Some players do care about trying to win Cups more than money. Stutzle says he took a discount

[bert]

coming off a 58 point season he said he knows he could have gotten $10 million


Yeah Ok

If he believed in himself and waited to sign this season he is certainly making 10+ . But as he said it was a fair contract that he signed.

 

[Breakers]

It is outlandish considering he signed that contract with a career high 58 points and got 8M - so to suggest he took a discount is false.

The contract becoming a discount over the course of the contract is different than taking a discount when you signed.

Especially if you consider what contracts were signed that same offseason by Ottawa
Josh Norris signed that same offseason for a shade under $8 million
125 GP
90 points

Tim Stutzle signed for like $8.2 I believe or something like that.
132 GP
87 Points

 

[CascadiaPuck]

I’ve never really understood the mentality of needing to get every dollar for super star players. I get it for the low to mid tier guys, but does making 10 mill over 8 mill a year really create a lifestyle change? The 2 mill cap space can certainly impact the roster around you.

I guess maybe the ego aspect of being highest paid or whatever.

Would you take a pay cut at your job so that the company could invest more into hiring good people in other areas or invest more into advertising or sales or R&D? That would help the team succeed.

I happen to agree that it’s different stakes with players pulling in this much money - and I do believe players already set for life will leave some on the table to fulfill their dreams. But it’s a “**** you, pay me” world in a lot of ways and there’s a real risk of being played for a sucker if you don’t earn what you can.

 

[The Crypto Guy]

What he said might have some merit if he took a 4M contract. He wasn't getting 10M+ lmao.

 

[Guttersniped]

Literally no one is vilifying Stuzle.

I'm saying don't brag about taking a "discount" when you're making as much money as he's making.

And just to be clear, discussing an internal cap isn’t bragging. The Devils GM has discussed quite a bit while recently signing his RFAs. Stutzle didn’t invent this idea. Boston is good example of team with internal cap.

This delicacy over guys discussing an employee who makes 8m salary is bizarre when teams are owned by multi-billionaires. The players should share more of the profits, if anything, they make the league possible.

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

On what planet was he getting 10-11 million?

One in which he scores 39 goals and 90 pts in 78 games as a 20/21 yr old?

Matthews got 11.6mil with a career high of 40 goals & 73 pts (44 g & 88pt pace in a full season). Marner got almost $11mil after a comparable season (13 more goals, 4 fewer points). Tavares got $11mil (and apparently took a discount) and has never matched that point total. Barkov got $10mil with a similar career high. Eichel got $10mil and still has never matched Stü's career high in goals or points.

That planet?

Literally no one is vilifying Stuzle.

I'm saying don't brag about taking a "discount" when you're making as much money as he's making.

Do you think maybe..... he was responding to a question?

Which team do you think is in better shape right now, Ottawa or Arizona?

Not to mention Ottawa vs Toronto lol

 

[LOFIN]

One in which he scores 39 goals and 90 pts in 78 games as a 20/21 yr old?

The negotiations didn't happen this off-season though.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Market NHL value is market NHL value and Tim Stützle at 8 years/5m is comparatively ridiculously low.

He didn’t even say “discount” in the quote, he said “fair deal” and gives a counter example of holding out for more.

Then change the title of the thread from "Stutzle said he took a discount" to "Stutzle said took a fair deal". No one is criticizing Stutzle for the contract he signed. The idea that is being argued is saying that a player only cares about winning because he took a "discount", while signing for over $8 million a year.

And just to be clear, discussing an internal cap isn’t bragging. The Devils GM has discussed quite a bit while recently signing his RFAs. Stutzle didn’t invent this idea. Boston is good example of team with internal cap.

This delicacy over guys discussing an employee who makes 8m salary is bizarre when teams are owned by multi-billionaires. The players should share more of the profits, if anything, they make the league possible.

You are literally just making up nonsense at this point. No one is talking about any of this.

The point being criticized is the thread title of "some players care more about winning than money, because Stutzle took a discount" while he still got like a $65 million contract. The idea that a player "cares more about winning than money" despite taking an $8.35 million AAV deal is laughable. Bragging about a player taking a discount when he's still making that kind of money is just a dumb thing to say.

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

The negotiations didn't happen this off-season though.

Yeah, because he signed a deal that he could have easily not signed, opting instead to bet on himself, score 40 goals & 90 pts, and then argue for $10mil +.

Anyone who watched the Sens knew that he was going to outperform his contract almost immediately, it wasn't some big surprise.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Do you think maybe..... he was responding to a question?

I'm responding to the "Some players do care about trying to win Cups more than money" title in this thread.

Stutzle said he took a fair deal instead of trying to milk out as much money as possible. The part being criticized is the title saying "he cares more about winning than money" while he still took a fair and massive contract. No one is criticizing Stutzle, the thread is being criticized.

 

[LOFIN]

Yeah, because he signed a deal that he could have easily not signed, opting instead to bet on himself, score 40 goals & 90 pts, and then argue for $10mil +.

But instead he made the safe choice and signed an 8 year 67m dollar contract the moment it was presented to him. It was not done out of the kindness of his heart.

You can't take a discount from something you are not offered. The 10mil was not on the table at that time.

 

[swiftwin]

The negotiations didn't happen this off-season though.

But they could have. His ELC expired this summer. Stutzle had no reason to sign last summer.

