Movies: Star Wars: Rogue One Part II Release date Dec 14th

[tacogeoff]

Final watched it today. A great stand alone film for the franchise. I enjoyed it but for me personally it wasn't as well done as TFA. The characters for me were rushed, the vador scene in the middle was quite cheesy but still a great second half of action. Probably would watch again but not buy for home.

 

[NyQuil]

Just saw it.

It had its moments but the pacing was very inconsistent.

It was rushing about and then it plodded on Jedha for some reason.

I couldn't care less about Forrest Whittaker's character and they pulled that immediately introduce a guy and then kill him off right away thing that they did in Force Awakens.

Then they arbitrarily decide to team up and then hate each other before becoming best friends (little sister?) minutes later. A shame they couldn't have been a squad for a period of time to build some bonds.

With so much ground to cover and so many characters to introduce, I'm not sure why they had to delve into the childhood thing like they do for every other Star Wars movie. It seemed half-hearted.

Tarkin was a bit jarring because the CGI still isn't QUITE there but he's a good character and was voiced well enough that I forgave it. Leia was a bit creepy.

I did like:

-Darth Vader kicking ass and taking names
-the reprogrammed Imperial droid
-the incredible and gorgeous combined arms battle sequence at the end
-the squad were actually pretty good characters - not a lot of time to delve into them but they were a likeable bunch
-the little nods to Star Wars (Red Leader and Gold Leader were the same guys? Yavin IV...Red Five blowing up (a position in Red Squadron has just opened up for Luke))
-they did manage to pull off the heroics "suicide mission" dirty dozen type atmosphere at the end

 

[MikeyMike01]

Jyn's lame speech that she gives to the rebels is an example of how poorly her character arc is handled. It's forced, unnatural, and really cheesy (even for Star Wars). It was completely out of character from what we'd seen from her up until that point.

Also, she's really boring.

And yet still better than the infinitely horrible Rey...

 

[firewagonHOCKEY]

I saw it yesterday . I liked it. It was very beautiful and the CGI was amazing.

It reminded me of a samurai movie, disgraced Ronin out for redemption. The Asian actors added to that theme.

 

[TootooTrain]

And yet still better than the infinitely horrible Rey...

Sarcasm?

Saw the movie over the weekend myself. Like others have said it was an interesting first 10-15min, then a bit of a drawn out storyline, followed by a frantic second half.

As for Jyn's speech at the rebel headquarters, you have to remember at that point she wanted to do right by her father. That would make anyone here do crazy things. I thought her character in general was okay. Not great, not terrible, just sort of meh. I enjoyed the rest of the rag tag bunch of rebels more to be honest. It had more staying power throughout the movie. Jyn's character and the connection to the death star plans was more a vessel to get us through the story of what actually happened during the war in a real way.

The CGI on Tarkin was good....but...I wish they didn't use him as much as they did. With these cgi faces the more time they have on screen the more you start to nitpick things facially. The Leia cgi was a bit creepy but it was only for a few seconds so I'll give it a pass.

Overall I'd sit through that first half over and over again if it means I get to see the latter. Just a fantastic battle sequence with homages to the past. (technically future). Will watch again at some point but maybe not for a while.

 

[MadDevil]

Jyn lost two father figures (Galen and Saw), who both gave their lives for a greater cause. It's not that shocking that she would want to finish what they started.

 

[vdB]

Jyn lost two father figures (Galen and Saw), who both gave their lives for a greater cause. It's not that shocking that she would want to finish what they started.

Exactly! Well said.

Anyone who disagrees with this is an idiot

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

Jyn lost two father figures (Galen and Saw), who both gave their lives for a greater cause. It's not that shocking that she would want to finish what they started.

Given that Jyn hadn't seen one for 15 years or whatever and was pissed at the other because he left her behind- and also didn't seem to give a crap when he died, which conflicts with Jyn' s over the top, cliche reaction to Galen- it's more than fair to question the use of a father figure as a dramatic motivation tool here. Not that it doesn't make sense, just that, is it the best way to structure the film?

Then you throw in that her character was somewhat vaguely defined to begin with (cutting immediately to prison was an awful idea, one of the very few in this film) and you get a half baked arc.

The big dumb speech doesn't work for multiple reasons: the subtext is awful (she's basically saying, "C'mon guys, just trust me on this, plz, c'mon guys"); in terms of arcs she shouldn't be speaking as she was never strongly defined as being jaded or cynical, 2hereas Cassian was and thus the speech could symbolize his transition (and idiotic staging aside I was fine with said speech that came later); three minutes earlier Jyn was furious with the Rebels for killing her father, and is now begging them to help her- wouldn't it have been great if a rebel made a snide remark about her father and she snaps at him, but this loses the crowd; and finally, pet Peeve but still, there is no reason on a surface level that Jyn Etso should be monologuing. For one, none of the Rebel leaders would let each other talk 12 seconds earlier but now they let her talk; for two, why would they all shut up for some person they don't know? This doesn't really matter, I just hate it when stories have different rules for protagonist. Hell, Pirates of the Carribbean: At World's End spent the entire 1st half of the film building up to the correct point so when Kierra Knightly pulled this it would make perfect sense.

