until you realize the Canucks aren't going anywhere and will continue to go nowhere as long as they keep this current group together. Not bad enough to get a franchise changing pick, but not good enough to make the playoffs, otherwise known as "No-Man's Land".

 

[Canadian Canuck]

HECK NO from Toronto.

Tanev for Bracco, maybe

or Tanev and a 3rd for Dermott

or Tanev and a 4th for Komarov

There are so many delusional Nucks fans here. They ask for a kings ransom for Tanev, a fine #3/4 defenseman and could be useful on the Leafs but not at this price. He's not Marc-Edouard Vlasic, ok, Nucks?

PS Stralman > Vlasic

Are you ***** kidding me??...has to be a troll post.

If Tanev is going we need a Marner/Nylander coming back there's no way around that. No point in fighting who's more valuable us Canucks fans are just stating what it would take no need to get upset or defensive over our demands.

A comparable from other teams would be for example(again chill if you don't agree) Ehlers, D.Strome, Connor, Puljujarvi etc. Tanev stays unless that kind of young caliber player is coming back end of story

 

[Canadian Canuck]

Wonder if a three way trade might make sense with a basis being

To TOR
Tanev

To NYI
JVR

To VAN
Barzal

Additions and pieces to be added all around for sure, but as a basis?

VAN gets a top end home town prospect, Leafs get their RHD, and Islanders get someone to pair with Tavares

Awful for all parties except Toronto. You guys make out like bandits

 

[dellzor]

HECK NO from Toronto.

Tanev for Bracco, maybe

or Tanev and a 3rd for Dermott

or Tanev and a 4th for Komarov

There are so many delusional Nucks fans here. They ask for a kings ransom for Tanev, a fine #3/4 defenseman and could be useful on the Leafs but not at this price. He's not Marc-Edouard Vlasic, ok, Nucks?

PS Stralman > Vlasic

I think I legitimately lost brain cells reading this post

 

[Arizonan God]

Are you ***** kidding me??...has to be a troll post.

If Tanev is going we need a Marner/Nylander coming back there's no way around that. No point in fighting who's more valuable us Canucks fans are just stating what it would take no need to get upset or defensive over our demands.

A comparable from other teams would be for example(again chill if you don't agree) Ehlers, D.Strome, Connor, Puljujarvi etc. Tanev stays unless that kind of young caliber player is coming back end of story

I know that's what you think, but Jim Benning still is the GM of the Vancouver Canucks.