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

But instead he made the safe choice and signed an 8 year 67m dollar contract the moment it was presented to him. It was not done out of the kindness of his heart.

You can't take a discount from something you are not offered. The 10mil was not on the table at that time.

The pathway to $10mil + was never in reasonable doubt. Tons of players choose to take that pathway, Stützle is explaining his justification for not doing so.

 

[LOFIN]

But they could have. His ELC expired this summer. Stutzle had no reason to sign last summer.

Except that he had a 67 million dollar offer on the table. Which he took, like most people would. Players like Matthews who really want to bet on themselves to make the most are a rare breed. Most want the security when it is offered to them. Teams like Ottawa and New Jersey have been smart to use this to their advantage.

The pathway to $10mil + was never in reasonable doubt. Tons of players choose to take that pathway, Stützle is explaining his justification for not doing so.

No, they don't. Because these type of offers are not usually on the table, teams have not been willing to negotiate a deal the moment ELC player can sign it. Ottawa and NJ have done things differently, and it has paid off.

 

[swiftwin]

Except that he had a 67 million dollar offer on the table. Which he took, like most people would. Players like Matthews who really want to bet on themselves to make the most are a rare breed. Most want the security when it is offered to them. Teams like Ottawa and New Jersey have been smart to use this to their advantage.


No, they don't. Because these type of offers are not usually on the table, teams have not been willing to negotiate a deal the moment ELC player can sign it. Ottawa and NJ have done things differently, and it has paid off.

How do you know it's the team not willing, and not the players not willing?

 

[DJB]

Using that logic, why wouldn't he take something like $5 million a year? That helps the team even more than taking $8.35 million a year and that's still basically a generational amount of wealth with getting that AAV on a long term deal.

I roll my eyes when I see players say stuff like this.

If you want to use your logic then why didn’t Stutzle just take the league minimum? It’s because he’s not incompetent.

It’s entirely possible to take a reasonable discount to allow the team to have good players while still “getting yours”.

 

[Korpse]

Stutzle talks too much. I don’t see a strong argument he could have gotten much more right now than he got. Maybe 9, but not 10. Could have waited and got more likely, but lots of players prefer to lock in early, especially RFA wise.

He could very well have waited until his ELC was finished. Signed a bridge deal at 7m + AAV and then signed for 10m 2 or 3 years from now. He chose not to maximize personal wealth, that’s what he is saying.

 

[TheDoldrums]

when I was in school, there used to be a certain rumour about Marilyn Manson. I really believed it as a child and was disheartened to later learn that it wasn't true. I've been overjoyed this offseason to discover that the Senators players and their fans engage in this behaviour regularly, really brings me back.

 

[LOFIN]

How do you know it's the team not willing, and not the players not willing?

Because we almost always hear when negotiations are being done. And usually they are not after 2 years into ELCs. And even if they are, they might be for a bridge deal or something. We haven't heard of these 8 year offers where the team is betting on the future of the player, offering up substantially more than what the player has shown statistically, outside of Ottawa and New Jersey.

 

[AvroArrow]

As others have mentioned he signed his deal when he came off a 58 point season. 8M for a 58 point C isn't exactly taking a discount.

HOWEVER, the contract does look like it has aged beautifully. But yeah suggesting he took a "discount" is just rubbish, great player no doubt. I think Sens are a playoff team this year. Just don't like the narrative he's trying to push, it's like Draisaitl or Mack saying they took a discount when they signed their previous deals, like not really. You blew up after the signing.

All in all though, great deal for the Senators, who gives a shit about anything else really.

 

[Empoleon8771]

If you want to use your logic then why didn’t Stutzle just take the league minimum? It’s because he’s not incompetent.

It’s entirely possible to take a reasonable discount to allow the team to have good players while still “getting yours”.

The thing being criticized in this thread is your title of "Stutzle cares more about winning than money" when Stutzle himself said he took a fair contract. Stutzle took a fair deal rather than trying to milk the Senators for as much money as possible, but the idea that taking a fair deal means he cares more about winning than money is laughable.

If he actually cared about winning more than money, he would have taken well below a fair deal to help the Senators have as much cap space as possible to build a team around him. But he didn't do that, he was just trying to get a fair deal with the Senators and that's what they agreed on. Stutzle absolutely didn't do anything wrong there, in fact he acted a lot more team-friendly than other players in his situation have acted. But to make a crazy jump like the title of the OP is way overboard for Stutzle just wanting a fair deal.

 

[LOFIN]

He could very well have waited until his ELC was finished. Signed a bridge deal at 7m + AAV and then signed for 10m 2 or 3 years from now. He chose not to maximize personal wealth, that’s what he is saying.

That's not convincing anyone lol. How about saying the real reason you signed before your ELC ran out: you had 67 million dollars on the table, after scoring 87 points in 126 NHL games.

It's a no-brainer. You can really believe in yourself and have high confidence, but still there has to be a small thought in your brain of what if I don't progress to the next level? What if I blow my knee out and end my career in the next two months? Taking the security, is what most players in this situation do.

 

[Human]

I respect his way of thinking, but when he says that it’s hard to win with players making 10/11M per, what are you going to do with players like McD or MacK? You can’t blame them for making that money, they can’t get paid for that level of play under 10M per.

I don’t even know if the NHLPA would be cool with that.

 

[DuklaNation]

Good for him. With a good investment manager, he can make up the difference anyways.

 

[CupsOverCash]

Noice