Tampa Bay: Are we witnessing the best roster in the cap era?

[DistantThunderRep]

Sound about right if you have a team that win 60% of is game against any opponent has .710 chance of winning a 4 of 7 series, 25% chance of winning 4 in row.

Also screw all you jerks for the jinx thread. I'll remember you all...

 

[Sky04]

If that team didn’t exsist, neither would the Tampa Bay Lightning. Embarrassing.

We can also thank the leafs for being a joke for the past 50 years, any team that matches up with them might as well get a bye.

 

[Revelation]

Kinda the same way Tampa can add exceptional value on contracts in a tax friendly state. (Kuch, Macd, Stammer, Hedman, etc.) are all at least 2-3 million more in almost all markets. The fact that it was STILL possible for you to add EK was insane, and not at all parity.

I would not be surprised if Point signed for 8m per.

I still think the Cap should be after taxes are considered.

Advantages are Advantages (mind you it's not as big as some make it out to be. Most players have good accountants, play out of state games, and find loopholes to ease things, but dollar to cap, Tampa can spread it around more)

However, it is a amazingly well built team regardless

P.S I am a fan of the Bolts, great to watch, but am I salty about the value you can have on contracts?... very salty lol

LOL you should actually check the numbers, the state tax break on 41 home games is miniscule and covered up by other costs pertaining to living in Florida

The weather and ocean is what really does it for them

 

[RickyHP]

Pretty much this. Until Tampa wins something, they're just a loaded team, like SJ during the mid 2000's.

yeah, rough times. the sharks were supposed to win a couple cups back then

 

[Section88]

2013 hawks were a really special team. Took 25 games for them to lose in regulation. Finished 36-7-5
Forwards -
Kane, toews, sharp, good bickell, hossa, saad, stalberg, shaw, handzus, frolik, kruger, bolland
Defense -
Keith, Seabrook, Hjalmarsson, oduya, leddy, rozsival
And Crawford in net who easily could have won the smythe.

 

[Iceman]

Nobody is denying the quality of the 2002 Red Wings even though they only won one cup when they brought in all the additional hall of famers.

 

[Caps8112]

So because Carolina has a cup, does that mean they had a great roster?
Because Vegas made the finals, did they have a great roster?

Because Vancouver didn't win the cup from 2010-15 does that mean their roser wasn't great?


I maintain that you can have an elite roster and not win the cup, just as you can have a meh roster and still win a cup...

understand your point but Carolinas roster the year they won was pretty damn good. they don't get the credit they deserve.

 

[Uncle Scrooge]

They're up there.

Arguably the best forward group in the league.

Multiple top pair quality dmen and talent like Sergachev on the 3rd pair. Wouldn't say it's the best defense in the league but without thinking about it it's top 5 for sure.

Arguably the best goalie in the league. At least top 3.

Hockey is not played on paper though so it doesn't mean they should be handed the cup, but yeah it's one heck of a team without many weaknesses.

The fact that you're among in the best in all 3 categories is extremely hard to do in the cap era. It just goes to show how Tampa have nailed pretty much every aspect there is to acquiring players.

 

[RightInTheAho]

Tampa reminds me a lot of the 2011 Canucks.

That team is disgustingly good, their management is one of the best I’ve ever seen.

Not taking anything away from the 2011 Canucks but this Tampa team is better for several reasons.

- Scoring TB has 2 first lines the 2011 Canucks had one (Sedin line) their 2nd line is nowhere near Tampa's featuring Ryan Kesler and 2 average wingers. TB also has better depth.

- Defense TB has 2 #1D something the Canucks have always lacked. They had better balance but no true Norris calibre defensemen.

- 2011 Canucks also relied way too heavily on the PP and weren't even the top 5vs 5 team that year. Guess who was the top team? Hint they won the Cup.

 

[Regal]

LOL you should actually check the numbers, the state tax break on 41 home games is miniscule and covered up by other costs pertaining to living in Florida

The weather and ocean is what really does it for them

Players get taxed on their entire salaries for the state their team resides not just 41 games. The jock tax for the away games is extra. A player playing in Cali and paying an extra 13.3% is pretty substantial

 

[Whoshattenkirkshoes]

This thread must just kill inside to all the leafs fans

 

[Addison Rae]

Not taking anything away from the 2011 Canucks but this Tampa team is better for several reasons.

- Scoring TB has 2 first lines the 2011 Canucks had one (Sedin line) their 2nd line is nowhere near Tampa's featuring Ryan Kesler and 2 average wingers. TB also has better depth.

- Defense TB has 2 #1D something the Canucks have always lacked. They had better balance but no true Norris calibre defensemen.

- 2011 Canucks also relied way too heavily on the PP and weren't even the top 5vs 5 team that year. Guess who was the top team? Hint they won the Cup.

The Canucks were the first team since the Habs in their hay day to lead the league in goals for, goals against, penalty kill % and power play %.

Absolutely you’re correct in a few of your assessments, the Canucks lack of scoring wingers hampered their second line but Kesler was a 40 goal Selke winner which made him one of the best centres in the sport.

The Canucks had a better 3rd line as Malhotra was spitting up and chewing some of the hardest defensive deployment I’ve ever seen. While players like Hansen and Torres were absolutely perfect 3rd line players in defensive roles.

With the additions of Higgins and Lapierre the Canucks had an extremely deep forward core.

You’re bang on Hedman is easily better than any defender the Canucks had, I’d put McDonagh on the same tier as Hamhuis, Edler and Ehrhoff though. The Canucks from 1-6 probably had the deeper blue line.

Stylistically I think both teams were insanely deep, I think peak Henrik Sedin has a clear edge over current Stamkos and Burrows and Kesler’s defensive value are probably a bit ahead of Palat and Point at least currently defensively.

