OT: Star Wars: The Last Jedi Discussion Thread (SPOILERS!!!!)

[Protest]

I need to see it again. It was so different. It didn't feel like a Star Wars movie, which is fine. The Leia thing was annoying as hell, as was the bomber thing where she was just chilling next to an open door into space.

That said there were some really awesome scenes and I liked grumpy Luke as well as the jokes and the ending scenes.

 

[Protest]

I think Kylo can carry it because Luke has moved on to a force ghost, so there's no one left. I don't like the underdevelopment of Snoke. That's probably my biggest criticism, the Leia thing was just kind of an annoyance more than a critical issue.

 

[whitstifier]

It's dumb that Ren gets somewhat of a redemption arc. He did some terrible things that don't make any sense. (The "it's Snoke, not Ben" comments by Leia last episode were pathetic. No, Leia, your kid's an asshole like his dad. Wake up)

Meanwhile, Poe and Finn become less relevant. The two characters I was most interested in...

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

It's dumb that Ren gets somewhat of a redemption arc. He did some terrible things that don't make any sense. (The "it's Snoke, not Ben" comments by Leia last episode were pathetic. No, Leia, your kid's an ******* like his dad. Wake up)

Meanwhile, Poe and Finn become less relevant. The two characters I was most interested in...

I mean, Poe is going to be the leader of the Resistance... that isn’t exactly irrelevant.

 

[whitstifier]

I mean, Poe is going to be the leader of the Resistance... that isn’t exactly irrelevant.

Oh, that's news! I haven't actually seen the movie. Just giving hottakes from secondary sources

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

Oh, that's news! I haven't actually seen the movie. Just giving hottakes from secondary sources

It’s more just his character arc from this movie and the impending Leia death with Carrie Fisher being no longer with us.

 

[mja]

It's dumb that Ren gets somewhat of a redemption arc. He did some terrible things that don't make any sense. (The "it's Snoke, not Ben" comments by Leia last episode were pathetic. No, Leia, your kid's an ******* like his dad. Wake up)

Meanwhile, Poe and Finn become less relevant. The two characters I was most interested in...

I mean, Kylo Ren's kind of on an anti-redemption arc.

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

I mean, Kylo Ren's kind of on an anti-redemption arc.

Until he redeems himself in the last movie that everyone knows he will.

“No ones ever really lost.” -Luke Skywalker.

 

[Frickley]

The movie was solid.

I do think Kylo is just a poorly written character. His party piece is basically just getting mad and throwing things. As a villain, he just doesn't worry you at all. Snoke was completely bungled as well; poor quality, terrible development. The scripts in general have bothered me in the new films--corny jokes that don't come close the dry humor of Lucas' characters, IMO. Poe and Rose were especially cringey for me.

I have little to say against the plot, though (besides Kylo's annoyingly obvious stupidity.) It kept you engaged, was full of surprises, and had nice emotion. Ridley and Hamill gave quality performances.

 

[Sombastate]

When Leia flew like Mary Poppins, i basically gave up on the movie for about 15 minutes.

I think the movie was fine, but thats about as good as it can possibly be, IMO.

 

[Protest]

When Leia flew like Mary Poppins, i basically gave up on the movie for about 15 minutes.

I think the movie was fine, but thats about as good as it can possibly be, IMO.

Lol I said out loud "well I'm done." I had to reel myself back in.

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

Lol I said out loud "well I'm done." I had to reel myself back in.

I laughed out loud and shook my head. Then the second time I saw it I just looked around to see people’s reactions. Hilarious.

 

[trostol]

sounds like they need to do a Poe solo story movie

 

[Protest]

I actually thought Kylo was much better in this move vs the non masked Kylo of the last movie

 

[Rebels57]

Just got back from seeing it and I loved it! A little slow in the middle but overall I thought it was awesome.

That Praetorian Guard fight scene might be the best in the entire series.

 

[mja]

Until he redeems himself in the last movie that everyone knows he will.

“No ones ever really lost.” -Luke Skywalker.

