Other Sports: Soccer/Football Thread Part Six

[PDX Flyer]

So now Haalands age 22 season is over...

he is at:

208 senior goals in 242 games.

At same age, the two highest scorers in professional football history?

Messi: 98 in 219 games.
Ronaldo: 72 in 268 games.

I remember reading that he plans on fulfilling his contract at City then moving to Madrid. It was from when he first moved to City. Is that still a common thought?

Those numbers are ridiculous

 

[Striiker]

Don't worry, you'll spend a quarter of thay money and find twice the player again, just like you have for the last 10 years.

Yeah, I’m not worried.

But I’m seeing that lot of Dortmund fans are getting irritated with the teams constant cycle of “find talent -> develop talent -> have elite talent for two years -> sell them to bigger team -> repeat”.

They want the team to care more about competing by trying to retain their talent and using more of the money they’ve made from selling guys like Sancho, Haaland, and Bellingham to bring in established players.

 

[BigToe]

Don't worry, you'll spend a quarter of thay money and find twice the player again, just like you have for the last 10 years.

Gonna need a Havertz scouting report.

 

[Appleyard]

I remember reading that he plans on fulfilling his contract at City then moving to Madrid. It was from when he first moved to City. Is that still a common thought?

Those numbers are ridiculous

I doubt he stays at City forever... but he does have very strong connections to the club at the same time.

Dad was club captain.
Lived in Manchester from age 0-3.
Always followed City (and Leeds) as a result.
Also now has several good friends at the club (Akanji, Gomez from Dortmund, Foden who he spent time with before joining, now very close with Grealish).

He has a 5 year deal though... so tbh would not be shocking for him to leave in 2027 or so when he is ~26-27 years old.

I have a feeling he probably wants to "complete" football aha. Would not shock me to see him go to Real at 26-27 and then in 30s go to Italy and get all the trophies from the historically biggest 3 leagues.

 

[PDX Flyer]

I doubt he stays at City forever... but he does have very strong connections to the club at the same time.

Dad was club captain.
Lived in Manchester from age 0-3.
Always followed City (and Leeds) as a result.
Also now has several good friends at the club (Akanji, Gomez from Dortmund, Foden who he spent time with before joining, now very close with Grealish).

He has a 5 year deal though... so tbh would not be shocking for him to leave in 2027 or so when he is ~26-27 years old.

I have a feeling he probably wants to "complete" football aha. Would not shock me to see him go to Real at 26-27 and then in 30s go to Italy and get all the trophies from the historically biggest 3 leagues.

Yeah I can’t remember the source but I feel like I read that he has aspirations to play for Madrid. Just what the rest of us need, Madrid getting Halaand entering his prime... whatever that means considering his production so far. Aha

 

[Appleyard]

Yeah I can’t remember the source but I feel like I read that he has aspirations to play for Madrid. Just what the rest of us need, Madrid getting Halaand entering his prime... whatever that means considering his production so far. Aha

I must admit if I had somehow fulfilled my childhood aspiration of playing football for a living...

Real would have been one of the clubs I would have never gone to whatever aha.

Though guess most players don't think about Franco primarily when deciding on a club lmao. Though alongside that I always disliked the kits, and thought the whole Galactico's era was lame aha.

As a result in Spain? Always preferred Barca, Athletic Bilbao and Real Betis. Until the last few years are 3 felt very "authentic".

 

[Starat327]

Gonna need a Havertz scouting report.

Hes a bum.

Kdding aside, i cant really offer anything. Hes best played behind the striker, but we dont have anyone to play him behind. He looked decent when he wasnt left on an island to figure it out. You can see the creativity is there, but his finish for the last two years has been roughly equivalent to my left foot. Im sure in the right system hed be a much better player, and hes still so so young, but i just cant see it being with us, and maybe not even in the PL. It feels like hes always just a fraction of a second late on making a decision which he had the chance to cover in the bundesliga, but doesnt here.

But hell always be a legend simply because of Porto.

 

[Appleyard]

Also, Haaland should have chose to play for England aha.

Imagine that potential 2026 WC team?

