Stevens and Nachbaur Fired

[KINGS17]

Damn. All this disrespect for Zeus. He was more than filler.

To be fair Dean Lombardi described Handzus as a bridge player. Something he valued much more than a filler.

 

[Fishhead]

Wilson? Colin Wilson was signed as a 3rd line guy by COL, if that's who you mean, if you are talking about Tom Wilson, he was the Caps 1st round pick in 2016

DSP, Hunwick and Sesito fit what you are saying, Nash, Khudobin and Liles do not, it just seems as if you threw out names there....

You don't think Riley Nash, JM Liles, and a career backup aren't filler? Yea I got the Wilsons mixed up. But the point stands, just about every team signs these type of guys and it has zero bearing on whether they are rebuilding or not.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

You don't think Riley Nash, JM Liles, and a career backup aren't filler? Yea I got the Wilsons mixed up. But the point stands, just about every team signs these type of guys and it has zero bearing on whether they are rebuilding or not.

Riley Nash, 15 goals, 26 assists last year....no, I don't think of him as a filler,

JM Liles, 13 year career, 4 teams, definitely not a filler,

Khudobin, yea, I would call him as a filler, so 3 of the 7 ok....sure,

Point is you are saying every team signs these guys and it has zero bearing on they are rebuilding or not, and that's simply not the case.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Riley Nash wasn’t a 40+ point player when the Bruins signed him. He was a bottom six forward putting up 20ish points who exploded offensively last year. But I guess you knew he’d double up on his production.

Tom Gilbert, 11 year career, 4 teams. I guess similar to Liles, he definitely wasn’t a filler as well when the Kings signed him?

If Riley Nash, who was far less productive than Teddy Purcell at the time, isn’t considered filler, then neither is Purcell.

Applying your flawed logic here seems to support my point.

 

[Fishhead]

Riley Nash, 15 goals, 26 assists last year....no, I don't think of him as a filler,

JM Liles, 13 year career, 4 teams, definitely not a filler,

Khudobin, yea, I would call him as a filler, so 3 of the 7 ok....sure,

Point is you are saying every team signs these guys and it has zero bearing on they are rebuilding or not, and that's simply not the case.

Cmon, last year was an outlier for Nash. Before that his high was 25 points. Boston signed him after a 17 point season... That's filler. Setoguchi outproduced him that year while playing over 30 fewer games, not to mention he put up the same points as the tan crayon. He's got his role, but he's as replaceable as you can get. He's a low to mid 20 point guy.

At this point in his career, Liles is filler. Dude is a shadow of his former self. What he did 8 years ago is irrelevant.

Can you show me a team that doesn't sign these types of players? The three teams you mentioned are probably the best example, but even they have done it. Does that mean everyone is rebuilding?

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Cmon, last year was an outlier for Nash. Before that his high was 25 points. Boston signed him after a 17 point season... That's filler. Setoguchi outproduced him that year while playing over 30 fewer games, not to mention he put up the same points as the tan crayon. He's got his role, but he's as replaceable as you can get. He's a low to mid 20 point guy.

At this point in his career, Liles is filler. Dude is a shadow of his former self. What he did 8 years ago is irrelevant.

Can you show me a team that doesn't sign these types of players? The three teams you mentioned are probably the best example, but even they have done it. Does that mean everyone is rebuilding?

Notice how he ignores all the examples listed with the Caps signing a bunch of fillers, and he stretches the goal posts to make it seem like Liles was still an impact player in his mid-late 30s?

The guy is afraid to admit he’s wrong even when it’s obvious he has no clue what he’s talking about.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

Cmon, last year was an outlier for Nash. Before that his high was 25 points. Boston signed him after a 17 point season... That's filler. Setoguchi outproduced him that year while playing over 30 fewer games, not to mention he put up the same points as the tan crayon. He's got his role, but he's as replaceable as you can get. He's a low to mid 20 point guy.

At this point in his career, Liles is filler. Dude is a shadow of his former self. What he did 8 years ago is irrelevant.

Can you show me a team that doesn't sign these types of players? The three teams you mentioned are probably the best example, but even they have done it. Does that mean everyone is rebuilding?

This point in his career? Dude retired 2 years ago bud.....

No one is signing Liles....

When I get some time, and find the site that has transactions, I will show you teams that haven not signed "filler" players.....Nash isn't a filler player, Liles certainly wasn't a filler player, it's not about what he did 8 years ago, it's the fact that he's had a 13 year career with 4 teams, that's not a filler player, thats like saying Ray Bourque was a filler player because he signed with Colorado

 

[Kingsfan1]

Others could see it though. It wasn't hard to see what was happening.