I'm not so sure that that's going to happen, and I'm hopeful that it won't. The tragedy of what is essentially an immensely powerful misfit manchild being unable to overcome his rage, and staying lost, is something the series really hasn't examined before. Vader doesn't count, because we see him redeemed before we ever meet him as Anakin. And the prequels just suck anyway.

In general, I think the Kylo Ren character is greatly underrated. I love that Ren isn't some traditional big bad villain, all power and pure evil. No, he's deeply conflicted, emotionally weak even, and he can strongly feel the pull of the light side (and can even act like a decent person from time to time), and yet STILL chooses the dark, because it's his only way to feel not scared. He's a flawed villain, if you will, and far more interesting than most film villains. By contrast, think about all of the forgettable villains in the prequels.

I'm also a fan of Driver's performances in both films. His work here, especially, is the kind of performance that was sorely needed by Hayden Christiansen in the prequels.

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

I'm not so sure that that's going to happen, and I'm hopeful that it won't. The tragedy of what is essentially an immensely powerful misfit manchild being unable to overcome his rage, and staying lost, is something the series really hasn't examined before. Vader doesn't count, because we see him redeemed before we ever meet him as Anakin. And the prequels just suck anyway.

In general, I think the Kylo Ren character is greatly underrated. I love that Ren isn't some traditional big bad villain, all power and pure evil. No, he's deeply conflicted, emotionally weak even, and he can strongly feel the pull of the light side (and can even act like a decent person from time to time), and yet STILL chooses the dark, because it's his only way to feel not scared. He's a flawed villain, if you will, and far more interesting than most film villains. By contrast, think about all of the forgettable villains in the prequels.

I'm also a fan of Driver's performances in both films. His work here, especially, is the kind of performance that was sorely needed by Hayden Christiansen in the prequels.

Oh, I absolutely love the character. He’s probably one of, if not, my favorite characters in the series. I just don’t think Disney has the balls to keep him on the Dark Side. They want Kylo and Rey together.

And honestly? How are they not going to redeem him? He’s already failed in the first two movies so unless they just make him fail all over again in a third movie. What’s the point? (Fail in terms of taking down the Resistance)

 

[mja]

Oh, I absolutely love the character. He’s probably one of, if not, my favorite characters in the series. I just don’t think Disney has the balls to keep him on the Dark Side. They want Kylo and Rey together.

I don't know that those two ideas are necessarily mutually exclusive.

And honestly? How are they not going to redeem him? He’s already failed in the first two movies so unless they just make him fail all over again in a third movie. What’s the point? (Fail in terms of taking down the Resistance)

Eh, he's failed up. He started off as a Darth Vader wannabe and is now the undisputed Supreme Leader of the First Order. He's surpassed his idol.

He's got to die in the next film, right? So they can either redeem him in the climax a la Vader or they can make his death a tragic lost opportunity at redemption at the hands of his soul mate in a light saber battle to the death. I'd vastly prefer the latter.

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

I don't know that those two ideas are necessarily mutually exclusive.

Eh, he's failed up. He started off as a Darth Vader wannabe and is now the undisputed Supreme Leader of the First Order. He's surpassed his idol.

He's got to die in the next film, right? So they can either redeem him in the climax a la Vader or they can make his death a tragic lost opportunity at redemption at the hands of his soul mate in a light saber battle to the death. I'd vastly prefer the latter.

I just meant that he failed with destroying the Resistance at every turn. So now all of a sudden we’re to think that there’s some actual chance that he can defeat them? (Which is moot anyway, because the good guys always win anyway). He definitely succeeded in rising to power.

I really hope he does die going down as full fledged evil but I have my doubts.

I expect something like the Knights of Ren to be his Praetorian Guards only for Rey to show up and Kylo kill them after Rey struggles. Ala Rey’s vision when she touched Anakin’s lightsaber. There’s the scene where the Knights of Ren are standing there and someone (maybe a KoR) goes to attack where Rey “is” and Ren stabs him/her from behind. So who knows. Maybe we already saw it.