Rashford (28) - Haaland (25) - Saka (24)
Foden (26)
Bellingham (22) - Rice (27)
Lewis (21) - Stones (32) - Colwill (23) - James (26)
Ramsdale (28)

 

[Starat327]

Yeah, I’m not worried.

But I’m seeing that lot of Dortmund fans are getting irritated with the teams constant cycle of “find talent -> develop talent -> have elite talent for two years -> sell them to bigger team -> repeat”.

They want the team to care more about competing by trying to retain their talent and using more of the money they’ve made from selling guys like Sancho, Haaland, and Bellingham to bring in established players.

I get it, but the reason Dortmund get a lot of the talent they do is because they are willing to move them on when they 'outgrow' it. if that goes away, you dont necessarily get some of the talent youve had, like Haaland and Bellingham, specifically.

 

[Striiker]

I get it, but the reason Dortmund get a lot of the talent they do is because they are willing to move them on when they 'outgrow' it. if that goes away, you dont necessarily get some of the talent youve had, like Haaland and Bellingham, specifically.

Yeah, that’s how I see it as well.

Although maybe the middle ground is to spend more to upgrade the positions around those elite young players so we have a better chance to win during the short periods of time that we have them.

Plus, maybe elite players would be more willing to stick around if they saw the team as more of a contender than merely a stepping stone to somewhere better.

 

[Appleyard]

Yeah, that’s how I see it as well.

Although maybe the middle ground is to spend more to upgrade the positions around those elite young players so we have a better chance to win during the short periods of time that we have them.

Plus, maybe elite players would be more willing to stick around if they saw the team as more of a contender than merely a stepping stone to somewhere better.

Tbf, Dortmund are a top 15 team in Europe both reputation wise and financially. They have more revenue and income than both Milan teams!
But yeh, just in that "second tier" behind City, PSG, Real, Barca, Bayern, Liverpool, United, Arsenal, Chelsea in terms of finance and desirability.

But when Bayern are in your league? And there are really no other teams to take many points from Bayern year to year? Hard to ever do much other than come 2nd. As Bayern have almost twice the revenue and probably more than double the wage bill.

 

[BigToe]

Hes a bum.

Kdding aside, i cant really offer anything. Hes best played behind the striker, but we dont have anyone to play him behind. He looked decent when he wasnt left on an island to figure it out. You can see the creativity is there, but his finish for the last two years has been roughly equivalent to my left foot. Im sure in the right system hed be a much better player, and hes still so so young, but i just cant see it being with us, and maybe not even in the PL. It feels like hes always just a fraction of a second late on making a decision which he had the chance to cover in the bundesliga, but doesnt here.

But hell always be a legend simply because of Porto.

I don't even know where he'd fit here. Maybe Arteta would try to play him in the Xhaka spot, but that doesn't seem like the best fit. I'm so confused.

 

[TCTC]

I must admit if I had somehow fulfilled my childhood aspiration of playing football for a living...

Real would have been one of the clubs I would have never gone to whatever aha.

Though guess most players don't think about Franco primarily when deciding on a club lmao. Though alongside that I always disliked the kits, and thought the whole Galactico's era was lame aha.

As a result in Spain? Always preferred Barca, Athletic Bilbao and Real Betis. Until the last few years are 3 felt very "authentic".

Barca used to be the "good guys" in that rivalry, but they've become more ruthless than Madrid ever was. Treat their own players like shit if they want them gone. Cruyff must be rolling in his grave.

There simply is no bigger club to go to for any footballer than Madrid. And even if you fail there as a player, other clubs will still take you and you can still carve out a nice career. Like Robben, for example.
There's really no downside in joining Real Madrid.

 

[PDX Flyer]

I must admit if I had somehow fulfilled my childhood aspiration of playing football for a living...

Real would have been one of the clubs I would have never gone to whatever aha.

Though guess most players don't think about Franco primarily when deciding on a club lmao. Though alongside that I always disliked the kits, and thought the whole Galactico's era was lame aha.

As a result in Spain? Always preferred Barca, Athletic Bilbao and Real Betis. Until the last few years are 3 felt very "authentic".

