HockeyVirus
Woll stan.
- Nov 15, 2020
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So the Canucks were a product of PDO all this time? Or are they still a legitimate contender?
- Thread starter HockeyVirus
- Start date
KeithIsActuallyBad
SPEEN!
I think last year was certainly about PDO but I think they also caught a lot of teams off guard as nobody was expecting them to be as good as they were.
Another element is that until the playoffs were basically a completely healthy team. This year they don't have that luxury.
The one benefit they do have is that the Pacific division is utter garbage.
Another element is that until the playoffs were basically a completely healthy team. This year they don't have that luxury.
The one benefit they do have is that the Pacific division is utter garbage.
benfranklin
Registered User
- Jun 29, 2024
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They have too many good players to be a lottery team, but Id say the same for the Sabres.
Whatever is going on with Miller makes me nervous though.
I cant see them getting by Vegas or Edm and maybe are on par with the Kings.
Whatever is going on with Miller makes me nervous though.
I cant see them getting by Vegas or Edm and maybe are on par with the Kings.
Agent Zuuuub
Registered User
- Jan 2, 2015
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The only real hole on the Canucks roster, aside from their injury problems, is 2nd pair RHD. If they can get healthy (Miller, Demko, Hronek), Pettersen continues to look like his old self and they can address that Defensive hole, they’re a contender.
Lots of Ifs but certainly not outside the realm of possibility
Lots of Ifs but certainly not outside the realm of possibility
Caboose
Registered User
- Jan 16, 2019
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They certainly are two very different teams with Quinn on the ice and without him on the ice, but they have had significant injuries/issues with maybe 8 of their top 10 players.
Even if they were completely healthy though that back end is just not good enough to be a top contender, would need Demko and Hughes to go nuclear to have a chance.
Even yet, I wouldn't count them out as a having a punchers chance against any opponent they would come across in the playoffs, they have too many high end high potential players.
- Oct 13, 2018
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It wasn't "just" PDO, they've had very bad injury luck this year so far, and the additions they've made have made up for who they lost, but having neither of their 100pt C's healthy at the same time has hurt the Canucks, as well as losing Hronek, Joshua, and Boeser while Demko has yet to make his season debut, Silovs has also really struggled as the backup.
Their early high PDO was affected by several huge blowouts in the first few weeks of the season while not having many big losses. An 8-1 win, 5-0 win, 10-1 win all in the first 10 games.
Through 23 games, the Canucks are 13-7-3, last season through 23 games they were 15-7-1. They've earned 2 less points compared to last year.
As for "legitimate contender," most people said they weren't one last season, and many predicted they would lose to a red hot Nashville, and then get blown out by the Oilers. In my opinion, they're basically where they were last year before the Zadorov trade, a hungry young team with two 100pt C's, a top 2 defenseman in the league and a Vezina nominated goalie that needs to add a top 4 defenseman to be taken seriously. We still haven't seen this team fully healthy.
Their early high PDO was affected by several huge blowouts in the first few weeks of the season while not having many big losses. An 8-1 win, 5-0 win, 10-1 win all in the first 10 games.
Through 23 games, the Canucks are 13-7-3, last season through 23 games they were 15-7-1. They've earned 2 less points compared to last year.
As for "legitimate contender," most people said they weren't one last season, and many predicted they would lose to a red hot Nashville, and then get blown out by the Oilers. In my opinion, they're basically where they were last year before the Zadorov trade, a hungry young team with two 100pt C's, a top 2 defenseman in the league and a Vezina nominated goalie that needs to add a top 4 defenseman to be taken seriously. We still haven't seen this team fully healthy.
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Bjornar Moxnes
Registered User
The Nucks roster is better than the Sabres imho. Sabres have better Dman, but even then too many of their D are way too similiar and that creates a conflict of interest. Canucks have the better forward core and depth though. Another issue is imho Sabres have arguably some of the lowest IQ Dman in the entire league. None of Dahlin, Power, or Byram are particularly intelligent, and rely more on raw skating and physicality for their success. In contrast Hughes is one of the most intelligent players in the league, and Hronek isn't too shabby there either. Even Brannstrom is relatively smart.
syz
[1, 5, 6, 14]
- Jul 13, 2007
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Hughes puts Hronek in his backpack every night. He's elite and can carry somebody you put out with him, the rest of their D is awful imo.
Bjornar Moxnes
Registered User
PDO is a ridiculous argument. They didn't regress last year, and with a much lower PDO this year still haven't regressed. Still waiting for that big regression to happen.
They were healthy all season last year aside from Demko's injury near the end and benefitted greatly from that. This year Demko has been out all year, Boeser missed time, Miller is out, Hronek is out, Joshua was out and is still getting up to speed. Still top 10 in point % and 11th in points. 4 points behind Vegas for 1st in the division with 2 games in hand.
They are a legit cup contender.
They were healthy all season last year aside from Demko's injury near the end and benefitted greatly from that. This year Demko has been out all year, Boeser missed time, Miller is out, Hronek is out, Joshua was out and is still getting up to speed. Still top 10 in point % and 11th in points. 4 points behind Vegas for 1st in the division with 2 games in hand.
They are a legit cup contender.
syz
[1, 5, 6, 14]
- Jul 13, 2007
- 30,626
- 16,257
Their PDO has regressed but they've improved to the middle of the pack in most other categories to compensate as opposed to being near the bottom like they were last year. Still not a contender though imo.
Sykur
Registered User
- Apr 11, 2011
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The Canucks last year were a product of health and luck. That was what they look like when they don't lose half the season due to injuries to key players. Don't take this as an excuse -- every team must go through injuries, its a fact of life and hockey. No team plays every game in perfect health. But it is a good explanation why the Canucks did so well last year, when historically they have been among the most injury-ladened teams in the entire league. They were dead last in man games lost to injuries in the 2010s.