 

[TootooTrain]

Given that Jyn hadn't seen one for 15 years or whatever and was pissed at the other because he left her behind- and also didn't seem to give a crap when he died, which conflicts with Jyn' s over the top, cliche reaction to Galen- it's more than fair to question the use of a father figure as a dramatic motivation tool here. Not that it doesn't make sense, just that, is it the best way to structure the film?

It doesn't conflict with anything. As far as she could have known, he was dead. Seeing the face of your parent for the first time in a dozen years, one that you thought was gone forever, is bound to kick up emotion I don't care how disconnected they were at the time. The parent/child relationship as a tool is as common as the sun.

 

[Finlandia WOAT]

It doesn't conflict with anything.

Yeah, it does. She doesn't care that saw dies, but freaks out when Galen does? Why?

As far as she could have known, he was dead. Seeing the face of your parent for the first time in a dozen years, one that you thought was gone forever, is bound to kick up emotion I don't care how disconnected they were at the time. The parent/child relationship as a tool is as common as the sun.

It doesn't work as a dramatic device if you merely assume the audience will understand. I'm not saying Jyn screaming over the carcass of her father is implausible (nevermind the annoying contradiction above), I'm saying it doesn't elicit emotion or comes off as fake and cheesy if you don't put in the dramatic work. The hologram was a good step in this direction, but not enough .

Unfortunately, in this particular point there is no way to fix it With Out massive structural rewrites- because playing the "Beloved family member is dead!" Card for emotional pathos doesn't work if two characters have all of one scene and 5 words spoken to each other in the damn film before said moment. Perhaps, instead of dropping Jyn into the prison, you show the crime that led yhere- for instance, she met an informant with information on her father but it went to crap. Or a bonding scene between Jyn and Cassian where she discusses what it will be like to be United with her father. Wouldn't it be great if she were telling Cassian the conflicting emotions, her excitement, and Cassian, clearly uncomfortable, nevertheless empathize by saying he, too, lost his parents to the Empure at a young age (which is what I think they were going for)? But they don't do the work.

 

[les Habs]

I'm just curious, I've read here and in reviews that it's a stand alone film, but specifically I'm wondering if the film works literally by itself. So say you've never seen a single Star Wars film before and don't know about anything Star Wars. Could you see this film and still "understand it" if you will?

 

[chicagoskycam]

I'm just curious, I've read here and in reviews that it's a stand alone film, but specifically I'm wondering if the film works literally by itself. So say you've never seen a single Star Wars film before and don't know about anything Star Wars. Could you see this film and still "understand it" if you will?

Mmm, you could of course but some of the best parts will be lacking for you.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

I'm just curious, I've read here and in reviews that it's a stand alone film, but specifically I'm wondering if the film works literally by itself. So say you've never seen a single Star Wars film before and don't know about anything Star Wars. Could you see this film and still "understand it" if you will?

Yes you could. Long story short it ties into the first movie released in 1977. There is more meaning and it makes more sense if you've watched the other movies but IMO it could still be enjoyed otherwise.

 

[les Habs]

Mmm, you could of course but some of the best parts will be lacking for you.

Yes you could. Long story short it ties into the first movie released in 1977. There is more meaning and it makes more sense if you've watched the other movies but IMO it could still be enjoyed otherwise.

Thanks. Where I'm coming from is I feel as though I'll like this one and it looks like one of the best of the entire franchise. Having lost a fairly good deal of passion for Star Wars after the last four films (and as I've gotten older I suppose) I just wonder if the side films such as this might tempt me more. I also think of say Skyfall. The rest of the Craig Bond films don't do anything for more, but that film I did enjoy and feel as though so long as you have a basic understanding of Bond it works really well as a stand alone film. So I'm wondering if Rogue One might stand up to repeated viewings for me, assuming I do enjoy it, so that I wouldn't just feel the need to also watch the other films.

 

[The Drop]

Was even worse on the second view

 

[chicagoskycam]

Not sure if it was discussed but it feels like that last scene with Vader was added after some studio head probably complained - not enough Vader - still pretty awesome but why is he entering the ship alone???

Thing that bothered me - that battle seemed like a rather dangerous place for the Princess to be. Would rather the plans were sent to her away from the battle and the Empire traced them.

 

[chicagoskycam]

Thanks. Where I'm coming from is I feel as though I'll like this one and it looks like one of the best of the entire franchise. Having lost a fairly good deal of passion for Star Wars after the last four films (and as I've gotten older I suppose) I just wonder if the side films such as this might tempt me more. I also think of say Skyfall. The rest of the Craig Bond films don't do anything for more, but that film I did enjoy and feel as though so long as you have a basic understanding of Bond it works really well as a stand alone film. So I'm wondering if Rogue One might stand up to repeated viewings for me, assuming I do enjoy it, so that I wouldn't just feel the need to also watch the other films.