Bilbao all day. I love how you have to have ties to the region to play for them and they have never gone down. Also my dogs ancestry is from the Basque region even though they call him an Aussie.

 

[Striiker]

But when Bayern are in your league? And there are really no other teams to take many points from Bayern year to year? Hard to ever do much other than come 2nd. As Bayern have almost twice the revenue and probably more than double the wage bill.

And they were one goal away from winning the league this year.

But no, since sports exist to cause pain and sadness.

 

[PDX Flyer]

Hes a bum.

Kdding aside, i cant really offer anything. Hes best played behind the striker, but we dont have anyone to play him behind. He looked decent when he wasnt left on an island to figure it out. You can see the creativity is there, but his finish for the last two years has been roughly equivalent to my left foot. Im sure in the right system hed be a much better player, and hes still so so young, but i just cant see it being with us, and maybe not even in the PL. It feels like hes always just a fraction of a second late on making a decision which he had the chance to cover in the bundesliga, but doesnt here.

But hell always be a legend simply because of Porto.

Jeez. Was thinking he was the Chelsea player that played at Ajax with ten Hag. Who am I thinking of?

And they were one goal away from winning the league this year.

But no, since sports exist to cause pain and sadness.

Or just play Renya more and you win the league

 

[Striiker]

Or just play Renya more and you win the league

Literally yes.

 

[Starat327]

Yeah, that’s how I see it as well.

Although maybe the middle ground is to spend more to upgrade the positions around those elite young players so we have a better chance to win during the short periods of time that we have them.

Plus, maybe elite players would be more willing to stick around if they saw the team as more of a contender than merely a stepping stone to somewhere better.

I mean this in a non banter way, but dortmund will always be second fiddle to Bayern in the Bundesliga(unless there's an off field issue, a la juventus). It's hard to get people to stay when they have a slim chance of winning the league. Almost guaranteed CL football is nice, but let's be honest, it's a slim chance that happens too.

They have a great model, and it'd be great to see them acquire talents to help push them, but I jist sont think it's in their plan. Build a competitive team, turn people over for large sums. Make loads of money. Reinvest some, but not all. Have a competitive team. Rinse. Repeat.

I don't even know where he'd fit here. Maybe Arteta would try to play him in the Xhaka spot, but that doesn't seem like the best fit. I'm so confused.

I honestly can't fathom it. Had this conversation with a friend/arsenal supporters today.

Hes not diaplacing saka jesus or martinelli. Ideally he's a CAM and I don't see where he displaces Odegaard. You need a DM so you're playing a 4 3 3 with him as a wide player. Or pushing Odegaard to a side in this scenario, and I don't think that's wise. I'm not sure in the PL havertz is a guy you re-shape your squad for.

He needs to arrive to the top of the box late to be at his best, not be the person driving play into it.

 

[Starat327]

Jeez. Was thinking he was the Chelsea player that played at Ajax with ten Hag. Who am I thinking of?


Or just play Renya more and you win the league

No, Havertz was always bundesliga. You're thinking of Ziyech. You can have him for a song at this rate, though I think he would fill the 'Eriksson' role in a Poch setup really well.

 

[Appleyard]

Bilbao all day. I love how you have to have ties to the region to play for them and they have never gone down. Also my dogs ancestry is from the Basque region even though they call him an Aussie.

I can tell you for a fact as well... having worked with them.

They are a GREAT club in terms of work in the community. Integrity, passion, actually care and put a lot of money into it without asking for rewards etc. European leaders in Child Protection as well as great work with disability.

Them, Real Betis and Levante really stand out from the Spanish clubs in that regard. Barcelona too actually.

Having spent the last 18 months (before changing job this month) working with a whole host of pro clubs around Europe has really made me change opinion on some clubs too... respect some more and some less.

 

[Striiker]

I mean this in a non banter way, but dortmund will always be second fiddle to Bayern in the Bundesliga(unless there's an off field issue, a la juventus). It's hard to get people to stay when they have a slim chance of winning the league. Almost guaranteed CL football is nice, but let's be honest, it's a slim chance that happens too.