 

[Protest]

I mean the good guys are going to win in the end but have they really won yet in this trilogy? They blew up the giant death star but that was after it destroyed a bunch of planets and the republic. And in this one they escape with like 30 people left alive. Not to mention Han is dead and Luke has moved on to be a force ghost.

 

[BritainStix]

The films were enjoyable, but gah, the plot lines suck eh?

Film 1 - Death star 3
Film 2 - ehhh, lots of people die, new bad guy, no real plot development

It really managed to feel like a really long film, while still being rushed. The writing has been pretty poor. I wish they had just lined up the same director for all 3 films, at least we would of had the consistency.

 

[DrinkFightFlyers]

Shocked by some of the reactions here. Thought it was maybe the 2nd best film in the entire series.

I loved Grumpy Old Jedi.

Didn't mind Leia using the force to get back to the ship, for me it was a weirdly moving meta-moment, almost as if it was wishing Carrie Fisher back from beyond.

I love Rey's parents being nobodies and even more that they're apparently morally dubious enough to sell off their own daughter.

I actually like the idea of Kylo Ren being the big bad. I like how it subverted expectations. I also like what it says about the nature of evil, that it can be (is?) rooted in petty adolescent fears, jealousy, and rage. My 14 year old daughter, who was expecting and desperately hoping for a Vaderesque redemptive arc for that character, is completely crushed.

My only problems:

1) We need some kind of backstory on Snoke. Who the **** was this guy?
2) Luke's end. I'm VERY conflicted about the end of his arc. I understand why it makes sense on a story-level, but on a movie-level this lifelong fan really want to see Luke being a complete badass in a light saber duel, and I didn't really get that.

I loved how it ended, although I am conflicted with the continuity of it all. So if Jedi can project themselves, why haven't we seen that in the prior seven movies? Seems like it could have come in handy.

Best criticism that I've seen so far (and by best I mean funniest), is that a large plot point was the First Order was just waiting for the rebels to run out of gas.

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

I loved how it ended, although I am conflicted with the continuity of it all. So if Jedi can project themselves, why haven't we seen that in the prior seven movies? Seems like it could have come in handy.

Best criticism that I've seen so far (and by best I mean funniest), is that a large plot point was the First Order was just waiting for the rebels to run out of gas.

I mean Luke did project himself but he didn't actually do much besides distract the First Order letting the Resistance get away.

If you notice, his lightsaber never made contact with Ren's. So really he was just there as a distraction and he did everything he could to make sure that Ren didn't actually make contact with him and the jig would be up.

 

[Protest]

I loved how it ended, although I am conflicted with the continuity of it all. So if Jedi can project themselves, why haven't we seen that in the prior seven movies? Seems like it could have come in handy.

Best criticism that I've seen so far (and by best I mean funniest), is that a large plot point was the First Order was just waiting for the rebels to run out of gas.

....you're going to make me do this in sort of public aren't you. At least you all don't actually know who I am so you can't publicly shame me for my level of geek.

Jedi/Sith can project themselves or any image for that matter. It's actually a Sith thing, they used it in battle to invade planets, capture cities etc. They would project ships or something that the enemy would go fight. Although they actually had to be there to project it, I never read anything about them doing it from across the galaxy. That said, all of that is actually not canon anymore, which I'm still mad about because if there's ever a chance to win something through Star Wars expanded universe trivia I'm SOL now.

 

[Flyrs21]

Maybe force projecting leads to death and that's why we've never seen it before.

The more I've been thinking about the movie the more i think it was a big pile of dog poop. Finn and Poes storylines were pointless....Finn really didn't do anything and Poe was basically told he was an idiot by Leia and whoever took over for her but at the end it looks like he's going to take over as general of the resistance... Maybe it was a learning lesson for him. I enjoyed anything with Rey in it.

The Hoth type battle, instead of snow it was salt and Jedi throne room scene being rehashed bugged me a little. I'll be seeing it again with a buddy so maybe my opinion will change.