Confirmed Signing with Link: [STL] F Dylan Holloway (2 years, $2.290457M AAV) and D Philip Broberg (2 years, $4.580917M AAV) sign offer sheets with the Blues (not matched)

[GOilers88]

It is very much mismanagement. You know why army doesnt have this problem cause he has the cobtract ready before they go to rfa. You guys signed a bunch of ufas exoect these gus would take league min. Broberg will be getting top 4 mins and pp time thats so 4.5 for 2lhd

You know why Army doesn't have that problem? Because the team wasn't contending and up against the cap.

It's okay to acknowledge someone made a good move without denigrating the other side. I'm pretty confident that there isn't a single other team in the league that would have thrown Broberg 9 million dollars. They're banking on him continuing to improve. I think he will. But he's also nowhere near proven himself as a top 4 defenseman.

 

[Beukeboom Fan]

View attachment 901004

IMO - if true this is on the Oilers front office. The Oilers had the ability to get the suggested deals done ($1.8 for Broberg and $1.2M for Holloway) and by waiting to finalize they let the Blues swoop in and put them between a rock and a hard place. If they were waiting to get the deals done because they were over the cap - that's a failure to understand how this situation exposes them to offersheets, even if they are rare.

 

[GOilers88]

IMO - if true this is on the Oilers front office. The Oilers had the ability to get the suggested deals done ($1.8 for Broberg and $1.2M for Holloway) and by waiting to finalize they let the Blues swoop in and put them between a rock and a hard place. If they were waiting to get the deals done because they were over the cap - that's a failure to understand how this situation exposes them to offersheets, even if they are rare.

That's fair if true.

Where was the quote from?

 

[McJedi]

It kills me when people get upset at players for taking bigger contracts or signing with other teams.

Organizations dump players all the time. Contracts don't equal loyalty.

Organizations do what is best for the organization. The player's job is to manage the player's career. These two concerns often create a zero sum game. That's why the players have agents.

What is obvious with these two offer sheets is the Oilers front office played their hand in a way that lead to this. The players responded to the Oilers past behaviors and roster moves.

I didn't understand the excitement around Skinner. Nice goal scorer, but frankly... in a playoff game... I'd much rather have guys like Foegele than Skinner. Harder players do well in the playoffs. Foegele isn't all that skilled.. But his size, speed and skating abilities are pretty dang helpful in playoff hockey.

Your bottom six was great in the playoffs and it was a bottom six built for the playoffs. Holloway was in that matrix. He's also pretty big, good skater... good length. That stuff matters when the goal is to play effective and boring dump n chase hockey.

I think the Oilers got playoff worse / regular season better over this most recent off season.

 

[Victor000]

Broberg is a huge gamble to live up that contract. Keep in mind that for most of the season he couldn't beat out Vinny Desharnais for a job, who has since signed for 2M per with the Canucks.

 

[TruGr1t]

My bad.
Thanks for the clarification.
I guess it just bumps the problem down the road.

They can use LTIR and waivers to match the sheets and be compliant, but that creates a small roster and a terrible bargaining position to move salary, other teams will absolutely leverage that to take advantage.

 

[Robtom18]

Ah yes, Ceci and Kulak were the foundational pieces behind Edmonton playing some of the best defensive hockey in the League after January. Some people on here like to spout nonsense with absolute zero hockey IQ. Multiple teams have expressed interest in Kane, dealing him won't be an issue but hey you probably think we need to attach a 1st

Kane is hurt nobody is getting player on ltir in hopes he may play in a year. Get real.

 

[BurnabyJoe7]

IMO - if true this is on the Oilers front office. The Oilers had the ability to get the suggested deals done ($1.8 for Broberg and $1.2M for Holloway) and by waiting to finalize they let the Blues swoop in and put them between a rock and a hard place. If they were waiting to get the deals done because they were over the cap - that's a failure to understand how this situation exposes them to offersheets, even if they are rare.

It was always on Oilers management. Great move from the blues.

Broberg is the more important asset but I can't see a way they make that work. Holloway should be an easy match.

Just watch the Oilers do something odd like let Holloway walk but keep broberg. Management had a fantastic start to summer and have turned back into a clown show with the Bowman hiring and now this.

 

[GOilers88]

Organizations do what is best for the organization. The player's job is to manage the player's career. These two concerns often create a zero sum game. That's why the players have agents.

I don't even think this is an issue if St. Louis doesn't offersheet both players. Either guy gets their offer on their own, I think Edmonton matches and any crunch is dealt with during the season with trades.

This is the first time I've seen such a clever use of offersheets for depth players trying to prove themselves.

 

[Robtom18]

These offer sheets won't affect signing Draisaitl at all. The Oilers will need to make room to sign Bouchard to an extension if they match, but they have an entire year to figure that out, and some pieces on the team that wouldn't be hard to trade to make room, if they have to. It will hurt their depth though, that's for sure.

Name those pieces that get you 7mil i am interested in your opinion

 

[Bond]

This is basic NHL history that it's wrong to not know actually.