Dean Lombardi Leading the Los Angeles Kings to a Complete Rebuild

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/04/21/AR2006042101390_pf.html

FROM THE DESK OF DEAN LOMBARDI

Recognized by others as a rebuild.

Comparing The Oilers Rebuild To Dean Lombardi's Work With The L.A. Kings

Shortly before his firing Lombardi was discussing reinventing the organization. Instead we get the Luc and Rob show.

LA Kings GM Dean Lombardi: “You Can’t Re-Create, You Have To Re-Invent”

Your last 2 sentences is why I miss Lombardi. He has a great mind for the game and knows what he’s doing . Sure he f***ed us up bad with major mistakes but he brought us 2 Cups. He said he was reinventing and I would have loved to see what he could have done. Might have been gone to soon. Sutter had to go but I wish Lombardi was still GM

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

Notice how he ignores all the examples listed with the Caps signing a bunch of fillers, and he stretches the goal posts to make it seem like Liles was still an impact player in his mid-late 30s?

The guy is afraid to admit he’s wrong even when it’s obvious he has no clue what he’s talking about.

Here ya go, here's the Caps....."filler" signings,

Anthony Peluso (waived 2 months later)
Devante Smith Pelley
John Albert (waived 2 months later)
Wayne Simpson
Alex Chiasson

That's in 2017

In 2018

Signed
Jayson Megna (waived 2 months later)
Michael Sgborssa (waived 2 months later)
Nic Dowd
Brooks Orpik


So yea, I mean, if you want to say EVERY team signs free agents, go for it....but not sure what your point is....they didn't sign Dowd as a filler so they can trade Backstrom....or Orpik so they can trade Carlsson

 

[KINGS17]

Your last 2 sentences is why I miss Lombardi. He has a great mind for the game and knows what he’s doing . Sure he ****ed us up bad with major mistakes but he brought us 2 Cups. He said he was reinventing and I would have loved to see what he could have done. Might have been gone to soon. Sutter had to go but I wish Lombardi was still GM

I am obviously a strong believer in the approach Dean Lombardi took with building the Kings into contenders.

I understand why he was fired, but I hope he is given another opportunity somewhere to build a contender again. I think Dean is very good at critical self evaluation, and I think he learned quite a bit in his last few seasons with the Kings.

 

[Fishhead]

Here ya go, here's the Caps....."filler" signings,

Anthony Peluso (waived 2 months later)
Devante Smith Pelley
John Albert (waived 2 months later)
Wayne Simpson
Alex Chiasson

That's in 2017

In 2018

Signed
Jayson Megna (waived 2 months later)
Michael Sgborssa (waived 2 months later)
Nic Dowd
Brooks Orpik


So yea, I mean, if you want to say EVERY team signs free agents, go for it....but not sure what your point is....they didn't sign Dowd as a filler so they can trade Backstrom....or Orpik so they can trade Carlsson

The point was, every team makes these kind of signings. Saying they are an indicator of any type of rebuild is patently false by that very fact. You used these types of signings as evidence that Lombardi may have been moving towards a rebuild, which is not the case. Lombardi wasn't doing anything different than other teams when he got here with those types of bridge/filler signings, whatever you want to call them. Rebuilders do them, contenders do them, bubble teams do them.

The real indicator that Lombardi was rebuilding was taking his older guys and using them to compile assets like the Demitra trade (POS + 1st), the Johnson trade (Belanger, Gleason), the Stoll/Greene trade (Visnovsky). It had nothing to do with bridge/filler/fluff signings, those happen all the time.

Getting caught up in the semantics over who is filler and who is not just detracts from the original discussion.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

The point was, every team makes these kind of signings. Saying they are an indicator of any type of rebuild is patently false by that very fact. You used these types of signings as evidence that Lombardi may have been moving towards a rebuild, which is not the case. Lombardi wasn't doing anything different than other teams when he got here with those types of bridge/filler signings, whatever you want to call them. Rebuilders do them, contenders do them, bubble teams do them.

The real indicator that Lombardi was rebuilding was taking his older guys and using them to compile assets like the Demitra trade (POS + 1st), the Johnson trade (Belanger, Gleason), the Stoll/Greene trade (Visnovsky). It had nothing to do with bridge/filler/fluff signings, those happen all the time.

Getting caught up in the semantics over who is filler and who is not just detracts from the original discussion.

Except, I just showed you a team that DOESNT do them, but ok.

I clearly said that you couldn't tell what he was going to do because he was never able to finish it, but what he was doing, RESEMBLED what he did in the past....and Ziggy there seized on that and said no no no, Lombardi definitely wasn...yadda yadda yadda....which is about as accurate as you saying that EVERY team signs players like Setoguchi, etc which is demonstrably false.....show me when Washington, or Pittsburgh, signed a Handzus type player that allowed them to deal a Demitra type, or a Liles type player to trade a Johnson....

