Holy moly, what an all-time shit fight you guys have going on. Ah well, against my better judgment, I'll wade in...
if the Sharks didn't win the draft lottery, would you think differently? If the Sharks are the worst team in the league again, did he still do a great job his first two years in the job?
I hope we're the worst team in the league again this year, we aren't / shouldn't be done drafting high. But I hope we're at least more competitive.
Your core argument is "Grier just tore down, that's easy, he shouldn't get credit." I think it's fair to say that Grier has done things that many other GM's have done in the past. He's not rewriting history. He is, however, executing a textbook
teardown (edit). I don't see why you can't give him credit for that -- take a look instead at whatever it is Calgary, Ottawa, Columbus, etc. are doing. Grier's decisions have been consistent, and they have had a clear vision. Every move has rationale, even if people criticize him for not maximizing value of every transaction. The big thing is, he got them all done -- he moved a ton of aging, NMC/NTC contracts and got assets and cap space. No, he hasn't done much with the cap space yet, but we also have a horde of young guys who will need to get paid in 3 years so he also doesn't have to spend it all THIS YEAR to be setting the franchise up for a good future.
And no, it's not just about winning the draft. That was awesome. It helped accelerate our rebuild by let's say 3 years and gave it a much higher chance of success. However even if we picked 2-5 we'd still have a top 5 prospect pool and would at least be heading in the right direction on a rebuild and not stuck in the mud. Picking high helps a lot, but he has also picked pretty smartly with the picks after Celebrini and Smith.
I agree with you, by the way, that the Eichel outcome for Buffalo was unlucky and made their "rebuild" look worse. If you don't get lucky, your path is harder.
If they didn't get a core piece for trading Karlsson coming off one of the greatest scoring seasons in the history of the league, I would be saying negative things about Grier instead of just saying the jury is still out.
This is a pretty good response, except for the most toxic contract in the league part. That's just insane to say and I could give you 10 contracts that are worse. But I would like to add that Karlsson was playing with an awful team around him and that surrounding him with complementary players could reduce his defensive impact. So it's not like GMs just looked at advanced stats and said, we can't bring this guy in because he's too much of a defensive liability. If that was the case a team like the Penguins wouldn't have traded for him
I have to say that while maybe he could have gotten more for Karlsson (I don't think so), I will respectfully disagree with you that his contract was viewed as positive value. Here are 3 years of "worst contract in the NHL":
- 2020, Honorable Mention
- 2022, #7
- EDIT: here's a diff one for 2021
- 2023, he's not mentioned, so the contract wasn't as bad, after his big year, but he was doing nothing for the Sharks and it was only going to look worse. Grier sold "high" and so what if he didn't get more out of the Pens? In retrospect, I wouldn't want a prospect and the pick eventually became Sam Dickinson, which I'm very happy with and also showed shrewd draft tactics by Grier and his scouting team.
- EDIT 2: hell, even this 2024 has him as PIT's honorable mention
tl;dr I agree with you that the jury is still out on Grier as a team builder. However, I think he gets a clean A grade for the textbook teardown (again, not making history, but good execution) and he has done well on drafting and trades, on balance, especially for this upcoming season. We'll see if, over the next 3 years, he can build a team around some core pieces, and if the luck continues with development outcomes etc.