They have a great model, and it'd be great to see them acquire talents to help push them, but I jist sont think it's in their plan. Build a competitive team, turn people over for large sums. Make loads of money. Reinvest some, but not all. Have a competitive team. Rinse. Repeat.

Yeah, I get what you're saying. And I knew all of this going in, so it's not a surprise or bothering me in any way.

I didn't start following this team because I expected them to be winning a lot of trophies or because I thought I'd be watching the worlds elite talents. I believe they were even 6th in their league at the World Cup break, which is when I started watching prior to the crazy run they went on. Instead I was drawn to them because I liked their team building philosophy of acquiring and developing young talents, while also remaining somewhat competitive, and I thought the club as a whole and the roster were really likable.

I'm fine with what they've done and what they're doing. What I said above is just the growing sentiment I'm seeing from BVB fans on social media. I don't know much about them, but the likely purchases of Alvarez from Ajax and Fresneda from Valladolid has them pretty excited, so hopefully that'll be good. More than anything I just want them to give Reyna the chance he's earned. And that's not even any kind of American bias, but instead because he made a tangible impact every damn time he played over the past 6 months and I have no idea why they're not taking advantage of that.

For example:

Spoiler: Stats

It reminds me of TK being stuck on the 4th line, which also drove me crazy.

 

[trostol]

I haven't looked in ages..but is the Scottish League still just the old firms or has some other teams managed to win something?

 

[CanadianFlyer88]

I haven't looked in ages..but is the Scottish League still just the old firms or has some other teams managed to win something?

St. Johnstone won the Scottish Cup a couple of years ago and Aberdeen had a stretch where they were the second best club in the SPL while Rangers worked their way back from administration, but it's basically been Celtic above all since the hardship with Rangers.

Rangers won the SPL a couple of years ago and the Scottish Cup last year, but Celtic has won every other SPL title since 2011.

Some others have had Cup success, but nothing consistently challenging the Old Firm.

 

[CanadianFlyer88]

@trostol, I couldn't remember, so I had to look it up. The last non-Old Firm club to win the SPL was Aberdeen in 1985.

 

[Appleyard]

I haven't looked in ages..but is the Scottish League still just the old firms or has some other teams managed to win something?

The last time anyone apart from Celtic or Rangers won the league was...

Alex Ferguson's Aberdeen side in 1985.

Tbf, no chance of that probably ever changing apart from a 5 year blip where another team wins ~2 once every 30 years. Those two clubs have fanbases that are probably ~5x the size of the 3rd, 4th and 5th biggest teams (Hearts, Hibs and Aberdeen, who are all quite even fanbase and attendance wise, and in terms of success).

Has always been the way.

The league started in 1890. Rangers won the first title, Celtic the third.

In 132 seasons?

Rangers: 55 titles
Celtic: 53 titles
Aberdeen: 4 titles (last in 1985)
Hearts: 4 titles (last in 1960)
Hibs: 4 titles (last in 1952)
Dumbarton: 2 titles (last in 1892)
Motherwell: 1 title (in 1932)
Kilmarnock: 1 title (in 1965)
Dundee: 1 title (in 1962)
Dundee United: 1 title (in 1983)
Third Lanark (defunct): 1 title (in 1904)

The closest a non-Old Firm team has been to the title this century?

Aberdeen in 2018... 9 points back... but they were never realistically in with a chance. They lost only 1 of their last 10 games in the season and 9 was as close as they got!

The last time either faced a REAL challenge?

Hearts in 1998. They were leading the league half the year and fell off in last 2 months to finish 3rd and 7 points back from title.

Before that Aberdeen were constantly close in the late 80s and early 90s.

Scottish Cup is a bit more varied. Ofc as a knock-out competition. Since 2000 Hearts and St. Johnstone have won 2x each, and Hibs, Inverness, Dundee United 1x.

Scottish League cup? Since 2000 Aberdeen, Livingston, Hibs, Kilmarnock, St. Johnstone and Ross County have won 1x each.

So? Since 2000? Of the 72 cups? Celtic and Rangers have won 59. Including all 24 league titles.