Those are what filler players are for...for you to say they have NOTHING to do with the trades, is nonsensical at best.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

He just compared the Bruins adding John-Michael Liles to the Avs adding Ray Bourque.

I’m done here.

 

[Sleeping Dog]

Except, I just showed you a team that DOESNT do them, but ok.

I clearly said that you couldn't tell what he was going to do because he was never able to finish it, but what he was doing, RESEMBLED what he did in the past....and Ziggy there seized on that and said no no no, Lombardi definitely wasn...yadda yadda yadda....which is about as accurate as you saying that EVERY team signs players like Setoguchi, etc which is demonstrably false.....show me when Washington, or Pittsburgh, signed a Handzus type player that allowed them to deal a Demitra type, or a Liles type player to trade a Johnson....

Those are what filler players are for...for you to say they have NOTHING to do with the trades, is nonsensical at best.

Don’t forget many of these signings/PTOs are a means for teams to have the required number of veterans playing during preseason games. Most don’t make the team. M

 

[Fishhead]

Except, I just showed you a team that DOESNT do them, but ok.

I clearly said that you couldn't tell what he was going to do because he was never able to finish it, but what he was doing, RESEMBLED what he did in the past....and Ziggy there seized on that and said no no no, Lombardi definitely wasn...yadda yadda yadda....which is about as accurate as you saying that EVERY team signs players like Setoguchi, etc which is demonstrably false.....show me when Washington, or Pittsburgh, signed a Handzus type player that allowed them to deal a Demitra type, or a Liles type player to trade a Johnson....

Those are what filler players are for...for you to say they have NOTHING to do with the trades, is nonsensical at best.

Pittsburgh or Washington aren’t signing those guys to make trades, they are doing it to try to win because they aren’t rebuilding. The difference is that Lombardi did it initially to rebuild, hence getting younger assets. He did the same type of trades later, but he wasn’t getting young assets, they were getting older. so there is no way a rebuild was in the works. We know how he rebuilds, and it was completely different than what he was doing when he was fired.

I’m done with this, it’s tiring to deal with moving goalposts. You didn’t show me a team that doesn’t sign those types of players, that was covered above.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

Pittsburgh or Washington aren’t signing those guys to make trades, they are doing it to try to win because they aren’t rebuilding. The difference is that Lombardi did it initially to rebuild, hence getting younger assets. He did the same type of trades later, but he wasn’t getting young assets, they were getting older. so there is no way a rebuild was in the works. We know how he rebuilds, and it was completely different than what he was doing when he was fired.

I’m done with this, it’s tiring to deal with moving goalposts. You didn’t show me a team that doesn’t sign those types of players, that was covered above.

LOL your right, Lombardi signed those filler players....to...win with.... its like you have zero idea of what a filler player actually is ffs.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

Don’t forget many of these signings/PTOs are a means for teams to have the required number of veterans playing during preseason games. Most don’t make the team. M

Exactly, a lot of them are waived in camp as camp progresses, a lot of them are also on two ways so they fill the AHL team etc.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

He just compared the Bruins adding John-Michael Liles to the Avs adding Ray Bourque.

I’m done here.

You were done when you failed to recognize what the word resemblance meant....

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

 

[Pandaman11]

Quenneville is available? We could've waited a few days with that Stevens firing...

 

[Bandit]

Still not sure why we kept Lowry, was that explained anywhere?

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Still not sure why we kept Lowry, was that explained anywhere?

I just figured no one ever saw him so they forgot to fire him.

 

[Kingspiracy]

Didnt wd say that he'd worked with lowry before? Perhaps he wanted to keep him onboard

 

[KingsOfCali25]

I am obviously a strong believer in the approach Dean Lombardi took with building the Kings into contenders.

I understand why he was fired, but I hope he is given another opportunity somewhere to build a contender again. I think Dean is very good at critical self evaluation, and I think he learned quite a bit in his last few seasons with the Kings.

After that first cup win; Dean said that he knows how to build a team to contend but he didn't know what to do after winning the cup because he's never gotten that far. He knew he was going to struggle after that cup was won. He just didn't adapt fast enough. You could tell where the league was headed by the players coming out of the draft (Mackinnon, Johnny Hockey), but Dean kept picking guys like Auger, McDermid).

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

After that first cup win; Dean said that he knows how to build a team to contend but he didn't know what to do after winning the cup because he's never gotten that far. He knew he was going to struggle after that cup was won. He just didn't adapt fast enough. You could tell where the league was headed by the players coming out of the draft (Mackinnon, Johnny Hockey), but Dean kept picking guys like Auger, McDermid).

Not sure if comparing 1st rounders to 4th and 5th rounders is the best idea