This year they started with key players already out of the lineup (and others succumbed to freak injuries in training camp). They've had 3 out of their top 6 core players out for chunks of the early season (at one point 4 out of 6 were out -- only Hughes and Pettersson have played every game this year). They're chugging along without their top goaltender or top scorer. Guys like Garland, Suter, and DeBrusk have stepped up into key roles normally played by Boeser or Miller.
It's a blessing that they are where they are right now, but they could easily be doing much better if the entire team was healthy. Things could also be much worse.
This year they started with key players already out of the lineup (and others succumbed to freak injuries in training camp). They've had 3 out of their top 6 core players out for chunks of the early season (at one point 4 out of 6 were out -- only Hughes and Pettersson have played every game this year). They're chugging along without their top goaltender or top scorer. Guys like Garland, Suter, and DeBrusk have stepped up into key roles normally played by Boeser or Miller.
It's a blessing that they are where they are right now, but they could easily be doing much better if the entire team was healthy. Things could also be much worse.
Menzinger
Kessel4LadyByng
Every year a fanbase tries to argue that pdo isn't a real thing, and then come back down to earth the next year like clockwork.
To this point, they've missed:
Demko for the full season
Miller for 6 games (and counting)
Boeser for 7 games
Joshua for 14 games
Hronek for 2 games (and counting)
Forbort for 19 games (and counting)
in addition to missed games by others including Suter, Desharnais, etc, all while Pettersson has been less than 100%. What do you expect?
Demko for the full season
Miller for 6 games (and counting)
Boeser for 7 games
Joshua for 14 games
Hronek for 2 games (and counting)
Forbort for 19 games (and counting)
in addition to missed games by others including Suter, Desharnais, etc, all while Pettersson has been less than 100%. What do you expect?
- Oct 9, 2012
- 32,906
- 31,838
No, they are not a contender. Very few teams are actually contenders. Vancouver is a middling playoff team. They can win a round or two but expectations are that they are not a team that can make it to the finals and contend for a cup.
Fatass
Registered User
- Apr 17, 2017
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Hughes is putting up a Hart caliber season essentially willing this team into multiple victories leading the team in points alongside Lankinen who’s been excellent in the absence of Demko.
Right now Canucks defense with Hronek out is Hughes and then……. Soucy, Myers, Desharnais, Brannstrom, and Juulsen. Literally 6/7/8 dman. The drop off is massive.
We can ignore playoffs unless the defense troubles are solved.
Right now Canucks defense with Hronek out is Hughes and then……. Soucy, Myers, Desharnais, Brannstrom, and Juulsen. Literally 6/7/8 dman. The drop off is massive.
We can ignore playoffs unless the defense troubles are solved.
Tralfamadore
Don't Panic.
- Sep 25, 2011
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They've gotten by this season without Demko all season. Boeser missed 7 games before returning from a concussion. Been without Miller for around that long as well now for personal reasons.
Excellent road record to offset being meh at home.
Hronek is potentially needing surgery, so that may put the brakes on the GM doing anything until he knows the concrete timeline.
Canucks have a good enough top end of 5-7 players (Hughes, Hronek, Demko, Miller, Pettersson, to Boeser) to compete. It's the next tier of guys in the 8-12 range that they could use a boost in, especially that 3rd Dman spot, but they don't have the assets to really do much. Shot their shot last season with Lindholm and he's gone (too high a price to keep relative to production).
Benning blowing assets left cupboard limited. So, have to make due.
As has been stated already, what 'came back down to earth?' Two more overtime losses than last year is the only difference in their record. Yet the injuries this year are significant compared to last year. Demko was a contender for the Vezina until he went down last year. Lankinen has been a revelation, but does anyone have him in their top 5 vezina nominees right now?
Canucks are doing pretty much exactly what they did last year. The difference is the rest of the pacific isn't sucking ass as much as they did last year.
Fatass
Registered User
- Apr 17, 2017
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RandV
It's a wolf v2.0
Did you miss the post that they're 2 points behind last season this far in, and that's with loads of injuries?
Last year was the first time I was exposed to "pdo" and I found the whole experience to be just one of the dumbest things. Combining two basic stats to try to make something appear more meaningful than it actually is, its use rife with gamblers fallacy and in the Canucks example were singled out due to statistical noise.
- Oct 9, 2012
- 32,906
- 31,838
Two games in hand on Vegas and 4 points back of leading the Pacific. If that’s coming back down to earth while missing a plethora of key players, 32/32 teams will take it.
I’ve been impressed how they’ve managed to win many games where it’s questionable whether they’re the better team due to strict adherence to a suffocating system that they play on the road. At home they still play too fancy and are 3-4-3.
Lankinen is 12-4 and .907. So maybe a small step down from Demko but not like they have Avs, Oilers, Vegas level goaltending. To have him and Demko healthy at the same time will huge. Not to mention Hughes is a Hart trophy candidate. They have one of the best bottom 6F in the league but one of the worst bottom 4D. Injuries have been significant.
All that to say they are a 2nd tier contender when healthy. 1st tier being teams like Edm and Vegas.
I don’t see them doing much without Miller, but if he comes back, has something to prove, and the team figures out how to play at home, then look out.
Lankinen is 12-4 and .907. So maybe a small step down from Demko but not like they have Avs, Oilers, Vegas level goaltending. To have him and Demko healthy at the same time will huge. Not to mention Hughes is a Hart trophy candidate. They have one of the best bottom 6F in the league but one of the worst bottom 4D. Injuries have been significant.
All that to say they are a 2nd tier contender when healthy. 1st tier being teams like Edm and Vegas.
I don’t see them doing much without Miller, but if he comes back, has something to prove, and the team figures out how to play at home, then look out.