But you have seen the original three, right?

 

[MadDevil]

Not sure if it was discussed but it feels like that last scene with Vader was added after some studio head probably complained - not enough Vader - still pretty awesome but why is he entering the ship alone???

Thing that bothered me - that battle seemed like a rather dangerous place for the Princess to be. Would rather the plans were sent to her away from the battle and the Empire traced them.

The logistics of the ending sequence don't really make a lot of sense if you think about it. Bail trusted Leia to go get Obi-Wan, but then why is she in the Tantive IV riding piggyback on the flagship going into the middle of the battle?

Then there's the whole "this a consular ship, we're on a diplomatic mission" line in ANH when like 15 minutes earlier Vader was slaughtering Rebels as they got the plans to the ship, and then he saw them leave. I don't think he's going to buy that one Antilles.

Don't get me wrong, it was a cool sequence, and it didn't really detract from the movie for me, but they could have maybe made the direct connection to ANH a little smoother.

 

[ArGarBarGar]

I'm just curious, I've read here and in reviews that it's a stand alone film, but specifically I'm wondering if the film works literally by itself. So say you've never seen a single Star Wars film before and don't know about anything Star Wars. Could you see this film and still "understand it" if you will?

It doesn't, really. Vader's inclusion in the movie would make even less sense.

 

[Tawnos]

The logistics of the ending sequence don't really make a lot of sense if you think about it. Bail trusted Leia to go get Obi-Wan, but then why is she in the Tantive IV riding piggyback on the flagship going into the middle of the battle?

Then there's the whole "this a consular ship, we're on a diplomatic mission" line in ANH when like 15 minutes earlier Vader was slaughtering Rebels as they got the plans to the ship, and then he saw them leave. I don't think he's going to buy that one Antilles.

Don't get me wrong, it was a cool sequence, and it didn't really detract from the movie for me, but they could have maybe made the direct connection to ANH a little smoother.

Yeah, there are some weird things. How did Vader track them down so easily over Tatooine? It's pretty clear that they can't simply track ships through hyperspace, otherwise they wouldn't need to put a homing device on the Millenium Falcon in ANH. Yes, Scarif is in the Outer Rim just like Tatooine, but the Tantive IV does jump into hyperspace. We know she went there to look for Obi Wan. How did the Empire figure out where she was?

I supposed it's possible that she arrives at Tatooine and there are already Imperial ships there. They, then, send a message to Vader who comes right away. My point is that it does end up begging the question, which is essentially the same point you're making.

 

[Blender]

It doesn't, really. Vader's inclusion in the movie would make even less sense.

I agree. This movie is called a standalone film but it really isn't. It ties into other characters and events in the franchise too much for it to be.

 

[Tawnos]

I agree. This movie is called a standalone film but it really isn't. It ties into other characters and events in the franchise too much for it to be.

There are two definitions of standalone, I think. What this discussion is about is whether or not it works without other movies, which it doesn't.

I think what's intended when Disney refers to this as a standalone is that it isn't part of the main story arc. Depending on the story, it could tie neatly into the main arc, like Rogue One does, or not, like an early Yoda story might not (there are rumors of a Yoda standalone). Essentially, think of a standalone as being a one-off for the main characters in that movie.

 

[chicagoskycam]

The logistics of the ending sequence don't really make a lot of sense if you think about it. Bail trusted Leia to go get Obi-Wan, but then why is she in the Tantive IV riding piggyback on the flagship going into the middle of the battle?

Then there's the whole "this a consular ship, we're on a diplomatic mission" line in ANH when like 15 minutes earlier Vader was slaughtering Rebels as they got the plans to the ship, and then he saw them leave. I don't think he's going to buy that one Antilles.

Don't get me wrong, it was a cool sequence, and it didn't really detract from the movie for me, but they could have maybe made the direct connection to ANH a little smoother.

That's what I was thinking unless they got away for a while and assumed another Star Destroyer picked them up. Anyways, I don't think she should have been at the battle, all signs in ANH point to her just receiving the plans. Again I would have had the plans transmitting to her a bit away from the battle, she gets going - light speed fails or something and boom a ANH. It bothers me that nobody producing the movie thinks about the beginning of ANH here.

So the other option is a bit of time passed and they caught up with her. She didn't know Vader had slaughtered a bunch of people which is strange because they were running the Death Star plans relay to get them to her.

 

[chicagoskycam]

Was even worse on the second view

So you didn't like the movie where you pretty much knew what was going to happen the 1st time, so the 2nd time where you knew everything you still didn't like it.

I'm shocked!

 

[les Habs]

But you have seen the original three, right?

Yes, I have.