The Blues signed Scott Stevens as a free agent in the summer of 1990 and the NHL took away the next five first round draft choices from the Blues (and the Caps farted them away with mostly bad picks). Five first round picks. Five. For signing a restricted free agent.

The next summer the Blues signed Brendan Shanahan, who didn't cost 5 first rounders according to his free agency classification, so instead the league corruptly ruled through corrupt arbitrator Edward J. Houston that the penalty for signing him was to cost a player who cost 5 first rounders (follow that logic).

For signing Shanahan, Lamoreillo was required vaguely buy the CBA to negotiate in "good faith" which is laughable because there was no negotiation, he asked the arbitrator to award him Stevens as a penalty. One of the greatest defensemen in the history of the game taken off the roster as a punishment for daring to use the rules correctly. So the Blues offered that their penalty should only be one Hall of Very Good player in Curtis Joseph, a HoF player in the second year Rod Brind'Amour (last forward to lead a Cup champion in ice time) and 2 additional picks each around #40 overall. But the league said how dare you try to escape punishment like that and stripped Stevens away. It was an extraordinary sports outrage on Sept 3, 1991 when it was announced and it remains one today.

That is the free agency world we used to live in and the Blues broke it and you are all welcome except for Devils fans.

Had no clue that happened as I wasn't even alive lol

 

[Robtom18]

I don't even think this is an issue if St. Louis doesn't offersheet both players. Either guy gets their offer on their own, I think Edmonton matches and any crunch is dealt with during the season with trades.

This is the first time I've seen such a clever use of offersheets for depth players trying to prove themselves.

Bro what part of cap compliant by start of season do you not get. It has to be addressed before start of season

 

[McJedi]

I don't even think this is an issue if St. Louis doesn't offersheet both players. Either guy gets their offer on their own, I think Edmonton matches and any crunch is dealt with during the season with trades.

This is the first time I've seen such a clever use of offersheets for depth players trying to prove themselves.

which is crazy because we've been talking about using offer sheets like this for years at HF.

It's the mid-tier (2nd and 3rd round pick) level of offer sheets that are the most difficult to deal with.

No one is going to sign Seider and put a few unprotected 1st round picks on the table. And Detroit would match. It's dumb to talk about those.

It's the Brobergs and Holloways that were ALWAYS the best targets of the offer sheet game. HF knew this years and years ago. The NHL really is run by too many good ole boys.

The good news out of all of this is... perhaps teams start to utilize offer sheets like they should be deployed. Make the off seasons interesting for such an slow and backwards league to begin with.

like... why hasn't a team with cap space done an offer sheet on Nic Robertson at the 3rd round level? He's NHL ready, showing signs he can be an effective scorer in the middle six role and what's the risk? 2 years at $2.3MM and losing a measly 3rd round pick? That's noting. Go for it dummies.

 

[GOilers88]

Bro what part of cap compliant by start of season do you not get. It has to be addressed before start of season

They have a month and a half to clear space, and with Kane going on LTIR matching either OS on its own isn't a problem.

You're acting like they have 7 days to make the cap work and they don't.

 

[AslanRH]

This is basic NHL history that it's wrong to not know actually.

The Blues signed Scott Stevens as a free agent in the summer of 1990 and the NHL took away the next five first round draft choices from the Blues (and the Caps farted them away with mostly bad picks). Five first round picks. Five. For signing a restricted free agent.

The next summer the Blues signed Brendan Shanahan, who didn't cost 5 first rounders according to his free agency classification, so instead the league corruptly ruled through corrupt arbitrator Edward J. Houston that the penalty for signing him was to cost a player who cost 5 first rounders (follow that logic).

For signing Shanahan, Lamoreillo was required vaguely buy the CBA to negotiate in "good faith" which is laughable because there was no negotiation, he asked the arbitrator to award him Stevens as a penalty. One of the greatest defensemen in the history of the game taken off the roster as a punishment for daring to use the rules correctly. So the Blues offered that their penalty should only be one Hall of Very Good player in Curtis Joseph, a HoF player in the second year Rod Brind'Amour (last forward to lead a Cup champion in ice time) and 2 additional picks each around #40 overall. But the league said how dare you try to escape punishment like that and stripped Stevens away. It was an extraordinary sports outrage on Sept 3, 1991 when it was announced and it remains one today.

That is the free agency world we used to live in and the Blues broke it and you are all welcome except for Devils fans.

Good post,
but should point out more clearly that Shanahan was an RFA signing requiring 4 1sts [if I recall] which were already property of Washington. Hence the eventual "arbitration".
Still agree this changed the way things were done moving forward

 

[GOilers88]

which is crazy because we've been talking about using offer sheets like this for years at HF.

It's the mid-tier (2nd and 3rd round pick) level of offer sheets that are the most difficult to deal with.

No one is going to sign Seider and put a few unprotected 1st round picks on the table. And Detroit would match. It's dumb to talk about those.

It's the Brobergs and Holloways that were ALWAYS the best targets of the offer sheet game. HF knew this years and years ago. The NHL really is run by too many good ole boys.

I mean moreso that they sheeted more than one player to ensure they get the one they seem to be after. They could have ensured they got both by being more aggressive with Holloway, but his deal seems to be the intentional wrench.