I’d still give the edge to the Bolts, but I think both teams are built really similarly.

 

[Cloned]

That Canucks team was the deepest team I've seen in the cap era. They just ran into an insanely hot stretch by Thomas and Luongo had some shaky performances in the Finals.

 

[Addison Rae]

I think the 2010 Hawks get underrated for some reason, that team was utterly disgusting.

Kane, Toews, Hosea, Keith, Seabrook, Sharp, Byfuglien, Campbell, Hjalmarsson, Versteeg, Ladd, Bolland...

 

[Morbo]

I think they're the best team right now, but I don't know about in the entire cap era.

 

[Rschmitz]

Don't forget that 2011 Canuck team lost to Boston, who had trouble with TB in 7 games. TB had no where near the talent of those two teams. Also, injuries can totally ruin your chances no matter what team you have on paper.

We were up 2-1 in the cup finals, but then our #1 center and playoff leading scorer broke his wrist and our Vezina finalist got knocked out with a serious groin injury. Same thing against Pitt in the ECF, Bishop got ran onto the IR and we had no Stamkos.

This is why it's so hard to win a cup, you have to have a lot of things fall into place for you, talent alone only gets you so far. You need luck with injuries, luck with seeding, and then some in game luck. When's the last team to go to the postseason and just embarrass everyone?

 

[RightInTheAho]

The Canucks were the first team since the Habs in their hay day to lead the league in goals for, goals against, penalty kill % and power play %.

Absolutely you’re correct in a few of your assessments, the Canucks lack of scoring wingers hampered their second line but Kesler was a 40 goal Selke winner which made him one of the best centres in the sport.

The Canucks had a better 3rd line as Malhotra was spitting up and chewing some of the hardest defensive deployment I’ve ever seen. While players like Hansen and Torres were absolutely perfect 3rd line players in defensive roles.

With the additions of Higgins and Lapierre the Canucks had an extremely deep forward core.

You’re bang on Hedman is easily better than any defender the Canucks had, I’d put McDonagh on the same tier as Hamhuis, Edler and Ehrhoff though. The Canucks from 1-6 probably had the deeper blue line.

Stylistically I think both teams were insanely deep, I think peak Henrik Sedin has a clear edge over current Stamkos and Burrows and Kesler’s defensive value are probably a bit ahead of Palat and Point at least currently defensively.

I’d still give the edge to the Bolts, but I think both teams are built really similarly.

Can't deny any of that.

Kesler had one of the most dominating series I've seen vs Nashville.

It's too bad Manny got injured pretty much making our 4th line irrelevant. I remember it was Glass - Random Center - Oreskovich. That was a huge blow.

I'd give the edge to the 11 Canucks defensively.
Edge to TB forwards. They got so many weapons that JT Miller a 20 goal 50pt guy is on their 3rd line.
Goaltending is practically a wash.

 

[Addison Rae]

Can't deny any of that.

Kesler had one of the most dominating series I've seen vs Nashville.

It's too bad Manny got injured pretty much making our 4th line irrelevant. I remember it was Glass - Random Center - Oreskovich. That was a huge blow.

I'd give the edge to the 11 Canucks defensively.
Edge to TB forwards. They got so many weapons that JT Miller a 20 goal 50pt guy is on their 3rd line.
Goaltending is practically a wash.

Spot on, Malhotra’s injury was a gigantic blow considering Kesler’s deployment changed once Malhotra was hurt which hindered him offensively.

Pretty much the entire team was depleted in that Boston series the Canucks were extremely lucky to take that series 7 games due to that.

A healthy Canucks team wins that series for sure in my books, if you go down our roster pretty much every core piece was hurt, you can call it “playoff hockey” but I’ve never seen a team get so unlucky with injuries, people don’t talk about it because a lot of the players played through it but they were severally banged up.

 

[Conspiracy Theorist]

They need to win one first but they are most likely at the moment. No guarantee though.

 

[JoVel]

The no Cup argument is really dumb in a sport where luck plays such a big part. Pittsburgh easily could've went without winning either of those back to back Cups and Tampa could just as easily have a couple of Cups since 2015. Cups are what fans and players obviously care about but it's not an accurate measurement of how good a team is.

 

[TheMule93]

Tbh I thought Tampa last season was the best roster I've ever watched. But they're even better this season with Points ascendancy and McDonaghs return to form. Best roster doesn't always win the cup though.

08 wings won playing the most dominant hockey I've ever watched. They added Marian Hossa next season and played worse. Still made it to the finals despite injuries to key cogs in the machine though - Datsyuk and Lidstrom. They were missing the magic of the previous season where they steamrolled everything in their path.

 

[God King Fudge]

Came for some salt, was not disappoint.

 

[Drytoast]

Cringe is being a fan of a club that hasn't won a playoff round in 15 years and being proud of it. Now that's embarrassing.

15 years without a playoff round victory and yet you still copy us.

"Tampa Bay Maple Leafs"

LOL.

 

[AtlantaWhaler]

Certainly a great roster, but this needs to be looked at in hindsight. They can put together an amazing regular season and then hit a first round exit. For now, I'd say the Pens and Hawks of 5-8 years ago hold this title.

 

[sufferer]

2013 hawks were a really special team. Took 25 games for them to lose in regulation. Finished 36-7-5
Forwards -
Kane, toews, sharp, good bickell, hossa, saad, stalberg, shaw, handzus, frolik, kruger, bolland
Defense -
Keith, Seabrook, Hjalmarsson, oduya, leddy, rozsival
And Crawford in net who easily could have won the smythe.

The 09-10 team was inarguably more talented but less refined.