 

[McJedi]

I mean moreso that they sheeted more than one player to ensure they get the one they seem to be after. They could have ensured they got both by being more aggressive with Holloway, but his deal seems to be the intentional wrench.

No they couldn't because even more more dollar for Holloway means he costs a 2nd rounder, which they needed for Broberg.

St Louis gave the Oilers two super toxic offer sheets and the lowest compensation with the highest AAV. Teams should do this every single off-season to the good, cap space devoid teams. This should be a thing every single off-season.

It will also shift the dollars from older vets that are no longer worth their AAVs to younger guys that probably are. More efficient way to run your league. Should lead to fewer bad deals on washed up guys. Teams will have less money to waste on the Killorns as they spend that on their younger guys.

St Louis did the NHL a big favor yesterday. They showed the NHL how offer sheets should really work.

 

[Three On Zero]

I think it's a hip impingement that he needs surgery

Ahh true, I always forget about the hip.

 

[GOilers88]

No they couldn't because even more more dollar for Holloway means he costs a 2nd rounder, which they needed for Broberg.

St Louis gave the Oilers two super toxic offer sheets and the lowest compensation with the highest AAV. Teams should do this every single off-season to the good, cap space devoid teams. This should be a thing every single off-season.

It will also shift the dollars from older vets that are no longer worth their AAVs to younger guys that probably are. More efficient way to run your league. Should lead to fewer bad deals on washed up guys. Teams will have less money to waste on the Killorns as they spend that on their younger guys.

Fair.

Even without being able to increase his amount, sheeting Holloway just seems to be solely to ensure they get Broberg. I don't think they believe for a second they'll get both.

Such a slick move.

 

[Robtom18]

You know why Army doesn't have that problem? Because the team wasn't contending and up against the cap.

It's okay to acknowledge someone made a good move without denigrating the other side. I'm pretty confident that there isn't a single other team in the league that would have thrown Broberg 9 million dollars. They're banking on him continuing to improve. I think he will. But he's also nowhere near proven himself as a top 4 defenseman.

Bro even when we were contending we were up against the cap and army made tough decisions let vetts walk or traded them so they could sign our rfas. Army did his job. We had a need and offered 4.5 for a kid who is in the same age range as our top two players and our new young guys reafy to come up. He will be top 4 here. Great move by army huge oversight by edm management.

 

[McJedi]

Actually, sports hernia injuries can be really tough to recover from, for a hockey player. Those/ groin injuries are kryptonite for a skating stride. I know of at least one NHL'er who never really made it back from his.

Any kind of super bad injury can end a career, but most of these hernia injuries are not that severe and recovery is far sooner than 9 months. There is no news out there that Kane has a career ending injury. Because he doesn't. He's getting the Ryan Johansen treatment of being told to shut his month and take a paycheck for doing nothing.

We know what's happening if Kane is out all year. PURE salary cap circumvention. The Oilers will just be the next team in a long line of them to pull this type of stunt. Hard to get mad at them for playing the same BS game as the others. The CBA allows this trash.

 

[Coffey]

Only thing I hate about this is that Broberg was very steady in the playoffs.
He had a weird calming presence and looking at it now, he wasn't a minus player in any game in the playoffs.

Shitty, but that's on our shitty management.

We know what's happening if Kane is out all year. Salary Cap circumvention. The Oilers will be just the next team to pull this type of stunt.

I f***ing hope so.

 

[TheShape]

IMO - if true this is on the Oilers front office. The Oilers had the ability to get the suggested deals done ($1.8 for Broberg and $1.2M for Holloway) and by waiting to finalize they let the Blues swoop in and put them between a rock and a hard place. If they were waiting to get the deals done because they were over the cap - that's a failure to understand how this situation exposes them to offersheets, even if they are rare.

These are roughly the figures I was expecting. The move was to trade Cody Ceci early in the offseason for a draft pick and split that money between Broberg/Holloway without much fuss.

Yeah, it's mismanagement, EDM thought they were going to squeeze the RFA pair, bail themselves out with a Kane LTIR and kick the can down the road midseason?

 

[Robtom18]

They have a month and a half to clear space, and with Kane going on LTIR matching either OS on its own isn't a problem.

You're acting like they have 7 days to make the cap work and they don't.

Lets try this say you sign both are 7.3 over cap tell me how to fix this who to trade. Cause kane isnt on ltir
Evander Kane
Kane has been dealing with a hip issue but there has not yet been a decision on whether or not he'll need surgery, Jason Gregor of Sports 1440 Edmonton reports.

Sooooooo shoot

 

[ManofSteel55]

My bad.
Thanks for the clarification.
I guess it just bumps the problem down the road.

It would be ideal to be cap compliant before putting Kane on LTIR so they can maximize their LTIR space throughout the year, but they can kick the can down the road by putting him on LTIR if they have to. They just need a solution for when he is ready to come off. It's a situation nobody really has the answer too though, because we don't know what injuries Kane has. There is the sports hernia that everyone knows about, but if there is something more, it could take him longer to return. There are rumours about hip surgeries, but I don't think those have been from anyone credible.